Film out

umuima

umuima

Active member
Wondering if anyone has experience doing a film out with the t2i's(or 7D's) footage. I'm looking into it -- is there anything special I have to keep in mind while shooting that will affect a film out?

Please share your experiences!
 
umuima said:
Wondering if anyone has experience doing a film out with the t2i's(or 7D's) footage. I'm looking into it -- is there anything special I have to keep in mind while shooting that will affect a film out?

Please share your experiences!
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You'll be going from ntsc tv frame rate of 23.97 to true 24 for film out. There will be sound sync issues with that, depending on your NLE. You should make sure you're recording at the right sampling frequency/frame rate BEFORE you start filming. If you're posting on an avid, then I recommend to go on the avid forums and start reading up in the 24p section - Michael Philips runs this, and he's a genius at this stuff. Can't help you with FCP but I'm sure if you google you'll find something.
 
Never heard of sync issues being at 23.976. Can you elaborate? Have you had problems? I thought as long as you were sync'd in the 23.976 project all was good.
 
draven4 said:
Never heard of sync issues being at 23.976. Can you elaborate? Have you had problems? I thought as long as you were sync'd in the 23.976 project all was good.
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I'm not sure that's the case - true 24 fps obviously runs faster than 23.976. So if you're speeding up picture then that will obviously have a knock on effect for audio. I'm no expert on this, but this guy is - go to

www.24p.com

A lot of it is aimed at avid users, but the principles remain the same. A brilliant resource.
 
Ian-T said:
Hmmm...and here I alway thought true 24p was 23.976.

... But maybe that's just referring to NTSC frame rate and film is entirely different.
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Film runs at a true 24 frames per second, because it's exposing actual frames of celluloid. It would be really odd to expose 97.6% of a frame with film.

The reason 24p runs at 23.976 wth NTSC video is because of color video. In the days of black and white TV, video did run at 30fps in the States because, based on our 60Hz electrical system, that's 60 fields per second. (For the same reason, PAL runs with 50 fields per second to match the 50Hz electrical system.) But when color TV came around, they needed to fit the color sync information into the signal yet needed to keep up with the 60Hz system. So they sacrificed 0.03 frames per second. That 0.03 frame is still, technically, there, but it contains no viewable content. It houses the blanking that contains the sync information. PAL, on the other hand, does not include the color sync information within the video signal, but within a subcarrier, so no need to eliminate a fraction of a frame per second.

So, color video runs at 29.97 frames per second. Likewise, 24p in video (which is normally viewed in 29.97 using an added pull-down) runs at 23.976 to allow for that hidden blanking. (For your SAT question: 23.976 is to 24 as 29.97 is to 30.)
 
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Ah...thanks C2V. I've been re-educated. Seems like I've read this somewhere before but put it out of my mind.
 
Can't most modern NLEs do a reverse pull down and render out a true 24p timeline for film out? Isn't that what Cinema Tools is for in FCS? What would you do with the audio for that scenario?
 
David G. Smith said:
Can't most modern NLEs do a reverse pull down and render out a true 24p timeline for film out? Isn't that what Cinema Tools is for in FCS? What would you do with the audio for that scenario?
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Yes, most modern NLEs even have 24p sequence settings available. It provides a challenge for external video monitoring, as you need to have external hardware (i.e. an i/o breakout box and monitor) that can conform it for display.

Not sure I understand your question about audio. Audio has no native frame rate, and recorders that have TC use it only to put a TC stamp in the meta data simply for reference. What counts with audio is the sample rate, since :60 of audio played in a 23.976 video project is the same as :60 of audio played in a 29.97 project.
 
Hey guys,

With all of the 35mm filmouts we do, the best way to send us the file is 23.976fps with 48k audio if your shot with a 24p camera like the t2i/7d/HVX200/XHA1 etc. You don't have to do anything special with the audio.

Any adjustments to maintain sync when going to film are done by our audio lab and film lab and will most likely be the case with other film transfer houses you go to. You don't have to record in any special manner in production.

Record 23.976fps with 48k audio and edit the same way.

To the OP: Besides controlling the jello/moire and other t2i/7d/VDslr problems, there isn't anything special that needs to be done with shooting for transfer to 35mm. Visit our site www.dvfilm.com for more information.

Hope this helps,
Andy Olson
DVFilm
 
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Thanks Andy. I remember reading about DVFilm, in regards to your DV to film transfers, in I believe "MovieMaker" magazine, and they were highly rated.

Have ya'll done many film outs with HD-DSLR footage, and what is your general impression of the process and quality of finished footage?
 
Hey David,

We've done one 5dmark ii transfer and it turned out very good. It even had to have a 30p to 24p conversion done. Straight 24p out of the camera would probably have made it look even better. Though HD-DSLRs are not really HD resolution, the image looked very good.

We've done a lot of SD transfers that needed lots of processing and they turned out excellent so most HD-DSLRs are very capable tools in producing a good quality film print. It's very much 'what you see if what you get' so it depends mostly on how well the movie was shot. Avoid the HD-SLR problems is key, but also good lightning, set design, shot selection etc.

We gotten a lot of inquiries about DSLRs filmouts, but not many have gone through with it for one reason or another.

Best Regards,
Andy
 
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