Basics of Video Shooting

A

Amir Vii

Member
Hello Everyone

I’m new to this forum and the reason I joined this forum is because I just ordered my Canon 7D few minutes ago. I’m way too excited and can’t wait till I get my hands on it in couple of days. I have always had this passion about making films, music videos and short clips and now that I ordered the Canon 7D, I think I should start going after my passion.

I just need some basic tips on how to take HD videos using this camera. Like the ISO, White Balance and everything that I need to know to get me started. What program do you guys use for editing? What settings do you shoot in order to get that HD cinematic look? I also ordered 16GB Memory Card with an extra battery so that should take care of the low battery and low memory problems while shooting videos.

These are the two lenses that I got. The 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM Lens came with my Camera but I also ordered another Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 XR Di II LD Lens.

Thanks in advance
 
Congratulations on your purchase, and welcome to the board. You've bought a very fine camera. And the Tamron lens you purchased should serve you well.

There are many ways to approach learning how to start taking video with your camera. But I am going to suggest you bypass the fast approach and do what most people SHOULD do, but won''t. And that is to take a course in beginning photography. There is no better way to learn the fundamentals of exposure, light, shadow, composition, and all those things that make wonderful, cinematic images.

You can purchase a book, and try to work through it yourself, and that's certainly a good route also, but there is just no replacement for having an instructor who can not only answer your questions, but help you to learn to see. To really SEE. Once you understand the basics of photography, you will be free to photograph or take video of what you see and capture the essence of it.

By the way, that 16GB card will last you about 45-50 minutes of shooting HD.

You might want to update your profile to say where you are located, as there might be some members near you that can offer assistance. And if you want to know about video editing programs, you're going to need to tell us about the computer you have. You're about to jump onto a VERY steep learning curve.

I couldn't even imagine trying to use a 7D as my very first video camera.

Best of luck.
 
Take your time and just enjoy it. You can't learn it all right away. Learn the basic of the camera and work from there. Make sure you get a tripod. There is a lot you can learn from this website too. There are a lot of good filmmakers who are glad to help you. Good luck.
 
thank you guys..glad to be here

i have a dell laptop:
4 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 9600M GS, Intel (R) Core(TM) 2 DUO, 150GB Hard Drive

im not really planning on making a clip as soon as i get the camera..ill play around with it for a while..any books or links that would help me as a starter?
 
I live in the United States, and so everything I have written below pertains to my personal experiences shooting in what I would consider "standard" or "normal" situations.

Amir Vii said:
Like the ISO, White Balance and everything that I need to know to get me started.
Click to expand...

ISO
Stick to multiples of 160: 160, 320, 640, etc. These seem to give the lowest noise values, especially in low-light conditions.

The lower the ISO the lower the noise in the camera. I prefer to stay below 640 to guarantee a clean image. If your delivery format is relatively low resolution (say, 720p Vimeo or the like) you could probably get away with shooting a little higher because all of the encoding and downscaling and re-encoding will smooth things out a bit.

White Balance
The camera has a number of settings for white balance - "Sun" "Shade" "Tungsten" "Fluorescent" and so forth. These work pretty well.

Personally, I prefer the (awesome) option of dialing in the while balance myself. This allows you to change the WB in relativel small increments.

You can also take a still photograph of a grey card or piece of paper and use that to automatically lock the WB inside the camera.

Everything you need to know to get you started
So, this won't be everything, but it is a few thoughts off the top of my head...

1) If you shoot 1080p 24, set the shutter to 50. If you shoot 1080p30, set the shutter to 60. If you shoot 720p 60 set the shutter to 120. This simulates the standard cinema camera 180º shutter.

2) If you shoot under standard commercial fluorescent lighting (as in an office building), forget everything in No. 1 and shoot with the shutter at 60.

3) Without some form of additional stabilization, your footage will be shaky. Probably even with IS on. Stabilzation options are everything from simply adding weight to the camera, a Z-finder or other loupe, a shoulder rig, a "stabilizer" like the Glidecam, a tripod, slider, etc.

