HVX200 protoype at RESfest Los Angeles

evinsky said:
I don't mind a little noise so +3 Db will be no problem for me.
Click to expand...
You know your stuff evinsky and I have learned a lot from you, but I'm pretty sure you would need to gain up a little more than + 3 Db to compensate for 35mm adapter use. Tho, maybe it's not as much of a concern as I think it is... The low-noise of the HVX sounds incredible. They should sell a ton of them for newsgathering if it's comparable to a larger camera, as has been indicated. Imagine the photojournalism opportunities opening up when everything fits inside a backpack, including a weeks' worth of batteries and permanent storage...
 
Sorry, I didn't mean to give the impression that +3Db woulld compensate for a 35 mm adapter. I just meant that in normal shooting the gain up would render images with the noise charachteristics I'm used to on the DVX so it would essentially be the same sensitivities. A 35mm adapter would probably loose 1-1 1/2 stops requireing +6 or +9 Db gain up. Or 1/24th shutter speed.
 
NBCshooter said:
On the other hand, the pluses about going with the 2/3" camera still holds very, very true. By going with the HVX200, I WON'T have that cool shallow depth of field as I would have had with the DSR450. And I WON'T have that terrific f/11 @ 2000 lux sensitivity characteristic of modern 2/3" cameras. I will definitely need MORE light for the HVX200 since from my observation, it is at LEAST one full stop less sensitive than the DVX100B I saw sitting right next to it. These are huge considerations, especially the sensitivity issue. But in the final analysis, I guess, the pros of the HVX200 outweigh my needs for these two qualities (which are real hard to give up).
Click to expand...

Maybe you should wait for the 2/3 inch HD camera from Panasonic? :evil: Sounds like it's not too much more than the DSR450, and it's less than a year away.
 
NBCshooter said:
Nahhh . . . it'll probably be something like $25K PLUS glass!
Click to expand...

It's always annoying when you hear a camera is going to cost around $20,000 which I still might be able to afford only to find that the lens will put the thing out of my price range. How much does an HD lens cost normally? A 2/3 CCD HD camera for under $30,000 would be sweet.
 
NBCshooter said:
• Transfer of data (NOT streaming while recording) from the HVX200's Firewire port would be possible to a standard, off-the-shelf Firewire HDD.
Click to expand...

Now, THAT'S new - isn't it? I must have missed something, because I have never heard that before. There has been some spotty indication that you could connect devices other than the P2 Store to the camera, and have them talk - possibly through the USB2 port? But I have not heard Jan talk about "standard, off-the-shelf Firewire HDD's".

For me, the inability to do 60-minute takes is not very important. I do training videos and narrative films, not event photography. The standard take is anywhere from 30 seconds to perhaps several minutes.

We all know that for event photographers, it's Firestore or nothing. But for short-take production, the workflow thusfar has been to bring a laptop with a P2-compatable cardbus slot, and enough hard drive space to hold the day's footage. When the P2 card is full, transfer through the laptop.

Are they now saying that we can take the laptop out of the equation? I don't suspect that the Firewire port will provide power to an external drive (it will probably be 4-pin), nor through the USB2 connection. That will mean a self-powered HDD. Besides the Firestore and it's kind, are there any inexpensive battery-powered Firewire enclosures? something I could slap a 300GB Maxtor in, perhaps, and keep connected to the camera all day?

This would be just like having a Firestore, except that you'd dump the P2 card every 16 minutes of footage, instead of streaming live. If you could do that right from a menu item in-camera, it would be a pretty easy workflow.

Am I thinking about this correctly, or is something getting lost in translation?
 
AZScott said:
Now, THAT'S new - isn't it? I must have missed something, because I have never heard that before. There has been some spotty indication that you could connect devices other than the P2 Store to the camera, and have them talk - possibly through the USB2 port? But I have not heard Jan talk about "standard, off-the-shelf Firewire HDD's".

For me, the inability to do 60-minute takes is not very important. I do training videos and narrative films, not event photography. The standard take is anywhere from 30 seconds to perhaps several minutes.

We all know that for event photographers, it's Firestore or nothing. But for short-take production, the workflow thusfar has been to bring a laptop with a P2-compatable cardbus slot, and enough hard drive space to hold the day's footage. When the P2 card is full, transfer through the laptop.

