1DC: Canon 1Dx mkII to shoot 4k video, 5D mkIV not so much. Also: C100 4k witin 18 months?

AndreeOnline

AndreeOnline

Veteran
Canon Rumors publishes a CR2 rumor about future DSLR plans and teases an EF mount 4k product, that isn't a DSLR within 18 months. I'm aware of a potential C500 mkII, but I don't think they mean that here.

1Dx mkII gets 4k but isn't video oriented.
5D mkIV doesn't get 4k at launch!? That would be a bomb.
 
I always thought it strange Canon launched a C100 mk2 so late in the game as far as 4k is concerned. I think the 5D Mk IV wont have 4k and there will be a 4k upgrade option on the C100 mk2.
 
I don't think Canon should release 4k anything. I think they should stick to 1080P like a religion. Its kinda like the clothes you wore in middle school....eventually it will be cool again. When we're shooting 16K and Canon is still truck'n along with good 'ol 1080P....well...it'll just be damn cute. Then they can still charge a premium and call it vintage.


Honestly though, I love Canon. I would love to continue to use Canon cameras as A cams on set....but waiting for them to get with the plan is totally exhausting.
 
Time to deal with reality folks. Canon makes great lenses. They make "good enough" cameras for photographers. Love the lenses I own. Still on a 5D3 but I don't see myself ever buying a dedicated video camera from Canon. I would rather throw my glass on a RED or Sony or even the GH4 if I'm shooting anything extremely important. They totally blew it but now it's becoming down right comical following their new releases.
 
Out of 629 digital cameras and their iterations on B&H ranked according to their popularity/sales, A7RII is listed at #1 and A7SII is at #2 (5DMKIII is #3) Would Canon forfeit that market niche to Sony entirely?

Sorry, this rumor I don't buy. 4K ought to be a given in every camera $600 and up and Canon already has its high MPX line with 5Ds/r. Why would someone buy a 24-28 MPX camera for about the same price they could have a 50 MPX one? A slightly better dynamic range? Too close for comfort. On the other hand, an inclusion of quality video recording would definitely set it apart from what is already there.*

*OK, maybe this will be called 2KNO4K4EVER but I don't think it'll be so.
 
Samir Patel said:
Time to deal with reality folks. Canon makes great lenses. They make "good enough" cameras for photographers. Love the lenses I own. Still on a 5D3 but I don't see myself ever buying a dedicated video camera from Canon. I would rather throw my glass on a RED or Sony or even the GH4 if I'm shooting anything extremely important. They totally blew it but now it's becoming down right comical following their new releases.
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Shot some sit-down interviews last week for a high-profile college game. One of my friends that I shoot with text me after seeing some of them air and said he liked them. He asked me if I shot them on one of my VariCam's or F55 (we actually shoot a lot of them on tape still so they can be shipped around easily). I told him I shot them on my C300. He asked why and I said simple, I like the way my 300 looks better than my 55.
 
Here's the way out for Canon - make a smaller, cheaper and just as good version/facsimile of FS5. Or, if you will, a higher quality interchangeable lens XC-10. Put an APS-C sensor into it, an oversampled 4K, dual-pixel AF, etc.. Price it at $4,000 and it should sell like hot cakes. It won't be in the form of the DSLR but then it would make the Canon Rumor rumor more realistic. From the technological angle, reworking XC10 into a low end pro gear seems quite doable too.

To me, this would still be too much separation from model to model and 5D IV should still have 4K just because this is what modern cameras do ... but, let's say there's an XC-20 out there with all the features I described and I think it'll please a lot of people. After all, FS5 has next to nothing to do with the photo world either.
 
If canon made a C100mkwhatever that shot 4k up to JUST 48P, I'd be all over that. Hell..give me 30P and I'm done. lol All to SD cards and under $7k and I'd buy two right now. Love my C100mk2. I have a 1DC for photos and teetering on the edge for the C300MK2...though just not able to pull the trigger.
 
mmmmm... The C100 MKII appeared abruptly 2 years after the MKI, so I think a C100 MKIII would not be out of the question for announcement at NAB 2016 with a launch later in the year, i.e. again ~2 years later. It's more of a prosumer camera so a more rapid cycle than the C300 MKII makes sense.

