Canon Sales Continue to Plummet

DLD said:
For video shooters looking for affordable gear, Canon is rumored to come out with C100 MKIII. Its specs are unknown but will probably be on the FS-5 level - 4K with XF-AVC or CRL.
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If it's reasonable cost, I'd be all over that as a B-cam for our C200! I actually find the "sub-par" spec XF-AVC video from the C200 to be really good, good enough for 80% of situations overall. Sure, sometimes we want to shoot RAW. But for client needs
RAW is often overkill and all that matters is if the footage looks good, not if it's 4:2:2 or 10-bit. In putting together demo reels, I am still really happy even with our C100 MKIs AVCHD from a few years ago, that was and still is a great little camera.
 
Or, considering that there are several 6K cameras already on the market for as low as $2,000, Canon could just rename C200 as C100 MKIII and bring out C200 MKII with a 6K CRL.

PS There is a new king of shaky, out of focus footage in Sigma fp. When in focus and on a tripod, however, its 12-bit DNG looks gorgeous.
 
DLD said:
Or, considering that there are several 6K cameras already on the market for as low as $2,000, Canon could just rename C200 as C100 MKIII and bring out C200 MKII with a 6K CRL.

PS There is a new king of shaky, out of focus footage in Sigma fp. When in focus and on a tripod, however, its 12-bit DNG looks gorgeous.
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I haven't had much success yet with its autofocus... but it's nice on a gimbal. :)
 
puredrifting said:
Did you buy it or just testing for an article?
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I bought it. I needed a replacement for my A7r because the shutter crapped out, and it's old enough that I decided to replace it, and the fp seemed like a good fit for my needs... and so far I'm mostly happy with it. I have only a few frustrations with it now, most of which Sigma will address in firmware updates. The big one is not having a DCI aspect ratio option, and not having a 24fps option (it has 23.98 and 25, so leaving out 24 seems pretty dumb).
 
Tamerlin said:
I bought it. I needed a replacement for my A7r because the shutter crapped out, and it's old enough that I decided to replace it, and the fp seemed like a good fit for my needs... and so far I'm mostly happy with it. I have only a few frustrations with it now, most of which Sigma will address in firmware updates. The big one is not having a DCI aspect ratio option, and not having a 24fps option (it has 23.98 and 25, so leaving out 24 seems pretty dumb).
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Cool, keep us updated as you break it in.
 
This is a Sony release touring its newest sensor technology. In this case, it's for mobile phones. The same mobile phones that make camera sales - not just Canon's - plummet.

https://www.sony-semicon.co.jp/e/products/IS/mobile/2_2_ocl.html

If one goes by the DXO Mark rating of phones vs. the ILC's, then the rate of progress for the mobile toys is quite remarkable. A five year old iPhone 6 is rated at 73 while the current 11 Max at 117 (44/73=60%), while roughly the same age D810 was given a score of 97, with Z7 getting 99. In other words, the mobile cameras are improving at a rapid pace while the ILC's performance have generally been static within the identical time frame.

PS. If Sigma pf's focus is anything like Panasonic's, one'd need separate AF settings for the stationary vs. moving objects.
 
puredrifting said:
Cool, keep us updated as you break it in.
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I'm going to write a review of it soon(ish). I just ordered one of the Canon mount adapters so that I can use some of my other lenses on it and try a few more things out.

I probably should get bigger SD cards or a T5 soon though. The All-I codec is pretty large, and raw is even larger, obviously.
 
DLD said:
This is a Sony release touring its newest sensor technology. In this case, it's for mobile phones. The same mobile phones that make camera sales - not just Canon's - plummet.

https://www.sony-semicon.co.jp/e/products/IS/mobile/2_2_ocl.html

If one goes by the DXO Mark rating of phones vs. the ILC's, then the rate of progress for the mobile toys is quite remarkable. A five year old iPhone 6 is rated at 73 while the current 11 Max at 117 (44/73=60%), while roughly the same age D810 was given a score of 97, with Z7 getting 99. In other words, the mobile cameras are improving at a rapid pace while the ILC's performance have generally been static within the identical time frame.

PS. If Sigma pf's focus is anything like Panasonic's, one'd need separate AF settings for the stationary vs. moving objects.
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Well, mobile phones have had a lot more to improve upon than dedicated DSLR's/ILC's(not saying that what we get out of cell phone cameras isn't amazing for what they are). I can look at images from my iPhone 7 from 2016 to my iPhone X from 2017 and my iPhone 11 Pro from 2019 and see a noticeable difference from year-to-year. But none of them can touch my 5D IV from 2016. I guess to frame it another way, if you took at a body builder who has been training for years or decades already, their gains year over year are going to be much smaller and less noticeable than someone who doesn't workout and then starts to train, in earnest.
 
