Gemini 4:4:4 Recorder

"Full Uncompressed" that's the only bit that worries me. Surely they're using some kind of compression? prores? cineform? dpx? I find it hard to believe it's just spitting out completely uncompressed avi's/movs, that would make storage and media a huge pain
 
i'm sure it will do a LOT more than just uncompressed. judging by the specs, it's gunning for cinedeck, it's gonna match it in everyway and more...

uncompressed isn't a bad idea at all. onboard sxs recording for editorial, online it to the uncompressed. I would love it to do 10 bit DPX as the online, and bypass quicktime all together. great for VFX too.
 
Fohdeesha said:
"Full Uncompressed" that's the only bit that worries me. Surely they're using some kind of compression? prores? cineform? dpx? I find it hard to believe it's just spitting out completely uncompressed avi's/movs, that would make storage and media a huge pain
Click to expand...

Convergent Design would not make a mistake like that. There have been requests from the nanoFlash users to get access to uncompressed video in addiition to LongGOP, iFrame variants like ProRes.

They have managed to do some pretty remarkable stuff using Sony's codec in the nanoFlash giving users access to 280 mbit files.

We'll have to wait and see what codec technology they have employed in their new device. It shouldn't be long.

Having seen how they operate over the past year as a nanoFlash user, I am really excited about this announcement.
 
Last edited:
This is very interesting... $25k looks set to rig you up a very strong F3 system (without lens) with a few SSDs thrown in for good measure.
 
Fohdeesha said:
"Full Uncompressed" that's the only bit that worries me. Surely they're using some kind of compression? prores? cineform? dpx? I find it hard to believe it's just spitting out completely uncompressed avi's/movs, that would make storage and media a huge pain
Click to expand...

As I understand it uncompressed has all the info you need. With this new recorder you will be able to connect the SSD after you have shot, and convert it to any of those formats you want. It will be "First code" as if it was straight from the camera. Or use an uncompressed workflow. Drag onto the timeline and edit. There are other features that look amazing, plus it will be the size of a Small HD DP6 to give you a reference. You can record simultaneously to 2 SSD's and have that double back up..... Can't wait
 
Do you realize the transfer speeds required for 10-bit 1080p uncompressed? With the compression technologies available today, there is absolutely no reason to still be spitting out completely uncompressed. I mean at-least go to a dpx sequence! There's no reason not to go to cineform or prores, they are both compatible on both windows and OSX systems. Going to cineform even at it's highest bitrate setting will allow you to fit more than 5 times the amount of footage on a single drive, and you won't need a RAID array on your edit station to play back a single layer of it.
 
It has been so much a part of Convergent Design's messaging over the life of the nanoFlash that there are acquisition formats and editing formats. I am confident they will have at least 3 different ways of data acquisiton which will probably involve XDCAM, MXF, MPEG which would be legacy for them, so they will probably be adding uncompressed and maybe Cineform or something else. Until either we know the encoder or they actually tell us it will be a mystery.

I think it would be prudent not to speculate too wildly so rumor doesn't become fact... in the eyes of some.
 
Last edited:
I am SO stoked for this. This is a revolutionary device.

I know a few things about it. its AMAZING, and i am 110% getting one, without question.
 
Fohdeesha said:
Do you realize the transfer speeds required for 10-bit 1080p uncompressed? With the compression technologies available today, there is absolutely no reason to still be spitting out completely uncompressed.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Which makes me fairly positive that CD has done their homework as well and the unit will offer a few formats. But holey cow, this would make the F3's high end recording options all that more affordable.
 
I've known about this product for almost two months and it has taken every bit of professional journalist within me to keep a lid on it! Now that CD has let the cat out of the bag, all I can say is that I am pleased to see excitement similar to my own. This will be a phenomenal product at a competitive price point and is going to be the perfect companion to the F3. I personally own and shoot a Nanoflash with Sony EX cameras and know that CD's combination of engineering and tech support will give Gemini the edge!

Ned Soltz
 
Fohdeesha said:
Do you realize the transfer speeds required for 10-bit 1080p uncompressed? With the compression technologies available today, there is absolutely no reason to still be spitting out completely uncompressed. I mean at-least go to a dpx sequence! There's no reason not to go to cineform or prores, they are both compatible on both windows and OSX systems. Going to cineform even at it's highest bitrate setting will allow you to fit more than 5 times the amount of footage on a single drive, and you won't need a RAID array on your edit station to play back a single layer of it.
Click to expand...

again, there are no specs on whether it's uncompressed quicktime, or something like DPX. dpx is uncompressed and would take up just as much space, but it's a industry standard method and is meant for a online solution. On a decent feature, I'd suggest shooting on sxs for editorial, and onlining and doing vfx with the uncompressed footage. On a feature where you are gonna at least have a few hundred thousand dollars, drives are inconsequential. a fraction of the budget. more is gonna be spent on your stunt person. but the option of knowing your footage will be as uncompromised is possible is a great option.

I agree with cineform being a good option, but it might blow the price point. it looks like they are packing a lot in a small unit for 6k, cineform is an expensive paid for codec. It's one of the reasons why the cinedeck is twice the price. (12k for cinedeck if you want the dual link activated on it)

pro res and dnxhd will be kind of expected, especially pro res as alternative high quality solutions for when the budget can't handle the uncompressed method. I'm sure they are gonna cram it in there some how. A company as reputable as CG I doubt they'd over look their consumer base, and deny them pro res.

This thing if it's made right, is really gonna be a major competitor against the cinedeck and sony's own solid state SR. My gut feeling is this is gonna turn into the industry's #1 offboard recorder of choice. From Hollywood with Indy, and I can't wait for HDCAM SR to get the final dagger and be gone...
 
The KiPro still seems like the best solution to me. One big issue with all of these things are size, weight and power needs. If something takes 30watts to run, it can break a lot of shoots.

$1900, 15w, smallhd sized and weight unit and CF cards are hard to beat.
 
Umm the gemini uses less power than the ki pro. ;) a lot less....

I've known about it for a while too. Its gonna change my shooting life. Can't wait.
 
Cinesin, how are you able to conclude that any unit is a better solution at this point with the shreds of information out there? You've heard of nanoFlash correct? You know that it uses 6.5 watts, is silent, weighs well under a pound and doesn't get hot... right? You know that Convergent Design is one of the most user driven companies in the industry, right? You know the Ki Pro is around 24 watts to operate? You know it gets really hot in continuous operation and requires fans to keep it cool? You know that a lot of the features on the Ki Pro that they promised to have activated a year and a half ago are still unimplemented. You know the media drives for the Ki Pro are expensive for what they are: laptop hardrives and you have to be really careful about ejecting them when in the heat of a shoot.You understand that the Ki Pro Mini, the Ki Pro's sibling has a serious bug right now where if you have the media in the unit on boot up that it won't record material, right?. You know the Ki Pro Mini has barely been field tested at this point as the product was just now rolled out a month ago, after an eight month or so pre-announcment of the unit.

I am simply trying to point out that if you base your information on anecdotal and ad-hoc evidence you can convince yourself of almost anything.

BTW you are talking about the Ki Pro Mini, not the Ki Pro.
 
TimurCivan said:
Umm the gemini uses less power than the ki pro. I've known about it for a while too.
Click to expand...

I checked Google yesterday and noticed they picked up (cached) the Convergent Design NAB vendor page that referenced the Gemini on March 9th. I wonder if they deliberately put up this information to see how long it would take people to make the info go viral.

The question now is... how long will they leave us to speculate before they put us out of our misery.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top