4) If you need to record sound, get an external recorder. The camera uses Auto Gain Control which introduces a great deal of undesirable noise to the relatively quiet portions. Also, there is no way to monitor audio out of the camera. I like the Zoom H4n as an introductory external audio option.

Amir Vii said:
What program do you guys use for editing?
Click to expand...
I use the most recent version of Final Cut Pro. The workflow is pretty straightforward:

1) Take the H.264 and encode to ProRes LT using MPEG streamclip.
2) Edit the ProRes files.
3) Encode out when finished to whatever delivery is necessary.

Amir Vii said:
What settings do you shoot in order to get that HD cinematic look?
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1080p at 24 frames per second with a shutter speed of 50. These replicate standard film camera rates and speeds.

Generally, stopped down to around f/2.8-4 during daytime. This provides enough DOF that the talent is in focus - not just the tip of their nose or their eyes, but their whole person.

Try to match the look you want in camera in terms of color, saturation, contrast, etc. This will take some camera testing. The H.264 does not hold up to color grading extremely well. It can certainly be done, but if what is coming out of the camera is closer to the final desired look, it will introduce fewer artifacts.

Use good audio. It makes the image seem better. I just feel this is a general rule.

Plan your shots and shoot with a mind towards composition, lighting, and screen direction.

Make sure you understand the aliasing and resolution limitations of the camera - it can ruin shots.


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Amir Vii said:
thank you guys..glad to be here

i have a dell laptop:
4 GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 9600M GS, Intel (R) Core(TM) 2 DUO, 150GB Hard Drive

im not really planning on making a clip as soon as i get the camera..ill play around with it for a while..any books or links that would help me as a starter?
Click to expand...

Editing on a laptop, especially with HD, is a royal pain. If you have to do it that way, I understand, and I've done it. But man is it painful.

As for books, this one looks like a real winner:

http://www.amazon.com/Bryan-Peterso.../dp/0817432256/ref=pd_mw_b_10?ie=UTF8&s=books
 
While Michael makes some valid points, one should be exceptionally cautious with words like Always, and Never. Especially, when no explantion of why is given. For instance, an innocent piece of advice about shooting with a 1/60 shutter under fluorescent lighting can be disastrous when you are working with either nonstandard lighting lighting in other than countries with 60Hz cycles, or other instances. This is precisely why you need the depth of a class or a very good book to give you a foundation.

Another example is the advice to stick with a certain set of ISOs without any explanation of why. And while that advice is sound on SOME circumstances, for most shooting conditions those ISOs are particularly problematic. Again, a solid understanding of how and why things work the way they do are crucial. For the record, on your camera, those ISOs provide the least noise in the blacks under low lighting conditions. Something generally very desire able. The problem is that they do that at the expense of highlight handling, so if you are shooting in well-lit conditions, you are more apt to blow out the highlights before you would with other choices of ISOs and in that lighting, the blacks aren't going to generally be noisy anyway.

Again, fundamentals of understand the how and why behind the "simple internet advice" that can help you or easily lead you astray.
 
PerroneFord said:
While Michael makes some valid points...
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You absolutely right and I really should have taken the time to provide some explanations for what I wrote. Instead of writing technically, I just put down what is in my own head as far as basic operating procedures. I've amended my original posting to provide for some explanation.

PerroneFord said:
The problem is that they do that at the expense of highlight handling, so if you are shooting in well-lit conditions, you are more apt to blow out the highlights before you would with other choices of ISOs and in that lighting, the blacks aren't going to generally be noisy anyway.
Click to expand...

I'd never heard this, nor experienced it myself. But I definitely take it at a learning opportunity.

Are there other sets of ISOs that provide better dynamic range?

In a situation in which there is ample lighting (outside, studio) what ISOs should be used? I've always read, heard, and used 160 but would love to have a better picture with a different setting.
 
PerroneFord said:
Editing on a laptop, especially with HD, is a royal pain. If you have to do it that way, I understand, and I've done it. But man is it painful.

