Getting rid of the documentary look

PaPa said:
ah alright, so you really want to have that style of grading look. Cool. In that case, the 7D would be right up your alley. It can take a decent amount of torture in the grading process before completely breaking apart.

Rest assured that you will be able to get that type of image quality with the right lighting and color grading process, but will you also want the ability to shoot some natural looking footage without the heavy grading process, with the hopes of it not turning out looking "video" ish?
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Exactly. I just have to see an example of the quality of Camille's work to be convinced the 7D can produce that kind of quality. The problem has basically come down to A) The 7D cannot produce that quality OR 2) The 7D has not been out long enough for anyone to produce something as beautiful as Camille's work.

I am scouring the web every single day for 7D footage and have yet to find anything amazing. The BEST footage from the 7D I've found so far was here:

http://vimeo.com/7165356

Watch the 40-60 second marks and the 1:38-1:46 mark. I've spoken the person who shot this and this footage has been graded. BUT it's still not as *sharp* as Camille's work.

And no this video was not produced by me despite both our names being Anthony haha, these guys are out of Oz.
 
Camille's video is definitely beautiful done on the 5D. Taking a closer look, even though it has gone through compression thus one can't be certain, it indeed does look very sharp. But if you take a closer look at the strands of hair and the blades of grass when they are in sharp focus, you will see small sharpening artifacts, so my guess is that she either boosted sharpness in camera or in post, again something that can be done with the 7D.

I mean, we are virtually talking about the same camera, but one with a larger full frame sensor, so it has better low light capabilities and shallower depth of field potential. But from what i've read and understood, the 7D's codec is either the same or improved that of the 5D.

Do you not have time to rent one and give it a go before deciding to purchase?
 
Anthonyb said:
Exactly. I just have to see an example of the quality of Camille's work to be convinced the 7D can produce that kind of quality. The problem has basically come down to A) The 7D cannot produce that quality OR 2) The 7D has not been out long enough for anyone to produce something as beautiful as Camille's work.

I am scouring the web every single day for 7D footage and have yet to find anything amazing. The BEST footage from the 7D I've found so far was here:

http://vimeo.com/7165356

Watch the 40-60 second marks and the 1:38-1:46 mark. I've spoken the person who shot this and this footage has been graded. BUT it's still not as *sharp* as Camille's work.

And no this video was not produced by me despite both our names being Anthony haha, these guys are out of Oz.
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To me the examples you are pointing out both with this and Camille's video all has to do with lighting and proper exposure. A lot of the stuff on the internet that people freely put up are "tests" or people who are not cinematographers or lighting experts. From my understanding these cams go with the old saying "you sometimes need a lot of light to make it look like there isn't a lot of light." Camille's for example looks like it was shot on an overcast or cloudy day. That probably gave it the nice soft yet sharp appearance. The example above looks to me like it was properly lit and exposed to give it that nice cinematic quality to it. So it looks to me that the examples you are talking about are lighting and exposure qualities. Oh and of course proper WB.
 
Nitsuj said:
To me the examples you are pointing out both with this and Camille's video all has to do with lighting and proper exposure. A lot of the stuff on the internet that people freely put up are "tests" or people who are not cinematographers or lighting experts. From my understanding these cams go with the old saying "you sometimes need a lot of light to make it look like there isn't a lot of light." Camille's for example looks like it was shot on an overcast or cloudy day. That probably gave it the nice soft yet sharp appearance. The example above looks to me like it was properly lit and exposed to give it that nice cinematic quality to it. So it looks to me that the examples you are talking about are lighting and exposure qualities. Oh and of course proper WB.
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Ayup. Can't wait to see your fear entry btw.
 
Kholi said:
Ayup. Can't wait to see your fear entry btw.
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Hehe well mine is not that high quality natural looking "I got a deep pocket" kind of look. It's the $84 budget, "I'm so broke I can't even pay attention" kind of look. I called my friends and said "Hey wanna be in a bad flick? Well all you have to do is say this line, jump on his back screaming like a possessed lunatic, and have blood hosed on your face. Ready? GO!" Don't expect much more than that trust me. Hehe.
 
Kholi said:
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=188933

did that help at all or still looking for something else? hhopefully more stuff like this shows up.
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Those were all AMAZING. Loved his comparison with the red and xh a1. The 3rd tutorial was also amazing. The man is a cinematographer, which is vital. His footage is basically the best 7D footage out there. With that said, I still felt like I had to get out the windex and wipe the dust off the screen even in HD mode.

Despite it's drawbacks, it looks like I'll be going with the 5D.
 
Anthonyb said:
Those were all AMAZING. Loved his comparison with the red and xh a1. The 3rd tutorial was also amazing. The man is a cinematographer, which is vital. His footage is basically the best 7D footage out there. With that said, I still felt like I had to get out the windex and wipe the dust off the screen even in HD mode.

Despite it's drawbacks, it looks like I'll be going with the 5D.
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Sweet~ Well it's good that you could decide. Better than hanging on and waiting!
 
Also, Anthony, Kholi is quite right about the cinematic DOF issue. The ultra-thin DOF of the Ralph Lauren video is not more cinematic than the deeper DOF of footage from the 7D. The 7D has a sensor that is approximately the same size as the Academy 35mm film frame. If you use the same focal lengths and apertures that cinematographers use on their 35mm film productions, then you'll have the same "cinematic" DOF.

So far in this thread, you have not defined exactly what your problem is with the 7D footage that you have seen. You claim that it has a "video" look, but what does that mean? What criteria do you use?
 
Not to speak for Anthony, but I think he just likes the aesthetic of the 5D better than the 7D. It's a different look. I personally like the 7D more, but again, it's personal.

Each to his/her own opinion.
 
ydgmdlu said:
That's what I thought, but the OP seemed to suggest (unless I'm misinterpreting him) that the 7D is softer than the 5D.
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Yes, I think he perceives the 7D softer, but from the 5D footage I shot, it doesn't like any in camera sharpening, and definitely sings when there is sharpening applied in post. I'm sure that this was done in the Ralph Lauren spots.

In camera sharpening is harsh, but applying it later to a slightly softer image yields more natural results. I find both cameras to be a bit 'mushy' out of the camera, but with some processing, you can get some really nice stuff. The 5D/7D can't hold a candle to RED as far as resolution and natural detail resolving power is concerned, but again, with some processing I've been really impressed with the 7D - aside from the crazy aliasing and moire.

GH1 resolves more detail than the 5D/7D, but the Canon has a bit more mojo working for it, and I prefer Canon's color palette to the Lumix.

However, these are just my personal experiences.
 
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