The XC-10's 4K 305mps XFAVC should make it to the C100 MKIII, and an equivalent 1080p 50mps+ XFAVC.

We won't get 12 bit but hopefully 10 bit HD and 8 bit 4K. We probably wont get HFR other than 1080p60.

Hopefully an incremental update on the DPAF and other features, but I'm really happy with the rest of the C100 MKII feature set as it is. I'd be happy with them just concentrating on 4K and XFAVC for the next release.

That to me would be my perfect camera. I'd go for one over the FS5. So please please please Canon don't **** it up! I can wait until NAB :-).

If they don't put 4K in the 5dIV then they have conceded the DSLR video market to Sony.

That was supposed to be a primary feeder market into the C100.
 
Matt Turner said:
I think a C100 MKIII would not be out of the question for announcement at NAB 2016 with a launch later in the year…
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Very similar to my own thoughts.

A C100 mkIII with internal 4k and at least 2k 10bit with the Auto Focus from the new C300 (including the little indicator showing if you're front/back when doing manual pulls) would be sweet. Add a usable codec to that and…

I'll keep my deposit with the Red Raven a bit longer, but I can't see that camera working for me as it stands now. We'll see.
 
The alleged reluctance to do 4K in 5D MK IV has some legit reasons behind it. 1D X MKII should have 4K but not enough video features to cannibalize the sales of C300 MKII. Likewise, Canon would not want to cannibalize the 1D X MKII sales with a 4K enabled - at least, from the start - 5D MK IV. IMO, chances of XC-20 (improved XC-10, as described by me above) are much higher than of C100 MK II (or C200, as was rumored as far as a year ago) because it would not threaten either 1D X MKII (superior photo capabilities) or C100 MKII (a 1080p workhorse). Overall, Canon must be setting up their lineup in a sort of a checker board - stills/hybrid at X price - video at that same price - a stills/hybrid at double of the X price - video at double of the X price. What they don't want to do is to make two cameras with similar features in the same price range.
 
ReelWorksMedia said:
I don't think Canon should release 4k anything. I think they should stick to 1080P like a religion. Its kinda like the clothes you wore in middle school....eventually it will be cool again. When we're shooting 16K and Canon is still truck'n along with good 'ol 1080P....well...it'll just be damn cute. Then they can still charge a premium and call it vintage.


Honestly though, I love Canon. I would love to continue to use Canon cameras as A cams on set....but waiting for them to get with the plan is totally exhausting.
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16k? Never ends this wheel vain of consumerism.....
 
Run&Gun said:
Shot some sit-down interviews last week for a high-profile college game. One of my friends that I shoot with text me after seeing some of them air and said he liked them. He asked me if I shot them on one of my VariCam's or F55 (we actually shoot a lot of them on tape still so they can be shipped around easily). I told him I shot them on my C300. He asked why and I said simple, I like the way my 300 looks better than my 55.
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Amen
 
