The RED Epic will have great resolution, but it is overkill unless you are shooting an IMAX movie. Canon DSLRS will be more than an adequate for 90% of film & TV productions.
Hollywood Celebrity Canon DSLR Users
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The RED Epic will have great resolution, but it is overkill unless you are shooting an IMAX movie. Canon DSLRS will be more than an adequate for 90% of film & TV productions.
chrislancaster
Active member
Ha...no wonder you're Cranky!!
But you are right...and truth is...no matter how good it gets people will still find something to complain about.
thats the truth ..people on reduser (not a lot) are complaining that the epic will have a boot time of 10-15 secs.!!!!
and with red you know the will release a new build eventually that will make it faster
jeez
another thing no one mentions is the ron howard short was made www.funnyordie.com and its a short comedy (i assume)
its not a feature action flick
for the web 7d is perfect
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Looked like a typical streaming video to me. Even footage from IMAX cameras can look grainy on streaming video depending on compression.
ydgmdlu
Veteran
Not true. High quality 35mm film stock can resolve somewhere between 4K and 8K (6K?) of detail. 70mm, horizontally-run IMAX is over eight times greater. The 7D resolves only as much as 720p max. But most DI for studio productions is 2K.
Most moviegoers don't care about resolution. 35mm release prints are not much better than 1080p HD, and half of the time it's out of focus in the movie theater anyway!
Um you pretty much proved that the EPIC is overkill unless you're shooting an IMAX movie. Honestly, RED is going to have trouble finding a market for their cameras when inexpensive DSLR's are eating away at their SCARLET market & EPIC is overkill for almost everyone but blockbuster films being shown on an IMAX screen. And CG heavy blockbusters like Avatar are being done mostly on computers without even needing any cameras at all.
speedjunkie
Well-known member
NUFF SAID>>>> FILM IS OUTDATED HOMIES> ONLY thing that is keeping those things around is Corporations like the Oil industry ,, they just cant let go.. i think FILM should be selling Cheaper to try and compete and schools need to update Put film in the history books .. Lets move On :violent5:
ydgmdlu
Veteran
No, the S35 Epic resolves as much detail as 35mm film, and not even the biggest, most expensive Epic chip resolves anywhere near as much as IMAX. If 720p resolution were good enough for Hollywood, then why doesn't everyone shoot 16mm all the time?
Your claim that Canon's DSLRs are actually taking substantial market share away from RED and other digital cinema cameras is so ludicrous that it's almost insulting to professional filmmakers and their craft and standards. The RED One system is reasonably reliable now and still beats any other digital cinema camera in price, by a mile, but it's not dominating the cinematography world, or even the digital cinematography world. The Sony F35 and Panavision Genesis outclass it in several areas, which is why they're chosen over the RED on many productions.
Canon DSLRs, with their barely adequate compression, inferior color sampling, significant rolling shutter issues, copious aliasing, and inferior dynamic range or latitude, can't compete with those cameras, or with 35mm film, at all in regards to image quality. Barry Green won't even risk his professional reputation to use his 7D on a gig, outside of rare circumstances. The BBC rejected the 5D as an acceptable video acquisition device. And honestly, even an EX1/EX3, HMC40, and HMC150 with a 35mm adapter capture better, more professionally usable footage than any DSLR.
So no, they are not good enough for "90%" of movies and TV shows. 90% of micro-budget indies, yes.
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Ron Howard, George Lucas, Robert Rodriguez, Quentin Tarantino, Hughes Brothers, Rodney Charters, Sam Nicholson would all disagree with you. Plus you have to realize that this is just the 1st generation of this technology. Canon is already working on DSLRs that shoot in RAW video and wont have any of the problems you mentioned. Besides, with CGI so many movies are being made on computers- maybe all cameras will be obsolete in the near future?
Barry_Green
Moderator
Um... speedjunkie... you do know that the entire series of "24" is shot on 35mm FILM, right? They go through over a million feet of film per year.
The only thing they use digital for is for background plates for behind the windows of cars, or for the stuff that shows up on peoples' computer monitors...
