Cool Lights BlackLines

[Ryan E. Walters]

Richard,

I'm in the market right now for a set of lights. When do you expect these to be available? How do these compare to Arri? How do these compare to BluLine?

Thanks.

That is a great question- is there any tiem frame on any of these lights- HMI's, tungsten, the 4x55's or the 6x55's? The only offerings that I see on your site are the CL-255 and the CL-SFT1

 

[Spartacus]

As far as a name for the lights... How 'bout your "PORN" name Richard.. ?
Someone once told me, to get your "porn " name, you just use the street name you grew up on and the name of your first dog...
Unfortunately, my "porn" name would be LEXINGTON SNOOPY, not exactely a name that spouts testosterone.. but it's a start.. lol

Mine would be "Franken Gizmo" :evil:

 

[Cool Lights]

Richard,

I'm in the market right now for a set of lights. When do you expect these to be available? How do these compare to Arri? How do these compare to BluLine?

Thanks.

Well I have my ideas and the people making them have theirs about when they'll be ready. I've been shooting for September / October. They compare favorably with Arris. The construction is excellent and they're super attractive. Very sturdy. I especially like the black on the front and back with silver in the middle which makes mine distinctively my models. These should compare pretty much with the blue line models but we've used better wire. We also have a 150w model which they don't have.

 

[Cool Lights]

That is a great question- is there any tiem frame on any of these lights- HMI's, tungsten, the 4x55's or the 6x55's? The only offerings that I see on your site are the CL-255 and the CL-SFT1

That's because I have it programmed to remove the product pages when we're out of stock. I probably should just set the options so it appears back ordered but the goal was to not let anyone inadvertently order something until we have it in stock. September / October is what I'm shooting for now. We've just had lots of delays with different products we're working on.

 

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Ever thought about any grip equipment? I'm cringing at the idea of paying $400+ for a heavy duty 8x8 frame!

 

[Ryan E. Walters]

That's because I have it programmed to remove the product pages when we're out of stock.

That makes sense. But I'd recommend that you still list them on the site, but list it as out of stock, with out the option to buy. That way your customers at least know that you offer the product.

Hopefully your suppliers will be able to meet the Sept / Oct timeline, as I'd definately be picking some of those lights up from you.

 

[Cool Lights]

Ever thought about any grip equipment? I'm cringing at the idea of paying $400+ for a heavy duty 8x8 frame!

I have indeed. I thought more about the small stuff though. But why don't you list some here and maybe some others can chime in. You all should take advantage of the fact that I'm here in China on a very long shopping trip of sorts and this is your chance to get some things you've been wanting that may be available here at lower prices.

 

[Cool Lights]

That makes sense. But I'd recommend that you still list them on the site, but list it as out of stock, with out the option to buy. That way your customers at least know that you offer the product.

Hopefully your suppliers will be able to meet the Sept / Oct timeline, as I'd definately be picking some of those lights up from you.

Perhaps your right. I believe we have an option to still list the items but mark them out of stock.

Yes I hope too on meeting deadlines. This last six months has been a bit tough for a number of reasons--our government not helping things either. When I came back here in February, I believed I would have much of what I was looking for by June ready for export. Obviously, reality happened...

1). The price of exported things is going up here thanks to the US government asking China to stop subsidizing factories that export goods. Some may cheer and say "great, the balance of trade will finally swing the other way now!" Well be careful what you ask for because you're getting it and this is where you may find out just how much of what you use on a daily basis really does come from here in China. I have a feeling this could lead to a lot of inflation since goods of many kinds are going up and in some cases won't be exported at all because there's just no profit in it now. The Chinese government has indeed succumbed to US pressure and has stopped many of the subsidy payments to Chinese factories. This has the effect of raising prices and it also makes these factories a bit less eager to help.

2). The dollar has weakened next to the Chinese currency--yen. This also has the effect of lowering our buying power over here. The amount of currency I can purchase with a dollar has significantly lowered in fact since the first time I came here in 2006.

3). These factories are super busy right now. This makes them a bit cocky. I had a lot of trouble finding things like the Blacklines this last six months because of this. There were several factories making them but some were downright "proud" of their creations--to the point it didn't make any sense to buy a clone. You'd buy the original at their prices. Really stupid thinking!

4). Materials are going up. Aluminum in particular is becoming a very expensive item! The world demand for aluminum is incredible right now.

