Other: BlackMagic Cinema camera!!!! 2.5k for 3k...

Thanks Kholi for your reply to my comment.
Also, can someone explain to me that if the ungraded footage looks like it does (flat and all washed out) then does it look like that on the monitor while shooting as well? If so then how the heck do you know if your lighting, white balance, etc is good. This would drive me crazy not knowing. I realize other raw and s-log type cameras shoot same way, just wondering how the shooter deals with it in general.
 
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Kholi said:
Here's why I out and out disagree with you:

EVERY camera looks good with thousands of dollars put behind it. Every single one. I don't want test footage from a multi million dollar set, I don't need it.

I want to see skin, lowlight, blown out highlights, the absolute WORSE conditions before I make a purchase. If this represents the worst of it, then it only gets better when there's time and money.

So, yeah, I completely disagree with you, and I'm very glad that it was John Brawley that they chose, someone who's worked with the best equipment out there on serious productions and proves that he knows his way around cinema. Just look at his blog.

I'll take him as my primary backyard footage camera tester over most ANY day.
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Agree. And there is no need to insult a fellow DVXuser by referring to his footage as "crap".
 
ripupthehwy said:
also, can someone explain to me that if the ungraded footage looks like it does (flat and all washed out) then does it look like that on the monitor while shooting as well? If so then how the heck do you know if your lighting, white balance, etc is good. This would drive me crazy not knowing. I realize other raw and s-log type cameras shoot same way, just wondering how the shooter deals with it in general.
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It's termed Viewing Lut. It basically places a "look" on the video feed, that's how you judge your image. The safe rule is that if you aren't cooking or underexposing anything in that lut drastically, your log or raw will be as flexible as can be.

At the end of the day, it's up to the colorist finishing it to make whatever's done on set shine. This is gonna be a major hurdle for the community, but I know someone like Samuel H will come up with custom and FREE luts for the user group.
 
ripupthehwy said:
also, can someone explain to me that if the ungraded footage looks like it does (flat and all washed out) then does it look like that on the monitor while shooting as well? If so then how the heck do you know if your lighting, white balance, etc is good. This would drive me crazy not knowing. I realize other raw and s-log type cameras shoot same way, just wondering how the shooter deals with it in general.
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You shoot tests and then follow the process all through post.

There was a time that most DPs went into the grading suite while the film was in the finishing phase.

Now you can do it yourself with Resolve.

Also, most good cameras let you put a LUT on the monitor output so you can give the producer a nice gamma curve and keep everyone happy.
 
ripupthehwy said:
I really REALLY don't understand why they wouldn't have some awesome kick ass footage from the camera on display at the NAB. I mean, some PROFESSIONAL looking footage. Instead they are letting it be judged by some guy's run and gun demo footage on the web. Very poor marketing. But maybe they've learned that so many care about specs more than image. So what are they hiding? hmmm. I could understand if they just got the camera built last week or something. Or it was just a prototype still in development. But come on...the cameras supposed to ship in about 90 days and all we have is this crap??? I'd say they are definitely putting their best foot forward - the features - and leaving their not so good foot behind - the image it produces. Seriously though we won't know crap until someone like a Bloom or Green gets hold of one of these cams and runs it through the paces. So why anyone would pay money for it before hand is beyond me. :-) Hopefully it won't disappoint and simply somebody dropped the ball on getting footage to showcase at the show.
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I don't care what you have shot or produced, but the guy who tested the camera and has been kindly sharing his experience with us does not deserve a comment like this. This crap you called these footages? That's rather harsh, don't you think? And I think John Brawley is a good person to test a prototype cinema camera.
 
ripupthehwy said:
I really REALLY don't understand why they wouldn't have some awesome kick ass footage from the camera on display at the NAB. I mean, some PROFESSIONAL looking footage. Instead they are letting it be judged by some run and gun demo footage on the web. Very poor marketing. But maybe they've learned that so many care about specs more than image. So what are they hiding? hmmm. I could understand if they just got the camera built last week or something. Or it was just a prototype still in development. But come on...the cameras supposed to ship in about 90 days and all we have is this crap??? I'd say they are definitely putting their best foot forward - the features - and leaving their not so good foot behind - the image it produces. Seriously though we won't know crap until someone like a Bloom or Green gets hold of one of these cams and runs it through the paces. So why anyone would pay money for it before hand is beyond me. :-) Hopefully it won't disappoint and simply somebody dropped the ball on getting footage to showcase at the show.
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We must be looking at different footage, man. To me, what John Brawley posted looks fantastic.
 
