How to handle a client unfamiliar with GH1 avchd footage?

What a nightmare...

I can't believe I thought I could do a run & gun with the gh1....

I have done some beautiful 1080 24p stuff with preparation with the gh1, but this was a fashion shoot, fast paced, pushed around..pure insanity... no time for setups.. and I have to say i failed spectacularly and so did the camera... it's a ugly mess and I want to shoot myself in the head right now. Plus for whatever reason the colors looked awful and green tinted or something. the skin tones are grosss. alien... I don't know why I have seen that on some others vids but it never haoppend to me before - I always shot 1080p - smooth.. is it a 720 60p thing?... I had trusted the awb before but this.. this.. I can't believe it's the same camera... I was trying to adjust as fast as I can for crazy varied lighting conditions and NO space to follow the talent without being knocked around by 10,000 other photographers and cameramen... I have done things like this a million times before with the dvx100 and didn't think it would be a big deal... ehhh so it;'s a dslr I'll just be careful and keep it wide most of the time... but I am hating myself right now. I really underestimated how bad hand held is with this thing in a rushed environment...

I mean I knew it... but i thought I could do it....

Uck...

and I didn't know the mjpeg was 720p I though it was some smaller size... I hadn't even considered it and it was too late. I'd say out of an hour of footage if I can pull together 2 minutes of pretty shots it'd be a miracle.. it;s all junk waiting to get a frame... that;'s what I hate about giving clients raw footage... but I had become pretty proficient at it with other cams, but I didn;t have any rigged out gear.. just the camera and figured I'd go for it.

Oh well.. one must break some eggs to make an omelet... but I broke the whole carton and the frying pan and then the stove blew up and the curtains caught on fire and the house is burnt down.

I think I am going to have to pull some magic free edit out of my ass or refund money.. I'm that unhappy with the raw footage.
 
Blackout, you've just experienced why I keep saying -- these cameras are NOT replacements for proper video cameras. There are some jobs they simply are not suited for. And why I will not trust a paying job to a product that's not designed for the job.
 
Yup. You are absolutely correct. I've heard every one say it but I thought I could use my magic razzle dazzle and be the exception. Boy did I learn the hard way. I am restricting myself to only using the GH1 on carefully constructed & prepped shoots. Never again will I do this with this camera. Not to entirely blame the camera... I wasn't as familiar and fast with it as I needed to be either. In my defense I wasn't really prepped as to what I was I was going to be shooting or I probably would have given it a lot more thought and turned the gig down or used a different camera.. The way it was explained to me, I was just going to be getting some beauty shots of a model / singer being pretty at a tent in a single position...and then some b-roll of the environment. Like what you would see when each actor stops for pics at the academy awards or ect. So I figured.. no big deal.. easy enough. But what it turned out to be was a high profile fashion show with more paparazzi, handlers, squakers, pokers, fighters, and running nutcases from space to space for a 3 second pose then run run run somewhere else, and I couldn't get frames and I couldn't avoid total mess. I have done stuff like this in Miami but this was my first time in a NYC crazy celeb war like setting. It was total war with about 200 if not more photographers there. One guy I think saw my plight and said to me, "you're using the GH1 for this? Man you're brave." What he really ment was of course 'man you're stupid.'. Blech I'll stick to film making anyday.. people who make their living doing this sort of stuff are a different sort of bird. I did see a lot of 7Ds there and 5Ds but they were rigged out in crazy zacuto gear.

It was a bad call on my part and limited information to make the call, and now I am trying to figure out the best damage control.

I am thinking of just trying my hardest to convince the client that the process to convert the footage is insanely hard or expensive or time consuming...or all three, or that aliens will come down and destroy their computer if they do, better to just let me handle it... and see if I can't salvage a 2 1/2 minute edit for them myself for free without them seeing the raw footage. It may be possible. Oh god I do NOT want them to see the raw footage. Praise holy satan lord of evil may they not be searching for how to do it right now. They have it. I dumped it and they took off in their helicopter.