Run&Gun said:
Well, mobile phones have had a lot more to improve upon than dedicated DSLR's/ILC's(not saying that what we get out of cell phone cameras isn't amazing for what they are). I can look at images from my iPhone 7 from 2016 to my iPhone X from 2017 and my iPhone 11 Pro from 2019 and see a noticeable difference from year-to-year. But none of them can touch my 5D IV from 2016. I guess to frame it another way, if you took at a body builder who has been training for years or decades already, their gains year over year are going to be much smaller and less noticeable than someone who doesn't workout and then starts to train, in earnest.
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That's certainly true. But the question for the professional is do I go with an SLR/mirrorless or a dedicated video camera? The question for the consumer is do I bother lugging around a big SLR/mirrorless or just use my phone that's always with me? Unfortunately for Canon their insistance on keeping mirrors has made their products less desirable in both cases. It makes cameras bigger for consumers and the inability to use a viewfinder is a mark against them in the professional field.

Over the past 6 years I've bought - Panasonic GH4, Panasonic G7, Sony A6500, Sony A7SII, and Fuji XT-3. I would have preferred to buy Canon since my main camera is a C200 (was a C300). But, quite simply their SLRs do not have some of the necessary features I need and downsides I don't want to live with. I mean that's 5 lost sales for Canon. If they keep insisting they don't want to sell me cameras then I expect their sales to continue to go down. They need to up their SLR/Mirrorless game.
 
The 5D series was generally priced at ~ $3,500, so naturally, it's going to be far superior to a $600-$1,000 smartphone. And, obviously, smartphone camera modules had much further to travel. But the problem with the bodybuilder analogy - Markus Rühl rules! - is that the phone-video jury is an average consumer and he doesn't want to invest $3,500 + glass into a pro tier camera. And, on some specs like resolution, these new upscale smartphones are on the level of the medium format cameras already. Now, try taking a selfie with GFX100 and then slide it into your back pocket.

So, who's left? You've got your sport/action/BiF shooters. But the portraits and landscapes have become DIY projects (have a new friend from the old country who takes gorgeous photos with a fairly outdated smartphone) for most people. I'd say that, the generation of photo-video hybrids after the next one, will be all rebadged Sony's a la A7III = Z6 = Sigma fp = S1, the same sensor with minor tweaks, different bodies and mounts and a different feature crippling. All made in the same plant in sequential order.

The point being is that lower priced cameras supported the R&D and the overhead for the prosumer/enthusiast buyers. With only the high end remaining, the Japanese Big 4/5/6 has very bleak prospects ahead.
 
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Found this off Vladimir on Image Sensor World, who found it via ... oh, never mind. Here's the text. The highlights are mine.

"With the continuous innovation and upgrading of technology and the promotion of 5G networks, multi-camera 2020 will increase the function of video shooting. It is expected that starting from the second half of 2020, the multi-camera + ToF ranging technology will slowly start to enhance the effect of background blur. In addition, post-shooting ToF combined with AI algorithms has the opportunity to improve the accuracy of indoor navigation, which is also a key focus of technological development. Therefore , Sigmaintell believes that the mainstream rear camera in the future will develop in the direction of main camera wide angle + video shooting + large telephoto + ToF.

The upgrade of 48M and above pixels accelerated, with a market share of about 9% in the third quarter. Among them, Sony accounts for approximately 41%, Samsung accounts for approximately 56%, and OV accounts for approximately 3%. Due to the accelerated replacement of 48M and the insufficient production capacity of high-resolution camera sensor wafers, Sigmaintell expects supply shortages from Q4 to Q1 2019.

According to Sigmaintell data , global shipments of 48M camera sensors will exceed 450 million units in 2020."
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http://image-sensors-world.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2019-12-10T20:50:00+02:00&max-results=10
 
That's the sad part. Canon easily has the capability to win the camera wars, if they so chose.
But they decided that their feature crippling, market segmentation was the right strategy. These are the results.
I don't think anyone disputes that Canon has good technology, lenses and that the cameras make great images,
but they have pissed off the market for decades now and are paying the price.

In the grander scheme of things, all of the big 4 are dying as far as camera sales though so maybe in the end, it doesn't really matter?
 
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