5). False advertising. The 1200w electronic HMI ballast in particular. We found a number of them we had great hopes for but when you dug deeper we found a lot of problems with them. We're on the last one now and keeping our fingers crossed. The arri clones too. Some others that claimed to have them and we'd ask for a sample and never got it. Just stupid time wasting or bait and switch type tactics. Magnetic ballasts which I hoped would give us our super low cost solution turned out to be a total bust. Really limited the shutter speeds you could use. I wouldn't want to use one, so I figured most of you wouldn't either.


So, all this has really made my job I'm trying to do here a lot tougher to maintain the kind of pricing I have visualized and wish to offer. We're still doing it, it just takes a lot more detective work and a lot more being skeptical when someone tells us "the way it is." It's only that way if you believe it... is my motto. I can always find something somewhere else as long as I'm patient and keep my eyes on the end goal. It really has kept me on the move this year though. This is the toughest job I've ever taken on but I imagine it will be rewarding if we can keep after it until we win the product lineup I have imagined. We will eventually fill this niche for the kind of lighting (and over time other things too) that the indy market is searching for.

 

[Ryan E. Walters]

I wouldn't want to use one, so I figured most of you wouldn't either.

Yep, you are right. Thanks for maintaining the quality. If I can get a decent product that I can use day in and out and save some money, then I'll pick it up. If I just save money, and it will not get used because it is substandard, then I'll pass. I need the gear that I buy to be able to meet basic production standards and perform correctly, if it doesn't then I don't waste the money on purchasing it- I'd rather use the money to rent the gear that I need. So thanks for not settling for something just to get your product to market. I'm sure that will pay off in the end.

We will eventually fill this niche for the kind of lighting (and over time other things too) that the indy market is searching for.

Keep it up- sounds like it has been frustrating at times. If you are able to meet the Sept / Oct projected timeline great, if not, that is understandable. I'll be watching, and waiting with anticipation for when they do hit the market.

 

[puredrifting]

Hi Richard:

I think that there is a huge indie market here for decent, well made C-stands that undercut the usual suspects. Don't know if you have checked out the Amvona C-stands but IMHO, they are pretty crude and junky and they sell the heck out of them to people who can't pay $200.00 ea. for a good C-stand like a Norms or American Grip. Plus the Amvona stands generally have to be bought on Ebay to get a good deal.

Another would be to come out with decent two riser and three riser light stands, something like an equivalent to a Matthews Beefy Baby at a reasonable cost. The Matthews stands are great, but once again, the American Grip, Norms or Matthews versions are around $300.00 to $400.00 ea. If you had something of very good quality for closer to $200.00, people would buy them.

4' x 4', 6' x 6' and 8' x 8' frame/scrim/silk kits, especially if they break down to a small size, at a decent quality and low price, would be of interest to many indie filmmakers. They are pretty pricey at around $800.00 and up for the name brand stuff and really anyone filming exteriors would be interested in them.

Same with Hollywood style shiny boards. Everyone thinks you can just use a FlexFill but FlexFills are very limited for outdoor use as they flex and vibrate in the wind. The real deal shiny boards are $400.00 to $700.00 ea., depending on size and brand. A Chinese knockoff version with the frame and yolk would be of interest to the same folks.

These are just a few ideas. Another market to consider would be the jib arm market. There seem to be basically two types on the market: Real arms like the PortaJib, Sachtler, Jimmy Jib, etc. that are in the $3,000.00 to $7,000.00 category.

Then there are the "toys" like the Glidecam, Cobra, Kesseler, etc. Nothing majorly wrong with these but they are cheap, built cheaply and are crude. These tend to be in the under $1,500.00 range.

If you could source a heavy duty, professional quality knockoff of something that support larger, heavier cameras, has good movement, good quality, breaks down to a decent size with high quality hardshell cases and sell it for the $2,000.00 range, I think there could be a decent market for that as well.

Just some ideas and requests.

Dan

 

[Shawn Philip Nelson]

Ditto to puredriftings entire post.

Also are you planning on doing snoots for your HMIs and Blackline fresnels?

 

[mackfilm]

this look really nice. and the pricing is good. Do you ship to Japan?

 

[Cool Lights]

Hi Dan,

I think a lot of people would like this stuff for sure. My thoughts below...

Hi Richard:

I think that there is a huge indie market here for decent, well made C-stands that undercut the usual suspects. Don't know if you have checked out the Amvona C-stands but IMHO, they are pretty crude and junky and they sell the heck out of them to people who can't pay $200.00 ea. for a good C-stand like a Norms or American Grip. Plus the Amvona stands generally have to be bought on Ebay to get a good deal.

