HVX noise
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Chris Santucci
Veteran
Watch any feature film in the theater which has originated on negative film and keep your eyes on the mids. You will undoubtedly notice that the release prints are swimming with grain despite today's ultra-fine tabular 500 and 200 ASA stocks.
Now look at the HVX in the mids (right-click, save as). I've found that -5 to -7 on the master pedestal mimics 500 speed film grain nicely. Not grain, but noise. I've never had a filmout client turn away the HVX due to noise. Then, there's the HPX, which exhibits even less noise.
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Now look at the HVX in the mids (right-click, save as). I've found that -5 to -7 on the master pedestal mimics 500 speed film grain nicely. Not grain, but noise. I've never had a filmout client turn away the HVX due to noise. Then, there's the HPX, which exhibits even less noise.
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Barry_Green
Moderator
Exactly.
It is not noiseless, but then again neither's film.
It is not noiseless, but then again neither's film.
HV20 Noise and EX1 Noise
HV20 Noise and EX1 Noise
Thats the point of the canon/sony fan bois who post single posts here about the noise in hope that people see large numbers of posts about noise and the hvx when they do a google search and assume it is true.
The HVX has less noise and more color depth than any HDV camera. And no compression blocking like the HV20 or EX1. Cramming HDV into 50bps is half the possible information of the HVX's 100bps.
HDV cameras are wonderful if you have a web delivery since you can hide the HV20 or EX1's HDV noise in the DIVX web compression.
HV20 Noise and EX1 Noise
Thats the point of the canon/sony fan bois who post single posts here about the noise in hope that people see large numbers of posts about noise and the hvx when they do a google search and assume it is true.
The HVX has less noise and more color depth than any HDV camera. And no compression blocking like the HV20 or EX1. Cramming HDV into 50bps is half the possible information of the HVX's 100bps.
HDV cameras are wonderful if you have a web delivery since you can hide the HV20 or EX1's HDV noise in the DIVX web compression.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Well, that part's not true -- the FX1/Z1 have a lot less noise than the HVX does. The HVX is about the same noise level as the rest of the HDV cams, but the Sonys are noticeably cleaner.
No long-GOP compression blocking, that's true. It can happen on HDV, it remains to be seen whether it happens on the EX1 or not.
HDV is 25mbps, not 50. It's 1/4 the data rate of the HVX. But the bandwidth is used differently -- sometimes HDV looks fantastic. Sometimes it falls apart. You can't just make an arbitrary judgement based on the bandwidth (100 vs. 25) because they're not used the same way.
Barry_Green
Moderator
It's possible to get some mosquito noise in 720, but you should find that it basically disappears in 1080.
ulisses
Well-known member
I thought that was my impression, any tech reason for 720 noise worst that 1080 ?
Thanks Barry,
Ulisses
Barry_Green
Moderator
There is no 1080/60p.
1080/60i and 1080/30p should have identical noise levels. It may seem that 30p has more, but it shouldn't have. Perhaps it's just that 60i updates the frame twice as fast, and so the noise moves around faster, thus making it less noticeable?
1080/60i and 1080/30p should have identical noise levels. It may seem that 30p has more, but it shouldn't have. Perhaps it's just that 60i updates the frame twice as fast, and so the noise moves around faster, thus making it less noticeable?
ulisses
Well-known member
After some Barry advices, I tested gamma B. Press and matrix Normal, nice settings to avoid noise. Barry is right again, 1080 has a lot less mosquito noise than 720.
In HVX200, progressive modes generate more noise than interlaced, maybe is the internal frequency change to get progressive that is generating noise
Uli
In HVX200, progressive modes generate more noise than interlaced, maybe is the internal frequency change to get progressive that is generating noise
Uli
ulisses
Well-known member
details at -7 looks so soft in my opinion, yesterday I just saw some EX1 footage with low light and noise level is a lot better than HVX, although the footage looked more like standard video (probably was shot at default cam setup).
Looking HVX footage in a HD monitor, the noise is too big my opinion. I'm curious to see a HVX footage in the big screen.
Ulisses
Looking HVX footage in a HD monitor, the noise is too big my opinion. I'm curious to see a HVX footage in the big screen.
Ulisses
Ted Spencer
Veteran
Go see "Cloverfield". The opening party scene (as well as many other interiors and non-CGI scenes) was mostly shot on an HVX200. I saw it myself on a *very* large screen here in NYC, sitting pretty darn close, and it looked excellent. That put my fears of HVX filmout "issues" to rest permanently, at least aside from what 35mm adapters might take away resolution-wise.
Be prepared for a potentially nauseating "ShakyCam" experience with the film otherwise though. If it hadn't been for my rapt curiosity about the HVX's contribution (not to mention the $11.75 I spent) I would have left far earlier.
I *hate* ShakyCam...
Barry_Green
Moderator
And keep in mind, Cloverfield wasn't exactly optimized for ultimate quality either. I've seen HVX footage on the big screen look a lot better than that.