Jay Rodriguez
Coffee Member
Uh, I owned a DVX100a, HVX200, Canon A1 and an HPX170 and now own and shoot on a 7D.... I don't consider it a started kit camera at all. Sure, it's no RED but let's not act like we can't shoot great movies on these DSLRs because they're not full loaded machines.
Emanuel
Cross-Examiner
There isn't any interest to accept it right? ;-)
Try to show them some clean 5D Mark II/7D/550D/GH1 footage and they will take it as 35mm film.
Ian-T
Veteran
Amen 2 that!!
With that said...I sometimes wonder what we are all arguing about.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Please point to all the films that Ron Howard, George Lucas, Robert Rodriguez, Quentin Tarantino, the Hughes Brothers, Rodney Charters, and Sam Nicholson have produced and shot on a DSLR.
Oh, wait -- there aren't any. There's a short skit on SNL and a handheld music video, and some background plates outside of a car window. Which is cool and exciting, yes -- but you're making it sound like Hollywood films are being made on these things, and that's not in any way a conclusion that can be drawn from the names you listed.
Actually, that we do realize, and really that's the thing -- first generation is here, it's interesting, it's flawed. Which is why 90%+ of Hollywood films are still shot on film. Actually, last I heard the figure was about 97%, but I'm just guessing it's drifted down more towards 90%.
But everyone is watching this area closely, and a few are experimenting with it. Just like they did with the HVX200 (on The Departed, Cloverfield, an insert shot in Munich, Peter Jackson's WETA Digital, Clint Eastwood's Flags of our Fathers and Letters from Iwo Jima) and the EX1, and others. But just because James Cameron bought his own HVX200 and used it during Avatar, that doesn't have us saying that Avatar was shot on the HVX200...
Really? Have they said they are? There's rumors, yes, but is there an announcement from Canon about this? Because that would be huge news.
Right now the only digital camera in an affordable price range that actually will do what you're suggesting, is the Scarlet S35, and that's probably still a year away.
Hah! Well, you might indeed have a good point there. I doubt it, but ... after Avatar and SWEP2/3, who knows...
ydgmdlu
Veteran
Tarantino said that he would stop making movies if he couldn't shoot 35mm anymore. And George Lucas? Please. He'd be infinitely more likely to shoot all of his movies on the Epic 617 (the 28K resolution one) than a Canon DSLR.
You said, "Canon DSLRS will be more than an adequate for 90% of film & TV productions." What DSLRs? We can only look at ones that actually exist, instead hypothetical ones. Otherwise, your point has absolutely no substance.
I can't imagine anyone, except for maybe Cameron and Rodriguez would support this. Anyone else would vehemently protest.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Well, Pixar might be okay with it. 
Emanuel
Cross-Examiner
Let's chillout a little bit on this sort of quotes please
A good part of these talented directors (but non-talented too ;-) have no clue about what digital technology means. Comparing them with a Barry Green, for example, is the same as to compare funny high school students with a PhD researcher. I never knew Tarantino personally but know very well who cannot say the same.He is the same guy who said that he will never shoot film anymore. The same who introduced hollywood to a 3:1:1 HDCAM 1080p camera. The same who will include DSLRs for POV shots or something similar as solution for a small set like an airplane cockpit in a hollywood blockbuster. The same who his producer (Rick McCallum) invited Philip Bloom with no prior connection between them, just coming from Philip's weblogging activity. In a couple of weeks, both had had a meeting between the Lucas ranch in the US and Prague (EU) just for testing the most recent DSLR technology. Plus, as 3rd round, sharing both a place in a movie contest to be shot with a DSLR camera promoted by a post-production hollywood boutique.
Well, Pixar might be okay with it.
Not to mention the makers of South Park, Family Guy, American Dad, and all the animation on TV. Speaking of TV do you think Reality Shows, News Programs , Sports, or Documentaries ( all huge segments of modern day television) would ever use a 25 pound RED Camera with limited battery and recording time, or even care about camera resolution? Yet a 2 pound Canon DSLR would excel in Reality Shows, News Programs , Sports, and Documentaries , and they'll only continue to get better and cheaper.
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