Yes, C-Stands have been on my mind for a while and do you know I haven't seen a single C-Stand here in China in all my travels. Just not so popular for some reason. I know they're here somewhere and can be found reasonably. But I agree, its one of the things I'd love to offer. The only one I've ever owned is a Mole I got off ebay and man is it heavy. Love it though! Very heavy duty and super hard to knock over. Wouldn't categorize it as portable at all. I imagine people would love to have a portable C-Stand to go with our new plastic portable fluorescent fixture ;-)

I've only seen the Amvona in pictures never up close. How can you miss them? They've been on Ebay forever practically:

http://cgi.ebay.com/PROFESSIONAL-PR...ryZ30080QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The reason I don't like many of these is their folded size is 39 to 40 inches. The one I want to offer would be able to fold down into something of 20" or less to fit in the same carrying case with a 55w fluorescent fixture which is generally about 23 to 25 inches long--so certainly no longer than that.

Something like this would be really nice:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Matthews-20-Dou...ryZ30080QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

This one only extends to about 63" which wouldn't be a problem for me, but I wonder if it's okay for the portable type work most are doing. Maybe we need two C-stands: a shorty for the portable case and a regular 40" type.

Another would be to come out with decent two riser and three riser light stands, something like an equivalent to a Matthews Beefy Baby at a reasonable cost. The Matthews stands are great, but once again, the American Grip, Norms or Matthews versions are around $300.00 to $400.00 ea. If you had something of very good quality for closer to $200.00, people would buy them.

I have a one riser studio type roller stand already on my site. Really heavy duty and can hold up a big top heavy load. It has a junior female receptacle at the top and thus easy to put a junior to baby adapter in their to convert it to a baby stand. I would like to offer a more portable 2 or 3 riser stand though. Same issues as with the C-Stand. Would like it to fold down to around 25 inches or less if possible for inclusion in carrying cases with fixtures like fresnel kits or fluorescent kits. Most I find are rather disappointing and can only hold up a light load of 5 lbs or so. I'm always looking though.

4' x 4', 6' x 6' and 8' x 8' frame/scrim/silk kits, especially if they break down to a small size, at a decent quality and low price, would be of interest to many indie filmmakers. They are pretty pricey at around $800.00 and up for the name brand stuff and really anyone filming exteriors would be interested in them.

Great. Added to list.

Same with Hollywood style shiny boards. Everyone thinks you can just use a FlexFill but FlexFills are very limited for outdoor use as they flex and vibrate in the wind. The real deal shiny boards are $400.00 to $700.00 ea., depending on size and brand. A Chinese knockoff version with the frame and yolk would be of interest to the same folks.

This should be super easy. I already thought about this quite a bit. Mirrored aluminum either hammered or polished like that used in fluorescent reflectors--mounted on a piece of masonite or something similarly tough and light.

These are just a few ideas. Another market to consider would be the jib arm market. There seem to be basically two types on the market: Real arms like the PortaJib, Sachtler, Jimmy Jib, etc. that are in the $3,000.00 to $7,000.00 category.

Then there are the "toys" like the Glidecam, Cobra, Kesseler, etc. Nothing majorly wrong with these but they are cheap, built cheaply and are crude. These tend to be in the under $1,500.00 range.

If you could source a heavy duty, professional quality knockoff of something that support larger, heavier cameras, has good movement, good quality, breaks down to a decent size with high quality hardshell cases and sell it for the $2,000.00 range, I think there could be a decent market for that as well.

Just some ideas and requests.

Dan

Yeah, I have to confess I've thought about this and other kinds of camera stabilizers quite a bit. I don't know that much about them but it's just a question of dedicating time to study the issues. This is great stuff and just the kind of suggestions I'm looking for. Thanks...

 

[Cool Lights]

Ditto to puredriftings entire post.

Also are you planning on doing snoots for your HMIs and Blackline fresnels?

To tell the truth I hadn't thought about it much yet but it should be pretty easy to find an existing one that would probably work to offer for them. There's gotta be one somewhere I can find. Otherwise, yes I'd have to build it.

 

[Cool Lights]

this look really nice. and the pricing is good. Do you ship to Japan?

Hopefully, once its all ready, yes we'll be offering them in Japan either directly or through an affiliate.

 

[Spartacus]

Soooo.....

 

[Cool Lights]

I'm going to the factory next week (with interpreter) to light a fire under them. Really slow right now.

 

[Spartacus]

Come on baby light my fire...
As long as This is NOT the end, I´ll beat that Doors analogy to death hehehe :costumed-smiley-047

 

[Cool Lights]

Someday when the story of all this is really told you won't believe all the hoops I've had to jump through to make this happen.

 

[Logan LeBlanc]

What's the deal w/ these? Anyone got em? Tried em? I'm interested in these and the blueline fresnels.