As for books, this one looks like a real winner:

http://www.amazon.com/Bryan-Peterso.../dp/0817432256/ref=pd_mw_b_10?ie=UTF8&s=books
Click to expand...
what do you mean when u say its painful? does it freeze a lot? like i have no experience with this so not sure what you mean when you say its painful. You guys are making me scared. This looks way too complicated. Seems like i need a lot of practicing to do to get the idea of this whole shooting HD videos with my 7D...
 
Perrone - I would so love to take a class. Our local city college offers a night course but does not start until May. Im hoping by then i can self teach and get as much hands on experience as possible. I couldn't agree more about the mis-advice the internet can give. This book you mention is a decent prep tool before taking a basics course?

Seems though most beginning courses work with 35mm film cameras and not dslr's. This reminds me of beginning graphic design courses - we didn't touch a computer for 2 years all the while taking drawing, painting and typography classes to build the basic skills needed.

Thanks for your direction!
 
@Amir: No need to be scared. In general, when working with video, it's desireable, and even advisable to use three hard drives. One to keep your pograms on, one to keep your video sources on, and a third to render you final videos too. Generally, in a laptop, most people are doing everything on a single drive. This cause slowness and performance slow-downs. Be prepared for this and you'll be ok. Additionally, screen real estate is never enough on a laptop. I use three screens when I edit and I consider them all important. Working on the laptop only is REALLY taking a step in the wrong direction.

@Photzen

There is certainly a lot of practical stuff you can learn on your own. And with digital photography, the lessons are free. There is no film to buy or develop. But there are some concepts that are just tricky for a lot of folks. Like the ratio of F-Stops to Aperature. And how ISO plays into it. The idea of how to select correct shutter speeds. Framing choices. Those kinds of things are always easier when you have someone competent teaching you.

35mm photography is absolutely NO different from DSLR photography when it comes to basics. All the idea of exposure, framing and composition, lenses, etc., all hold true. So it is quite possible to go through a 35mm film oriented class and complete it all with a digitial camera, save for the work in the darkroom.
 
Michael Olsen said:
Are there other sets of ISOs that provide better dynamic range?

In a situation in which there is ample lighting (outside, studio) what ISOs should be used? I've always read, heard, and used 160 but would love to have a better picture with a different setting.
Click to expand...

In a balanced scenario, the 00 ISOs are the ones to use. So 100, 200, 400, etc. In situations where you need more highlight handling, the 125, 250, 500, etc. are the ones to go to.
 
cheezweezl said:
I thought 160, 320, 1250, etc. were the ISO's to go with because the noise seems to be less on these particular ISO's as seen here.
Click to expand...

Yes, again that is WITH THE LENS CAP ON. The lowest of low light scenarios. And in a situation with low light, those ISOs makes sense.

It's just like shooting film. You say that I should use ISO 1600 film because you saw a test someone took in a dark house lit with only moonlight. Yes, that's right. But when we are outside at noon on a sunny day, suddenly a different ISO needs to be used.

All scenarios are not the same.
 
PerroneFord said:
Yes, again that is WITH THE LENS CAP ON. The lowest of low light scenarios. And in a situation with low light, those ISOs makes sense.

It's just like shooting film. You say that I should use ISO 1600 film because you saw a test someone took in a dark house lit with only moonlight. Yes, that's right. But when we are outside at noon on a sunny day, suddenly a different ISO needs to be used.

All scenarios are not the same.
Click to expand...

Thanks for pointing this out, Perrone. If what you say is true (and I only doubt it because I doubt everything until I can prove it to myself) then this knowledge definitely needs to be spread around.
 
ok i know this question might sound stupid but what are these 25p or fps that you guys talk about? like what is the difference between the 25p and the 24p. Where can i get more information on these terms?
 
Amir,

These terms come from film (real film) and express how many frames of film are displayed per second.

24fps = 24 frames per second. This is the standard rate for a Hollywood film. So for those trying to emulate the "feel" of a cinema picture, this is used.