I can't wait to see f.95 footage with this camera...but of course I'll have to wait. The Noktors are soft and dreamlike wide open...for those after (extremely) shallow depth of field this might be the perfect combination. And to those who question the value of a M43 mount over the EF mount...it's cheaper to make fast M43 glass.
 
bumkicho said:
I don't care what you have shot or produced, but the guy who tested the camera and has been kindly sharing his experience with us does not deserve a comment like this. This crap you called these footages? That's rather harsh, don't you think? And I think John Brawley is a good person to test a prototype cinema camera.
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I have to agree with ripupthehwry, the footage I seen so far is like really bad dslr footage, in fact, I haven't seen any dslr look like that. The only thing that keeps me afloat on this camera is the specs, but its also beyond me why would anyone even pre order this cam out of those clips... people are so willing to spend $3000...

Also, how will that camera work in a professional environment? It looks like a one man camera, because, I can't see any DP lighting from that monitor alone, and if you need to carry your laptop around with you, to use this camera, it's just nonsense...

Don't get me wrong, I love the specs, but the footage, its at best mundane. I have to wait and see what else can be done with it.
 
Nuno Dias said:
I have to agree with ripupthehwry, the footage I seen so far is like really bad dslr footage, in fact, I haven't seen any dslr look like that. The only thing that keeps me afloat on this camera is the specs, but its also beyond me why would anyone even pre order this cam out of those clips... people are so willing to spend $3000...

Also, how will that camera work in a professional environment? It looks like a one man camera, because, I can't see any DP lighting from that monitor alone, and if you need to carry your laptop around with you, to use this camera, it's just nonsense...

Don't get me wrong, I love the specs, but the footage, its at best mundane. I have to wait and see what else can be done with it.
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Why would you only use this monitor? It has an hdsdi port.
 
Nuno Dias said:
I have to agree with ripupthehwry, the footage I seen so far is like really bad dslr footage, in fact, I haven't seen any dslr look like that. The only thing that keeps me afloat on this camera is the specs, but its also beyond me why would anyone even pre order this cam out of those clips... people are so willing to spend $3000...
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I don't know how you're viewing the footage, but on my end it looks way better than most DSLR footage I've seen (taking into consideration the whole Vimeo compression).

Also, how will that camera work in a professional environment? It looks like a one man camera, because, I can't see any DP lighting from that monitor alone, and if you need to carry your laptop around with you, to use this camera, it's just nonsense...
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The same way one works with any camera... by attaching a monitor via HD-SDI. In fact, this camera is MUCH better positioned to use external monitors, compared to ANY other DSLR currently out there. Mini-HDMI is an AWFUL connector.
 
Does anyone here have pull with BlackMagic?

Can we get a Phillip Bloom, or equivalent, to test this camera PLEASE?

I want to thank John for his excellent footage, which I liked a lot. Also Kholi and the other moderators, for keeping this thing in line.

However, I cant GO THROUGH 90 more days of this yeah / neah / what / Holy H%%% type posts.

Can someone get Blackmagic to shoot some other footage test please?

thanks
 
Nuno Dias said:
I have to agree with ripupthehwry, the footage I seen so far is like really bad dslr footage, in fact, I haven't seen any dslr look like that. The only thing that keeps me afloat on this camera is the specs, but its also beyond me why would anyone even pre order this cam out of those clips... people are so willing to spend $3000.
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Have to disagree with you. This basic footage and the shot of the girl to my eyes looks so much more filmic than DSLR's. Even this basic stuff looks more filmic than the C300 footage I've seen, which looks like video to my eyes. But hey, if you don't like it or want it don't buy it. You made your opinion known, but there's no reason to keep trashing this after you've been heard. Take it elsewhere.

And I definitely like Brawley's tests. I'm not a huge fan of seeing super polished stuff that gives the wrong impression. Those million dollar promos that have footage that has been color corrected and sharpened are misleading. I'd rather see this stuff that's loose and uncontrolled but still a decent exposure and frame to judge image potential.

Keep posting John and thanks for sharing.
 
"Can someone get Blackmagic to shoot some other footage test please?"

It's already been stated that the camera is a beta test and not finished yet. They have no reason to release more footage until it's done cooking. The very fact that you're desiring more footage seems like they've done something right.

As for the recent negative comments on the footage: if you don't notice, or don't appreciate 13+ stops of dynamic range for $3000 bucks, then go buy something else. End of story.
 
Random thoughts:
  1. Thank you John Brawley. The only thing more I would wish for are DNG's but I respect BMD's right to restrict distribution of that and anything else you shot.
  2. I hope a histogram is high up on the development list - for release or soon after. Zebras are so...video and histograms fit much better with requirements for setting exposure for a RAW image, especially if viewing log.
  3. I haven't seen anything about the Remote port. EDIT: It's standard LANC. Oh well, maybe more sophisticated remote functions can be implemented via Thunderbolt or the USB.
  4. The Thunderbolt connection has even more potential. This camera is really taking off, so I'd imagine just about every accessory or bit of software that BM had thought of developing when they decided to make this camera is being seriously considered for rapid development.
 
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