So I guess my next question is the best way to edit the avchd 720p on a PC. I have only been doing 1080p stuff and removing pulldown with neoscene and have had beautiful results doing some narrative stuff.

This.. whatever it is, it doesn't look like film, it doesn't look like video, it looks like I don't know...
I got in some bad lighting situations so I slowed the shutter down a few times to 30, 15, even 10 in some dark rooms to boost light and get that 'strobe party' look and maybe some of that is usable... but how do I mix that correctly or can I... again not sure.

The only part that looks good is the runway part where I had time to get a frame, stabalize myself and there was good lighting and that was shutter at 60 and iso 100 or 200 and that looks fine and great.. but big deal that's just little pieces to edit in.. the focus is on this girl BEING at this fashion show, not the show itself... and it was very difficult to get any good shots of her because of her handlers and other bullcrap that was going on. I have a lot of back of her head running behind her and body guards crap.. which again is fine for a little bit of that "oh rushed crazy celeb" feeling.... I can work some of that in.. but I am really lacking in any 'money shots' of her just looking good with people taking her pictures ect.. I have a couple, but they end quickly when some jackass smashes into me every two seconds so it's shakey cam city for the most part. Also a lot of areas had really bad lighting so I had to pump up the iso and it ain't pretty. So I am thinking maybe a lot of slomo on what good shots I do have? And make the ugly rushed stuff seem very purposeful. I don't even know how to correctly combine 60p normal and then slowmo on a timeline I am wondering if I drop everything into a 24p timeline how to I get that slomo look out of certain shots? Do I have to drop everything in a 60p timeline to do that? I haven't really done the combing before. Again I know there are other threads on this but if you have ever had something like this happen to you I would like to hear some ideas on damage control and workflow to try and save this nightmare. I usually edit in Premiere CS4 or Vegas. The point of the piece is supposed to be, "oh look at this girl she's famous with all the famous people being famous" and it supposed to air overseas somewhere (yet still ntsc not pal) and her youtube channel. Think I can make the youtube happen. very very worried about broadcasting this kahkah.
 
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In a totally unrelated side note I was invited to a midnight screening of "The Dark Crystal" immediately after my fashion show nightmare. It was a new cleaned up film print on a nice huge screen. It was awesome. Jim Henson & Frank Oz magic. I saw it as a little wee kid and it scared the hell out of me and I have seen it many times since on DVD but it was great to see it again on a big screen as an adult. It's made for the big screen. So much symbolism in that movie it's fantastic for its art even if it's a bit slow and hokey at certain parts. After that I came home and viewed my GH1 footage and cried.

We hope you enjoyed that short Dark Crystal review, and we now return to my nightmare in progress...apparently my footage is about as ugly as the skeksis. :Drogar-Mark-10(DBG)
 
Sorry to hear about your troubles. Just as Barry says - GH1 is not a pro-camera to just shoot and deliver with, it wasn't made for that. One needs to deal with the footage before handing it over - or better yet be the one who does the post on it. Two quick notes based on what you describe.

First off, I never trust auto white balance on any camera. It's generally better to set a fixed average balance based on what the base lighting is in the venue and then fine adjust in post. Especially doing run'n'gun in a fashion event - too many bright and / or saturated colours everywhere changing quickly to throw a AWB to very strange and inconsistant settings.
Secondly, all is not lost yet. I've often seen the comment that GH1 footage can't be colour corrected at all and that's not true. What's hard to fix are exposure level and contrast beyond more than half a step up/down. When dealing with colour balance you'll have a bit more range. I find that with a careful use of Colour Balance (with preserve luminance on), Hue/Saturation and Curves in After Effects quite a bit can be changed. I think it's the same in other editors as well, just make sure to be in a bigger colour space than 4:2:0 8 bit when working on it. On my commercial I bungled up a setup quite considerably but could save it. We were shooting indoors when a opportunity came to use a outdoor setting and when rushing out to do it I forgot to switch to daylight balance which yielded a rather unflattering blue tainted image out of the camera. See the attached pictures. Hope you can sort enough material so the client is ok with the result.

(Nice to hear about the new print of Dark Crystal, I also love that film despite it's numerous flaws.)
 