25fps = The standard for TV broadcast in PAL countries.

30fps = The standard for TV broadcast in NTSC countries.

When you see a term such as 30p, the 30 signifies the number of frames per second, and the "p" denotes progressive (or complete) frames. In cotrast when you see something like 60i the "i" means interlaced. This comes from a time with broadcast methods were not able to send 30 frames per second or 25 in the case of PAL at one time, so the screen was split into fields. It's like arranging lines vertically on a sheet 1-xxx (lets 720) and numbering them into odd and even. So the broadcast signal first sends all the odd lines, then all the even ones. The TV puts them together to form one complete frame of video. This is an antiquated method but it's fairly deep rooted so it is still widely used.

Does that help?
 
PerroneFord said:
Yes, again that is WITH THE LENS CAP ON. The lowest of low light scenarios. And in a situation with low light, those ISOs makes sense.

It's just like shooting film. You say that I should use ISO 1600 film because you saw a test someone took in a dark house lit with only moonlight. Yes, that's right. But when we are outside at noon on a sunny day, suddenly a different ISO needs to be used.

All scenarios are not the same.
Click to expand...

I don't know if I agree with that. Film is an Organic Process, the results will different with different shooting situations. Digital is Data, it's programmed to do one thing, there isn't an organic process that makes one image look different than the other.

As far as ISO ties into that, in video mode for DSLRs, there isn't anymore netted range in highs or lows at 100 than there is at 160. For RED, that actually does hold true: shooting at 500ISO in broad daylight is better than shooting at a lower ISO.

It just isn't the same for DSLRs. If you want more highlight range, at the expensive of other portions of the image suffering, you activate the highlight tone priority modes.

Otherwise, it really only takes shooting at 100ISO and the same video image at 160ISO to see that 100ISO is definitely cleaner, chroma and luma both.

It would be different for film and is slightly different for RED as well, I thought that the DSLR would work the same but Barry tested this and it doesn't make a difference what ISO, only HTP will give you what you mention.
 
PerroneFord @ it really helped..it all makes sense now..

i still have few basic questions that i hope you guys can help me out with...

1- lets say i want to shoot a clip on under a daylight sun with my camera set to 24fps. Do i use the lowest ISO possible? and other than that what else needs to be set. I guess the white balance needs to be put on Daylight, right?

2- i read a lot of people recommending using a 1/50 shutter speed when using the video mode. Can someone just briefly explain how the shutter speed and aperture effect the video.

3- i have heard that having a tripod is a must when shooting films using the DSLRs like the Canon D7. I do have a tripod but i wouldnt its a very stable one. Its light and shakes a lot. How important is it to have a tripod when shooting video on the D7?

4- when you record a video with your D7 and want to upload it to your computer, what format does it save as?
5- someone in this thread mentioned that if you have an old computer or a laptop its harder to edit the videos? its still doable though..right? I mean i dont mind if it takes too long to edit as long as it doesnt effect the quality of the videos or anything like that its all good.

6- would you guys agree that final cut is the best software to edit the videos with? like i always wanted to add effects to my videos and stuff. Does final cut pro have those options?

7- what settings is it usually used to shoot at night? with a f/2.8 lens.

I know im too many questions but before starting to read the manual or the other parts of forum i just want to get some basic questions that i have been asking myself, answered.
Really appreciate the help everyone.
 
Kholi said:
It would be different for film and is slightly different for RED as well, I thought that the DSLR would work the same but Barry tested this and it doesn't make a difference what ISO, only HTP will give you what you mention.
Click to expand...

I wish I'd had time to fully flesh this out when we did our 5D shoot this past fall. Sadly I didn't get to fully test the camera. I scoured the internet looking for information and for the life of me, I cannot find the information related to this ISO noise and highlight holding thing.

At first glance, what you are saying about HTP seems very logical. And I am not saying that you're wrong about the ISO information. But like you, and I suspect a number of other pros, I prefer to try my own tests to validate what I read and hear.

Thanks for weighing in on this.
 
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