Are they now saying that we can take the laptop out of the equation? I don't suspect that the Firewire port will provide power to an external drive (it will probably be 4-pin), nor through the USB2 connection. That will mean a self-powered HDD. Besides the Firestore and it's kind, are there any inexpensive battery-powered Firewire enclosures? something I could slap a 300GB Maxtor in, perhaps, and keep connected to the camera all day?

This would be just like having a Firestore, except that you'd dump the P2 card every 16 minutes of footage, instead of streaming live. If you could do that right from a menu item in-camera, it would be a pretty easy workflow.

Am I thinking about this correctly, or is something getting lost in translation?
Click to expand...

I caught that too. I do not think that you can plug into any off-the-shelf firewire drive and record the stream. I'm pretty sure that the Firestore has all the drivers and such to get the job done,but that it won't work with any old drive. That's right isn't it?
 
AZScott said:
Now, THAT'S new - isn't it? I must have missed something, because I have never heard that before.
Click to expand...
Yes and no. It's new to firewire, but it's not a new concept. We'd been told that you could offload footage directly to a USB2 drive; it looks like offloading will actually be to Firewire drives instead. Which is actually compatible with the original very first announcement at the Apple event at NAB, where they said 1394 supported both AVC and SBP2 protocol (SBP2 is what lets it write to a hard drive).

But I have not heard Jan talk about "standard, off-the-shelf Firewire HDD's".
Click to expand...
Again, it's not for streaming, it's for file transfer. And yes, the new thing here is that we're talking about it going to firewire drives instead of to USB2 drives.

Are they now saying that we can take the laptop out of the equation? ...
This would be just like having a Firestore, except that you'd dump the P2 card every 16 minutes of footage, instead of streaming live. If you could do that right from a menu item in-camera, it would be a pretty easy workflow.

Am I thinking about this correctly, or is something getting lost in translation?
Click to expand...
You are thinking about it correctly. Yes that's exactly what we're talking about -- when the cards are full, just plug in a firewire drive and offload the data. No laptop necessary.
 
David G. Smith said:
I caught that too. I do not think that you can plug into any off-the-shelf firewire drive and record the stream. I'm pretty sure that the Firestore has all the drivers and such to get the job done,but that it won't work with any old drive. That's right isn't it?
Click to expand...
Yes, as far as streaming goes (meaning, capturing as the camera is recording). What we're discussing is recording to P2, and then copying the contents of the P2 cards onto a firewire drive. That process will work with an off-the-shelf firewire drive.
 
Barry_Green said:
Yes, as far as streaming goes (meaning, capturing as the camera is recording). What we're discussing is recording to P2, and then copying the contents of the P2 cards onto a firewire drive. That process will work with an off-the-shelf firewire drive.
Click to expand...

Duoh!!!

I forgot about that, I believe it's in one of the original articles. The more I hear about this camera, the more I am impressed. The straight IT work flow, while new and not without issues, is very exciting.
 
Barry_Green said:
Yes, as far as streaming goes (meaning, capturing as the camera is recording). What we're discussing is recording to P2, and then copying the contents of the P2 cards onto a firewire drive. That process will work with an off-the-shelf firewire drive.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I'm going to do when I get an HVX for narrative filmmaking. I don't need a Firestore, and I don't need a laptop. I don't even need to take the P2 card out of the camera.

HVX200 camera only for around $5800
One 4GB P2 card for around $1000 (possibly less)
One off the shelf 250GB Firewire HDD for around $200 (cheaper if I use an enclosure and internal drives which can swap out)
TOTAL= Approx $7000

With this setup, I can record 4 minutes of 1080/24p, and while changing camera setups, just plug in the Firewire HDD and dump the footage directly from the camera to the Hard Disk. No laptop, no lost P2 card (because it never leaves the camera), no dropouts, and no time spent digitizing the footage later on. 1080/24p 4:2:2 DVCProHD for $7000. Heaven.
 
One flaw in your plan -- I don't think you'll find a 4gb card for $1000.

Might find it for $800 or $700 though... ;)

(dangit -- where's that winkie smiley?)
 
thisiswells said:
Yeah... he can take another $300 off the price of the camera, too! :laugh:
Click to expand...

Dang fellas, by the time it gets here, they will be paying you get one.

Where is that Winkie?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top