GH2 - solutions for the band problem...

It can be anything.
It can be even interference from MCP chip.
GH2 uses new approach by having MCP mounted on top of LSI.
If LSI has some analog parts (and even on digital :-) ) you can see some high frequency pollution from MCP chip.
On GH1 it is not a problem as you have MCP placed separately and all lines propertly shielded.

All I can predict is that this thing could result in one of the biggest economic failures of all time in camera market :-)
 
Vitaliy Kiselev said:
It can be anything.
It can be even interference from MCP chip.
GH2 uses new approach by having MCP mounted on top of LSI.
If LSI has some analog parts (and even on digital :-) ) you can see some high frequency pollution from MCP chip.
On GH1 it is not a problem as you have MCP placed separately and all lines propertly shielded.

All I can predict is that this thing could result in one of the biggest economic failures of all time in camera market :-)
Click to expand...

Well the truth is, it could be anything. I was actually wondering if it was a case of something else becoming active in the power grid and causing some sort of voltage drop causing some issues where it affects the read due to a dropped rail therefore, it detects lower on the pull (or a raised ground).

I'd say the difference between recording and not is the actual circuitry that is encoding the frame. I've seen plenty of black tests on cameras that show how much noise can be recorded at really long exposures, however, given the band moves in different shutter settings, it means to me it is not proximity based relative to the circuitry on the sensor. Also, some people cannot seem to make it happen how hard they try, which at that point makes it hard to believe its a firmware if no one has different firmware. Definitely requires more testing to see.
 
Reading this thread is giving me a headache. I'm just hoping that if there's a real issue with "most" people's GH2's that are currently in people's hands, they were probably waiting until the good batch is released. For sure when I finally do get the GH2, I'll see for myself if there are any problems and luckily the authorised dealer that I'm using is not too far from me.
 
grimepoch said:
Well the truth is, it could be anything. I was actually wondering if it was a case of something else becoming active in the power grid and causing some sort of voltage drop causing some issues where it affects the read due to a dropped rail therefore, it detects lower on the pull (or a raised ground).

I'd say the difference between recording and not is the actual circuitry that is encoding the frame. I've seen plenty of black tests on cameras that show how much noise can be recorded at really long exposures, however, given the band moves in different shutter settings, it means to me it is not proximity based relative to the circuitry on the sensor. Also, some people cannot seem to make it happen how hard they try, which at that point makes it hard to believe its a firmware if no one has different firmware. Definitely requires more testing to see.
Click to expand...

Sounds all very plausible to me. Something frequency clock related to the electronic shutter, thus why it's chance position in the frame. I wonder if there is a timing interval difference that equates to the difference shutter speeds too, since it's not there all the time. Someone could do some tests with some static scenes if they really wanted to find out. you would need a scene that has something that is underexposed across a whole vertical column to account for the shift. Has anyone done a noise analysis on it to see if it is actually affecting the whole horizontal line, even in the correct exposed areas?

In any case I believe this is understood and will be resolved by Panasonic
 
Because there are cameras out there that don't have the problem, everyone is making a big noise about it, Vitality's hints and we know that Panasonic does read this board.

Plus I'm a half full sort of guy and "believe" this to be the case, beliefs don't need proof just faith.
 
Dazza said:
Because there are cameras out there that don't have the problem, everyone is making a big noise about it, Vitality's hints and we know that Panasonic does read this board.

Plus I'm a half full sort of guy and "believe" this to be the case, beliefs don't need proof just faith.
Click to expand...

you can be optimisic in some cases.. and how would Panny help me when i'm stuck in israel and imported the cam from Japan?
 
roei z said:
you can be optimisic in some cases.. and how would Panny help me when i'm stuck in israel and imported the cam from Japan?
Click to expand...

Simple they tell you to buy another one later on. :thumbdown

Seriously im wondering do panasonic have a quality control dept that gives their cameras a good roadtest before production? If so this issue SHOULD of been spotted.
 
mimirsan said:
Simple they tell you to buy another one later on. :thumbdown

Seriously im wondering do panasonic have a quality control dept that gives their cameras a good roadtest before production? If so this issue SHOULD of been spotted.
Click to expand...

i personally think Panasonic definitely knew about it (think- they make & test 3200 video iso and simply NOT seeing it??) unless they are completely unaware of their corrupted first
batch.

in both cases it's very embarrassing and disrespectful toward costumers - and i'm almost sure they won't change it. (if it's firmware - we're VERY lucky)
 
roei z said:
you can be optimisic in some cases.. and how would Panny help me when i'm stuck in israel and imported the cam from Japan?
Click to expand...

That is the price and risk of being that earlier adopter frankly. Even with this banding problem I'm sure there are lots of people, myself included, whom it doesn't worry at all.

If it really worries you so much I would suggest selling your GH2 for a profit(shouldn't be hard since the camera is unavailable in Israel) and get another camera or waiting till later when Panasonic hopefully fix it(at which time the GH2 will be cheaper anyway)

All cameras have their flaws
 
mimirsan said:
Simple they tell you to buy another one later on. :thumbdown

Seriously im wondering do panasonic have a quality control dept that gives their cameras a good roadtest before production? If so this issue SHOULD of been spotted.
Click to expand...

I'd say it's quite probable the issue spotted. It's a 35mm camera for a thousand bucks that gives you great video at ISO 3200, with no Canon aliasing nonsense and much more. Things can be fixed, but in order to maintain their intended profit margin I think they would have to increase price too.

But I say that considering sensor improvement and perhaps a firmware fix wouldn't be costly, like Vitaliy said.
 
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Dazza said:
That is the price and risk of being that earlier adopter frankly. Even with this banding problem I'm sure there are lots of people, myself included, whom it doesn't worry at all.

If it really worries you so much I would suggest selling your GH2 for a profit(shouldn't be hard since the camera is unavailable in Israel) and get another camera or waiting till later when Panasonic hopefully fix it(at which time the GH2 will be cheaper anyway)

All cameras have their flaws
Click to expand...

of course i'll keep the camera the try to avoid causing the banding.. just saying..
 
Vitaliy Kiselev said:
roei z
I suggest to start actual shooting instead of technical discussions :-)
DO not waste your time on this.
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Vitaliy, i'm wasting my time on this when i waste my time at work :)
i started shooting stuff already, and waiting for a chest support to arrive, etc etc.
that said, i'm a bit obsessive.. like a lot of dvxuser members.
 
Vitaliy Kiselev said:
In this case find a good book at read it. Or better find work where you are not wasting your time.
Again, do not waste your time :-)
Click to expand...

i guess i am not as efficient as you.. in fact, not so efficient generally :(
but still, in the meantime i'm completing a documentary film, writing..
and don't forget this stuff here (learning my steps in HD workflow and shooting) is a university for me, so not all the time wasted.. (although a big part is)
 
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