Run&Gun
Veteran
I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with part of your statement. The C300 is an absolute monster in low-light. Puts my F55 to shame, in that regard.
EVA1 5.7K CDNG misunderstanding
- Thread starter jedtrently
- Start date
I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with part of your statement. The C300 is an absolute monster in low-light. Puts my F55 to shame, in that regard.
Run&Gun
Veteran
And that's part of the problem we've been running into for the last half decade, now. Everyone wants to use s35 "cine cameras" for EVERYTHING except actually shooting "movies". This has always bugged me, because I come from the broadcast/network/sports/news world and shooting with real ENG cameras and lenses that are designed to "just work" as simply and quickly and reliably as possible, then all of a sudden, we have these little "cine" cameras(starting with the C300) foisted upon us to be used in situations that we should have been using our ENG cameras for, for 90% of the shoot.
NorBro
Major Contributor
This is mainly because affordable prosumer/ENG cameras are extremely dated in quality. Although completely terrible for certain jobs, almost every single mirrorless/DSLR or cinema camera with a nice piece of glass is going to produce better/modern quality. And if you want to get into the 4K ENG game, the prices are still completely ridiculous (besides the fixed-lens options, which stink, IMO).
Run&Gun
Veteran
I never said anything about prosumer or "affordable"(which is a relative term). I'm talking about broadcast cameras. Yeah, my iPhone X shoots 4K, 240fps, slo-mo and cost ~$1K. My VariCam is only HD, tops out at 60 fps slo-mo and cost 40X that before the lens, but which one is better suited to shooting a football game?
My point simply being that there are the right tools for jobs and when you have to use tools that aren't best suited for the job at hand(as most of us know), it sucks the big one from an operator stand-point.
NorBro
Major Contributor
Never quoted anything you said; just followed-up and shared IMO why we are seeing cinema cameras and hybrid stills cameras replacing ENG cameras that were always used in those certain situations (at least on the lower-end where regular people can't afford what the networks can). It's really a part of the DSLR movement that transformed into the cinema camera movement.
Teddy_Dem
Well-known member
The ProRes Raw update from Atomos has been released:
https://www.newsshooter.com/2018/06...available-atomos-shogun-inferno-atomosos-9-1/
https://www.atomos.com/firmware/shogun-inferno
https://www.newsshooter.com/2018/06...available-atomos-shogun-inferno-atomosos-9-1/
https://www.atomos.com/firmware/shogun-inferno
filmguy123
Veteran
Except the camera is advertised as cinematic run & gun and official images such as this:
https://blogs.panasonic.com.au/busi...mpact-Cinema-Camera-Australia-Launch-2017.jpg
And in brochures such as this:
ftp://ftp.panasonic.com/provideo/whitepaper/questions_eva1.pdf
This is all official Panasonic literature.
In 2018 the line between a cinema camera and documentary camera has been so far blurred as to be a virtually outdated descriptor. No, not entirely, form factor and feature set play a role. But there tends to be an old school way of thinking as cameras as dedicated cinema cameras VS ENG that's not quite as black and white anymore. I am not speaking to lens types and shoulder mounting, etc.
I am speaking to the notion that cameras are largely computers with sensors running on software for the menus. None of the fixes mentioned require a fundamental change to anything in the EVA1 outside of tweaking software to be used more efficiently.
The things that differentiated cameras so strongly in the past are increasingly becoming issues of the past.
There is nothing more cinematic about clunky menus or slow boot times.
soarprod
Veteran
Mitch Gross
Veteran
For anyone who loaded the new firmware from Atomos, there was a bug discovered and to Atomos’ credit it released an update version, firmware 9.11. It is highly suggested that everyone load this new version.
Mitch Gross
Veteran
Switching between ISOs has actually been greatly improved in recent firmware updates. Rather than diving into the menu tree, press the Home button and then ISO to get access to a shortcut menu. Here the switch on the lower left side of the camera can be adjusted to switch between the two native ISOs, scroll through the 800 range, or scroll through the 2500 range. That’s only a few button pushes to reach.
filmguy123
Veteran
That is what I have been doing, and am complaining about... it really slow things down. There is a much better solution.
I'm pretty slow with the menus, and it takes me a total of 5-7 seconds to press the home button, navigate to the base iso setting, change it, then adjust the iso for the new base level and exit. I have a feeling that if I do this a few more times my speed will pick up and it'll take no more than 4-5 seconds. That much time I don't have an issue with...
Though I do like the suggestion made elsewhere that having a programmable button that could do everything necessary to take you into or out of a high frame rate mode (possibly including switching from full sensor to cropped, etc) would be a huge improvement.
