rahulvictor
Active member
Awesome, thanks for breaking it down and including the recommendation on the windshields!
Oh and I mainly plan to use the mic for dialogue basically....
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Best Mic under $5000?
- Thread starter rahulvictor
- Start date
Awesome, thanks for breaking it down and including the recommendation on the windshields!
Oh and I mainly plan to use the mic for dialogue basically....
rahulvictor
Active member
Woah, definitely not $50k. If you are including the Red, the new ones coming out are much cheaper (body 5-10k, lens 5-10k) sometime later this year. I will consider renting/hiring people when the time comes. But owning the basic pieces of equipment does enable a lot of flexibility like being able to test shoot, etc. In fact, my friend did a music video semi-recently and half of his $2k budget was gone on the Red for a one day shoot. Times that out by a 25 day feature shoot and that's $25k (less with discounts granted) and you can see why owning the equipment seems more economical. Not to mention the fact that I could make multiple movies with the worst case assumption that Hollywood/studios do not come calling after your first movie.
As far as who would work for free, you're right many pros own their own stuff, some won't though, including fresh film grads for example, so they will be eager to work where they can use decent equipment and get experience. It makes sense in my head anyways. And after all, who hasn't worked for free at some point in movies
Ted Spencer
Veteran
well I own this one which is 24K gold
Me too!
MattinSTL
Sound Modulator
I knew there was some knowledge behind those witticisms Matt
I know that soundmen/purists would like to have all the tools available to them to turn out a great product, unfortunately, I'm unsure if having so much equipment is practical on a low-budget shoot where resources (time/money/etc) are scarce. I don't expect to have 'Hollywood' sound with 2-3 different mics, but there does need to be a trade-off between quality and simplicity, where we can squeeze in numerous setups into a production day and still have it sound good. Looking at some case-studies of ultra-low budget shoots as well as having worked on sets of some ucla thesis films, it seems like all they have is a soundman (with headphones), boom-pole, mic, and some sort of contraption that he mixes into (recorder type thing)....not that the sound is by any means perfect, but again, it obviously depends on the sound person as well...I will be looking at all the products you mentioned, thanks!
Sanken CS3e
13' graphite or carbon fiber pole
Blimp/suspension system
2 x 25' XLR cables
1 x Sony 7506 or Sennheiser HD280 headphones
2 or 3 channel mixer
That's as butt-simple as you can get it. One mic that will excel in most situations, and be acceptable in the rest... and the other stuff that a guy holding that mic needs to get it in close and control the volume to cam.
Done.
But I'll look for your future posts wondering why this or that didn't work out... because all those tools I listed... is nothing... not even scratching the surface... but that short list above will be enough that you'll have plenty of times where you nail it... and that's why you'll come back asking what happened in the times you don't. The list above will give you total Hollywood sound on many occasions.
Have fun! :cheesy:
Gohanto
Veteran
Your logic on the Red is a little off. The body alone is 17.5k, two basic zoom lenses are 15k, and you need $20k+ on top for other Red basics (hard drives, handheld rig, EVF, ect...) that operating the camera without would be absurd. Plus owning gear means you'd want it insured 24/7 instead of just covering it under your 25 day production insurance.
This translates over to sound perfectly as sure, a Schoeps cmc641 is only $2k, but the combination of support gear and knowledge of how to use them are invaluable.
The worst that can happen is that your mixer doesn't know how to record double system and the hard drive crashes so you lose all your audio for weeks of shooting (because he forgot to back it up). Or your boom op and/or mixer might not know how to get the best sound out of scene and will leave you with tracks that need a lot of expensive noise reduction and/or ADR and will still likely not sound as good as it could have if they'd just got it correct on set by using the right mic.
The question comes down to...
Do you want to invest in making high quality productions with good audio?
Or do you want to invest in gear?
Most good mixers and boom ops aren't going to slow down productions on meaningless "super minor tweaks that only matter in $50 million dollar movies", but actually know their gear well and, from experience, are able to get setup much quicker and with better results than unexperienced or student crews can.