DLD said:
Here's the way out for Canon - make a smaller, cheaper and just as good version/facsimile of FS5. Or, if you will, a higher quality interchangeable lens XC-10. Put an APS-C sensor into it, an oversampled 4K, dual-pixel AF, etc.. Price it at $4,000 and it should sell like hot cakes.
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That sounds great, especially the specs...but it's not how Canon operates. Of course it's very presumptive of me, but from watching them it seems that Canon looks at their customers and then decides what they need. Canon then makes a camera that they think will suit that need for the next year or two. In their opinion. Take the C100 for example. They imagine this camera to be a perfect tool for the event videographer. It has autofocus for single person operation, uses cheap SD cards, and what wedding filmer is delivering in 4k? None, so no need to include it. The C300II has 4k because NHK in Japan is requiring it now and the C300II is intended for TV shooters. Ask the guys who have started using the C300II, and they love it. Why? Because it answers a lot of the questions they were asking. There are cameras that have better spec sheets, or cost less, or whatever metric you can dream up, but the C300II meets the needs of the people it is intended for.
The original 5DII that kicked off this whole DSLR video movement had the video function included because the newspapers asked for it. They wanted their photographers to be able to grab quick video clips without having to carry two cameras. It wasn't because Canon figured out how to make a beautiful cinematic image on a DSLR and wanted to change our industry.
The Canon method of building things to meet a specific need actually works fairly well from a business perspective, but it can also be a little limiting for innovation. Sony on the other hand has been very eager to release products purely because they can, even if it's answering a question nobody asked. They've pushed out things like a music player that lights up and rolls around to the music for $500. Yeah, it was cool that they could figure out how to make that, but who really needed it? But then again, they did come up with the Walkman.
 
Well, judging from posts in this thread, people do want an affordable 4K camcorder style product in the FS5 range (and they are getting it with FS5).

Judging from folks on the various Canon forums, most stills fans couldn't care about video.

I also assume - shouldn't I assume a little? - that the internal components of 5D MKIV, XC10 and the projected XC20, excluding the sensor, could be very similar. Even the media interface, sans the end wiring, can be the same. Voila! The video hating bird shooters get their low light marvel and a pixel binning 1080p while the video shooters get their EF mount FS5 copy. And it's basically the same camera and no one is wiser.
 
Rated as a 1 on the scale of 1-5 (higher is better) but, IMO, it looks more credible than what the Canon Rumors posters think. They think the pixel count is too low but, for sports photography, it means a higher frame rate and that's more important than a few more (mega) pixels. 4K in 60fps (once again, frame rate for sport slow-motion). I assume it'll have the same codec/internal bit rate as XC-10.

http://www.canonrumors.com/canon-eos-1d-x-mark-ii-spec-list-surfaces-cr1/
 
DLD said:
Well, judging from posts in this thread, people do want an affordable 4K camcorder style product in the FS5 range (and they are getting it with FS5).

Judging from folks on the various Canon forums, most stills fans couldn't care about video.

I also assume - shouldn't I assume a little? - that the internal components of 5D MKIV, XC10 and the projected XC20, excluding the sensor, could be very similar. Even the media interface, sans the end wiring, can be the same. Voila! The video hating bird shooters get their low light marvel and a pixel binning 1080p while the video shooters get their EF mount FS5 copy. And it's basically the same camera and no one is wiser.
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Absolutely agree with you, most consumer in the world do not care about 4K

Many people bought the A7R2 or A7S2 and never shoot 4K, that is why they was barely anyone buying the XC10

For many consumers and even professionals they do not have the computer Hardware to deal with 4K, even the 100megabit 4K file from these Sony/Panasonic camera. I have been answering what PC to buy questions for the last 2 years in forums round the world.


As for Canon, they are making a hell of a profit on Lens, most Sony camera use them, BM use them. Not selling camera is not a problem.

As soon as canon is putting 4K into their $3000 consumer cameras, I will need to start buying 6K/8K camera.
 
cookinghusband said:
As soon as canon is putting 4K into their $3000 consumer cameras, I will need to start buying 6K/8K camera.
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Well, they already put it in a $2000 camera, the XC10 and their 8K camera is announced, so there you go.

If Canon does not put 4K into the 5D Mark IV or does not announce a 5D C with it, they could at least put DCI 2K in it, together with log gamma.
 
Its so simple Canon...
- C100Mk2 3000usd
- C100Mk2 with 4K upgrade firmware 5000-6000usd
1080p 50mp like the c300 mark1 and 100p-120p 10bits 4.2.2
4k 100mb 8bits 4.2.0 50p or just 25p

Or just buy a FS5 and give up the waiting...
 
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