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Dam dude sorry to hear. I can feel your pain, i remember last year trying to film a 10 min TRT documentary in a boxing gym with only a few hours and having tons of problems. I did manage to at least get some pretty nice looking footage (had hell with the nasty lights in the gym, and loosing daylight fast on the interviews which were done outside since inside the gym was to noisy). That gig wasnt paid though, i was the only one shooting there, and i didnt have problems as bad as you.

Not sure why you would play with the shutterspeed so much, i would tink that lowering it (isntead of raising the iso), would make the footage look janky especially if it was shooting moving objects/models.

I havent used the GH1, i have a 7d myself, but i think you would have been better off with one of those. I also am REALLY surprised you tried to shoot anything hand held. I would have brought at least my $15 DIY rig that i made (even if i did get laughed at next to the zacuto stuff)

Live and learn. I'm more of a hobbiest, i dont care about getting paid at this point and if i do, it will likely be for a film.

the scenario you described sounds scary, but when you finish the edit, post it up, id like to see it.
 
Upping the iso and lowering shutter speed is probably the last desperate chance for me in such a low lighting situation. It would cause too much blur and noise. My first choice would be in lowering the aperture get in more light. What kind of lens did you use and I hope to god you didn't just go in with the kit lens. Not the best lens for such uncontrolled conditions.
 
The aperture was wide open most of the time. I was on the kit lens and the only decent lighting was for the runway section. Everything else sucked. Again, the reason I bunked it so terribly is that I thought it was just going to be one hot chic under hot lights in one spot... as you can see from my first post my real only concern at the time was just how they would handle the footage... now I"m glad they can't see it easily!
 
kit lens? :(

Do you not have a better faster lens?

I would have least rocked a tamron 17-50mm 2.8, if not just stick on a fast prime (nifty 50) and move around a lot for such low lighting.

Sounds like a logistical nightmare.
 
Oh, the kit lens aperture is only at 4 and like jonE5 said, you should have used some faster lens. This kit len's lowest aperture is already bad for low lighting and especially when you zoom out the aperture is highered, darkening the image even more.
 
Sounds like you could have been better prepared but hey chalk it up to experience. Now you'll know what to do and not do next time.
 
Blackout said:
So I guess my next question is the best way to edit the avchd 720p on a PC. I have only been doing 1080p stuff and removing pulldown with neoscene and have had beautiful results doing some narrative stuff.
Click to expand...

I've imported and played, at least in Premiere, all three of 1080 24p as 60i, AVCHD 720 60p and MJPEG 720 60p. All three 'load' into the time line and depending on the sequence setup. I also use Final Cut Express + JES to do the 3:2 pulldown.

Since you apparently have not handed over the material to the client, I'd go through and make do as much, as quickly as possible to 'fix' things.

Auto White Balance is sort of like Auto ISO and Auto Audio Gain... good for happy shots, where only the family will come down on you like a ton of bricks for the rest of your natural life... but typically not good for clients.

I've not used the GH1 in these sorts of situations, but if there is no 'easy' way to select from daylight to tungsten, to florescent, or manual set color temp, I would not use such a camera in the 'dynamic' environment you seem to have gotten yourself into...

Absent that, I'd go in an see what white balance correction could be done now in post production via some Premiere filter...

As for live event coverage, don't know how much of that you've done, but in the distant past my first experience of 'news' coverage was for a college paper, and my first assignment was to cover Ralph Nader's appearence at the college... all I got was the back of his head... the object lesson was, unless its an earth quake... so who plans for that... one has to get an absolute knowledge of what's going to happen, when, where, to be 'in front' of the subject of your coverage... as well as deal with handlers, fans (in my case I didn't want to be 'pushy' around those wanting his autograph... well, be pushy, be an asshole*), and whatever else comes along...

*Back in the olden days Nikons were heavy enough that they would hurt, and not be damaged by minor 'oops I took off your face with my camera' motions. Basketball players also do an elbow to the face move that is quite effective in unruly crowds.