Crews working with new gear they haven't used before get things lost, waste time looking for it, and/or break it.
Rippie
Veteran
Nice! Then you know what Im saying when I say
it's my favorite mic I own.
Tacky looking as hell, (the rapper's used to love it though)
but wonderful sounding.
I take it yours is the L47MP as well?
dave edgar
Member
As far as who would work for free, you're right many pros own their own stuff, some won't though, including fresh film grads for example, so they will be eager to work where they can use decent equipment and get experience. It makes sense in my head anyways. And after all, who hasn't worked for free at some point in movies [/quote]
Well, I was a fresh film grad once, and I sure wasn't a "pro" until about 5 years after that : )
[/quote]Well, I was a fresh film grad once, and I sure wasn't a "pro" until about 5 years after that : )
rahulvictor
Active member
I think you're thinking about the Red as it currently stands. Check this page out on their new cameras coming out later this year:
http://www.red.com/epic_scarlet/
like i said bodies are 5-10k (or there's ridiculously nice ones past 28k, but are overkill for me) lens i would expect in the same ballpark and accessories also haven't been priced yet, but i certainly would hope that they would bring costs down on those as well. Rental houses seem to make a killing on these things...insurance would be nice, but I don't know if it's practical for my purposes, i'll just sleep with the camera
On your second point, you might be right, I'm planning on making two shorts at least before attempting a feature, and what I'll probably do is one with pros at their cost and one without and then compare. I'd love to be able to pay people for their skills/equipment, but when I'm not making money on a film (in fact losing it) then it makes things tough. And really I'm just exploring both avenues, which I think is due diligence on my part. Ideally, I'd find THE soundmixer and THE cinematographer who'd be excited by the projects and see some potential in them and me and would work on multiple projects until we'd all hopefully get our break
rahulvictor
Active member
Awesome, do you have any experience with the Sennheiser 416 and schoeps mk41 as well? If so, how do you think they compare to the CS3e?
Also I'm curious, what could potentially go wrong in those situations when the sound does not come out so well? Does that have to do with situational things (ie the mic is not good in certain circumstances)?
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Rippie
Veteran
Rippie
Veteran
Ya know, I just got private messaged on here from some guy saying..
Why do you have to be like that, you're not being helpful..
next time keep it to myself.
Nice eh?
Kinda amusing to me concidering im TRYING to help by pointing him to the piles of info
on these forums discussing his exact question.
Why do I even bother.
Why do you have to be like that, you're not being helpful..
next time keep it to myself.
Nice eh?
Kinda amusing to me concidering im TRYING to help by pointing him to the piles of info
on these forums discussing his exact question.
Why do I even bother.
rahulvictor
Active member
Haha, it's cool, I didn't take offense...I will/have searched the forums, I was just wondering of Matt's opinion in particular, maybe I can find that as well...
*scurries off into the Land of Search*
rahulvictor
Active member
As far as who would work for free, you're right many pros own their own stuff, some won't though, including fresh film grads for example, so they will be eager to work where they can use decent equipment and get experience. It makes sense in my head anyways. And after all, who hasn't worked for free at some point in movies
Well, I was a fresh film grad once, and I sure wasn't a "pro" until about 5 years after that : )[/quote]
Then I'll try to grab people at a 4 year mark
Ted Spencer
Veteran
Yep, that it is.
I like it a lot on acoustic guitar, some vocals, and as a room mic.
I've been collecting mics for a very long time though, and have about 30 of 'em including some exotics like a Telefunken U47, a Stephen Paul modified U87 and too many more to mentioned given I'm risking a brag-alert as it is. So it's got some competition in the ol' mic closet...
: )
rahulvictor
Active member
Hey Dave, thanks for the recommendation, I've already looked into the MK41 a little bit and will continue to research up on it.