Mitch Gross
Veteran
I would like to request that the moderators change the title of this thread from “misinformation” to “misunderstanding.” I feel the current wording is inaccurate, insulting and incorrect.
filmguy123
Veteran
Same. And, you also need to stop recording to press the home button, change, and the restart recording. So you break clip and lose 5-7 seconds where you can't see the EVF. That's way too long in live event or docu work where shots can be lost and had in a moment. And if you are constantly going back and forth for a quick moving shoot in mixed light, the repeated back and forth really pulls you out. And is super annoying. Also, it is very easy to make an error with the way the wheel rolls if you're trying to zip through this process in a hurry, and hit the wrong thing or go into the wrong menu.
For comparison, it takes about 1.5 seconds on GHx line without breaking recording or losing the screen monitoring.
You should be able to simple roll through the ISO from 400 to 4000 in 1.5 seconds without ceasing recording and without losing the EVF and have it auto switch to the optimal base ISO. You know, like the consumer grade GHx.
Yes Mitch, I'd second the proposal to re-title the thread.
Of course we're pretty far off the original topic at this point...
Filmguy123 -- It's been ages since I touched a GH camera (though I do have an A7s which can continuously adjust the ISO from 200 to ridiculous...
But perhaps for what I shoot I just haven't had an issue with way the EVA changes ISO -- it just took a bit of getting used to. But I really do like the 'dual ISO ranges' concept as opposed to the way the sony fs cameras restrict you with too high a base ISO as soon as you start shooting in Log. One of the things I like about the dual ISO ranges is the way it's possible to assign different degrees of in-camera noise reduction to the two iso levels - something I fear would be lost with a single control iso adjustment.
If you know that you're going to be continuously rolling and need to make iso adjustments on the fly, you've probably already figured out that your two approaches are to use the selector switch/scroll wheel on ISO, then either set the camera for the iso selection to be limited to the two base levels (800 & 2500) and adjust iris from there, or set the camera to the 2500 base/adjustable and scroll the camera up or down from there - which will only bring you down as far as 1000, but at least you can do it while still rolling (and if 1000 is too bright you can also engage the nd filter while rolling.) Of course if you're actually going to 4000 or higher the 'restrict to native' option won't work very well for you.
Of course all this talk about being able to perform functions while rolling -- I'm hoping that at some point the assignable 1.4x expanded mode could be enabled without having to cut. (Though I think I'd want there to be a way to turn that while-rolling functionality on or off as a safety feature -- at the point where it's assigned to a user button.) For me the ability to keep rolling is primarily a sound issue, since there's often not a separate audio recorder, and in a documentary situation I hate to lose audio, even for a couple of moments.
Of course we're pretty far off the original topic at this point...
Filmguy123 -- It's been ages since I touched a GH camera (though I do have an A7s which can continuously adjust the ISO from 200 to ridiculous...
But perhaps for what I shoot I just haven't had an issue with way the EVA changes ISO -- it just took a bit of getting used to. But I really do like the 'dual ISO ranges' concept as opposed to the way the sony fs cameras restrict you with too high a base ISO as soon as you start shooting in Log. One of the things I like about the dual ISO ranges is the way it's possible to assign different degrees of in-camera noise reduction to the two iso levels - something I fear would be lost with a single control iso adjustment.
If you know that you're going to be continuously rolling and need to make iso adjustments on the fly, you've probably already figured out that your two approaches are to use the selector switch/scroll wheel on ISO, then either set the camera for the iso selection to be limited to the two base levels (800 & 2500) and adjust iris from there, or set the camera to the 2500 base/adjustable and scroll the camera up or down from there - which will only bring you down as far as 1000, but at least you can do it while still rolling (and if 1000 is too bright you can also engage the nd filter while rolling.) Of course if you're actually going to 4000 or higher the 'restrict to native' option won't work very well for you.
Of course all this talk about being able to perform functions while rolling -- I'm hoping that at some point the assignable 1.4x expanded mode could be enabled without having to cut. (Though I think I'd want there to be a way to turn that while-rolling functionality on or off as a safety feature -- at the point where it's assigned to a user button.) For me the ability to keep rolling is primarily a sound issue, since there's often not a separate audio recorder, and in a documentary situation I hate to lose audio, even for a couple of moments.
filmguy123
Veteran
yeah, to me a user bindable button for 800/2500 base is a no-brainer. An "optimal" option that removes the need for manual base switch and just allows a free-scroll through is ideal. These tweaks certainly aren't rocket science, not like it's asking for the moon.
soarprod
Veteran
From what I understand, you can set a whole bunch of settings and save them to the setup file. Then you could swap between setup files to change things like the base iso. We need the setup file bonded to a user button that can cycle between them.