The GH1 is not a heavy duty camera, so I'd recommend elbow work.

That of course is if people are not polite enough to let you get your shot...

Now that I think of it... the GH1 doesn't 'look' like a pro camera... so get one of those shoulder rigs, give it some 'meat' and may be that will be the ticket for the masses parting for you, the pro shooter on the scene...
 
Yeah you've simply got to have good stabilization of some kind if you are going to do this kind of project with a GH1 - the GH1 can handle this sort of thing but not without a proper rig and more than likely a couple of good fast primes...but of course, you know that now - sorry to hear about that man - it does suck though that you didn't have a good idea of what the shooting conditions were really going to be like, but then, I would have to say that no matter what, if you're doing client work, you should always bring *some* kind of stabilization and a fast lens with you so that if things don't go as you figured, you have options for some good shots - but then again, you know all of this now. Just sorry to hear about what sounds like a terrible experience - I know that feeling of panic during the process and the feeling of just outright failure almost when you don't have the right gear for the shoot - it totally sucks - on the bright side, I think nearly anyone who does this sort of thing has had an experience like yours, it's okay, it happens, what matters is that you learn from it and don't make the same mistake again - we ALL have horror stories.
 
Say what you want about the kit lens, yes it's slow at f4 but it's the only lens that will consistently and accurately auto focus on the GH1 without hunting. And if you're trying to capture unscripted action from an unscripted position, having auto focus is definitely useful.
 
This is what I thought too noirist about the kit lens.... I am getting the pancake lens and a prime, but didn't have the cash yet (I invested most in new computer and sound gear). Again this gig was a lark I got called out of the blue. We did click though and I clicked well with her 'people' THEY do have the footage, that is what I am upset about...

To everyone who said I could have better prepared... I really wasn't briefed much and I am a sort of 'jump in if an opportunity presents itself' guy. I'm an actor believe it or not who got into tech work and people liked what I did so I have been able to float the boat in NYC doing both. My ultimate goal is to be a Billy Bob Thorton type and write / act / direct my own features. It takes longer because you have to split your attention between mastering many different things, but ultimately I love it.

but.. but.. I digress. Thank you to the massive response on here, why I love the dvx boards community so much. I am calming down a bit... I went into emergency research mode and found someone did this same event for her last year and it looks like awfulness...

Thar she blows:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPsppRGK8c0&NR=1

So I think anything can be an improvement. I also have been figuring out the 720p GH1 workflow in vegas.... I haven't done mixing of 24p and slowmo from 60p gh1 footage yet (and I'm a PC guy) so I was a bit confused.. but I rendered out a little bitty test... and the results in vegas were much better, I think I was panicing a lot because vlc is my default player and it screwed up the clips color and stuff a lot more than they actually were. They are still not great and I don't get the face time I need but I think I might be able to save this...

Here is just a little render test of a few clips...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEXKyc7EOhU&fmt=22

As you can see not great..especially to walk with this thing...but that's about the worst of the darkness... but I am thinking lots a slow mo on good shots I do have, color correction...and throw in one of her music tracks and I can save this.. and just the resolution and encoding alone blow away last year's one. I am just going to do a free edit and try and work some magic... I will not hand over gh1 footage anymore I don't think... but my adrenaline levels are returning to normal.
 
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ahh, yeah you def needed a rig of some sort, way shakey at the beginning, and inside its VERY dark.

Out of curiousity how much are you getting paid for this gig? What is your pricing stucture? (You can PM me if you dont feel like posting)
 
Yeah that's the worst of it though and I didn't do any work on it in post yet .I do have some shots with nice lighting after all I should be able to save it... did you see the first video? I am suddenly not as worried. Now I know.. I'll have more toys in my bag of tricks next time. and no raw footage turning over of run & guns.
 
the outside part with the bad shutter and the speed change is not bad if your going with news paparazzi kind of thing, you can improve it alot . not paid gig tho.

the part inside where your behind the subject is unsolvable. what were you thinking. you can fix the first bit inside the flash bit.

you could make good use of music and get it to about 15-20 seconds of decent paparazzi candid video.
 
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