Some of the slight downsides of the mic I've read is that you need to make sure you get in as close as possible to the source (I know that could probably be said about all mics, but I mean it's less "forgiving") and it's not quite as good outdoors but brilliant indoors. What do you think about those things having used the mic?
Rippie
Veteran
It wasnt meant to be offensive.
I know he has discussed his opinion on your exact question a number of times.
A quick search will save you from waiting for his response,
and of course will save him from having to type it again
Rippie
Veteran
very very nice.
It's not a brag alert discussing the gear you own.
I love my L47 but yes, if I owned an actual U47 I probably wouldnt think
it was quite as hot. Although, with those 47's the condition always comes into play.
Im curious now, how does the L47 hold up against your U47.
Enough of a difference to justify the price diff? Name recognition alone is worth some of the price diff
for people shopping studio time that actually pay attention to the gear avail.
Its sad really, since I closed my studio 6+ years ago I barely use my studio mics, they just sit
there in their cases.
rahulvictor
Active member
So it's been some time since my original ignorant question, and in the interim I have not bought a mic (a good thing, considering how impulsive I can be) but have been doing some research, and I'm better understanding the intricacies of mic-ing a production. With that being said, I'm still sold on buying my own equipment (the idea that audio equipment doesn't reduce in value much over time is big) and also I'd like to keep it to 2 mics for now - one for exterior and one for interiors. Again this would mainly be used for dialogue. I have a chance to buy a mkh 416T for about $450 or I can get a NTG-3 for a little more. But I'm also planning at some point to get a CS3e or Schoeps MK41.
But I really want to shoot a short film now, CS3e or not, and since it will mostly be interiors I was wondering if you guys would advise I get either the 416T or NTG-3 or get another mic that's better suited for interiors? Also it seems like a good idea to get a 416 no matter what, because if all other mics fail for whatever reason, the 416 seems to be ultra resilient and dependable, no? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
But I really want to shoot a short film now, CS3e or not, and since it will mostly be interiors I was wondering if you guys would advise I get either the 416T or NTG-3 or get another mic that's better suited for interiors? Also it seems like a good idea to get a 416 no matter what, because if all other mics fail for whatever reason, the 416 seems to be ultra resilient and dependable, no? Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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Noiz2
Sound Ninja
After reading through this thread I was completely surprised that it wasn't a joke posting. I mean does the OP actually expect that Hollywood is going to "come knocking" after his first lowbudget short??? I didn't look but did this thread start on April 1st?
But on the off chance your serious I think you should reexamine you assumptions. Your soon to be professional doesn't want to work with the good stuff they want to OWN the good stuff. And working for free isn't going to get them there. Also I know few professionals that loan out mics, and there is a reason. They are fairly fragile and can be damaged in subtle ways that are hard to notice at first and the tend to be pricey. Youv'e talked about the mics a lot but what are you connecting them to? Not the Scarlet I hope (BTW it's the Scarlet your talking about which is not what people are talking about when they say RED). So you should be looking for a recorder/ mixer and then you get into post. Are you planning on getting a PT HD settup too? At the risk of getting PMed, I think your logic is way off. Getting hands on is going to be one of the least tempting carrots you can hang out there and will most likely attract folks who you really don't want working on your film.
But on the off chance your serious I think you should reexamine you assumptions. Your soon to be professional doesn't want to work with the good stuff they want to OWN the good stuff. And working for free isn't going to get them there. Also I know few professionals that loan out mics, and there is a reason. They are fairly fragile and can be damaged in subtle ways that are hard to notice at first and the tend to be pricey. Youv'e talked about the mics a lot but what are you connecting them to? Not the Scarlet I hope (BTW it's the Scarlet your talking about which is not what people are talking about when they say RED). So you should be looking for a recorder/ mixer and then you get into post. Are you planning on getting a PT HD settup too? At the risk of getting PMed, I think your logic is way off. Getting hands on is going to be one of the least tempting carrots you can hang out there and will most likely attract folks who you really don't want working on your film.