Avoiding a confrontation with fs100 dop

Rick Burnett said:
Let me put it to you this way, Frank's color profiles work so well that we have a thanks in the credits for our next video we are releasing! :)
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Awwww!

Thanks for your warm words Rick, I always love to see, that you guys can use my profiles for you projects.

Frank
 
Postmaster said:
Thanks for your warm words Rick, I always love to see, that you guys can use my profiles for you projects.
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Let me just say that, while I don't have a FS100 and thus haven't used Frank's profiles myself, from what I've seen, if I used or purchased that camera, first thing I would do would be to grab his picture styles.

As a non-FS100 user, I still thank you for taking the time to put those out.
 
Just come out of meeting an d more tha a little stressed. Shooter is related to producer and bows nothing did not know what ire meant. Owned cam for 8 weeks. F@$€%%€K
 
If you believe there is the possibility that he will royally mess it up (not knowing what IRE is doesn't necessarily mean this will be the case), then I see you having one option: ask for a replacement or drop the project entirely. I say this because if he drops the ball hard, the producer will almost decidedly ensure that it will be seen as your fault.
 
Gary Huff said:
Let me just say that, while I don't have a FS100 and thus haven't used Frank's profiles myself, from what I've seen, if I used or purchased that camera, first thing I would do would be to grab his picture styles.

As a non-FS100 user, I still thank you for taking the time to put those out.
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+
 
Gary Huff said:
If you believe there is the possibility that he will royally mess it up (not knowing what IRE is doesn't necessarily mean this will be the case), then I see you having one option: ask for a replacement or drop the project entirely. I say this because if he drops the ball hard, the producer will almost decidedly ensure that it will be seen as your fault.
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The more I hear about this project, the more I think I'd go with 'drop this project entirely'. If you
have to do it for some reason, I'd go with G-Log Ultimate and have the shooter set the zebras to
95% and set the histogram to display the zebra point. Tell the shooter that no matter what, do not
allow ANYTHING on the histogram to go past the zebra line on the histogram. But if you are going
to be blamed for the project as was suggested, I'd make up some reason why I could no longer
be a part of the project.
 
There's a language barrier might be why he didn't understand ire - trying to be +ve.

I actually think that either the agency is getting ready to ditch the client. Or I don't know wht to believe but maybe this producer is scamming the camera budget and is about to ditch the agency. But I cannot back out if a messy shoot as the agencies client who is also MY client gets screwed also if this producer goes down I flames I don't want to go down with.

It's locked down shots on sticks white balance and exposure is all I care about. Anyone can hit record.
 
I have to second the mad props to Frank for his profiles. I have not had the opportunity to use the Ultimate PP yet (On a proper shoot, just testing and I love it. It is my go to PP now), but have shot a lot with the G-Log A PP. It works wonders in bringing out the best in the FS100. I shot a short film this summer in very difficult circumstances (A large church with long hallways with windows I was unable to gel down) and the camera handled it well. The use of Frank's PP and the dynamic range of the camera really came through. To your question as to what IRE to keep your highlights at, I put set my Zebra stripes to 95% also. Shooting in those long hallways, I had one or two shots that did have the "Jaggies" that Rick talked about. It came from black window frames. It was really hard to see, and when I showed them to the director, he couldn't see it until I blew the shoot up and even then, he didn't think that it was a problem. I saw the footage projected on a movie screen at a local theater and I could not see that artifact in those shoots. BTW, the footage looked great on a big screen.

You will want to point your DP to Franks' profiles (Go with the Ultimate), that is for sure. Good luck.
 
Back on a computer again, very glad for that. If I can get Franks profiles on there I will but I 'm preparing for a strong possibility that it may not happen. Also thanks to Franks advice I'll try to rent a TV logic or at very least buy a dp4 and loup. Cheers David - 95 cut off it is. BTW how are skin tones on franks profiles? can someone link me threads or vimeo clips with high key caucasian skin with his profiles?
 
The Frank profiles are really not for me... bear in mind he designed them for dealing with PP's weakness, something am not burdened with as use Avid that maintains full range... the advice he gives is also specfic to PP, and really poor advice for anyone who can maintain full range, keecapping the camera to make up for someone else's weak post chain is borderline insanity

My advice is to test them through to finish first before jumping on them... or just stick with 709 and let the camera be what it is... it's really good when left alone, really horid skin tones when fauxlog'd

and uh yea... who am i? currently DoP on a feature based out of Paris, but shooting in Cluj, Romania this week, on day 25 of 42 shooting days and not a fauxlog profile in sight, own 2 x FS100's built to be real camera's, about 40K investment.

But mainly i own a post facility and have graded 12 Features or TV movies for US primetime so far this year.... i have a clue - have the scopes - have the eyes.... would never let the fauxlog near an actor's face

d
 
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J Davis said:
Just come out of meeting an d more tha a little stressed. Shooter is related to producer and bows nothing did not know what ire meant. Owned cam for 8 weeks. F@$€%%€K
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Ouch!

Dermot said:
.. bear in mind he designed them for dealing with PP's weakness, something am not burdened with as use Avid that maintains full range... the advice he gives is also specfic to PP, and really poor advice for anyone who can maintain full range, keecapping the camera to make up for someone else's weak post chain is borderline insanity
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LOL, my profiles have nothing to do with NLEs and full range.
 
J Davis said:
Just come out of meeting an d more tha a little stressed. Shooter is related to producer and bows nothing did not know what ire meant. Owned cam for 8 weeks. F@$€%%€K
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At least we've gone from DoP to shooter.

Nothing like a bit of nepotism eh?

Good luck with the difficult situation.
 
Personally I would walk from the project, but it not professional to and you need the money, get liability insurance if I were you, don't lose your temper, you are not shooting, do what you are hired to do and work your socks off. Record everything.

I feel for you man, are you union and is it a union job?

Rich
 
No am not union. There was a post on here I think by Gary but I can t scroll because I'm bak on th iPhone but he said the director takes full responsibility and that may be the case bit not in this situation. This client (who is also my client unbeknownst to everyone else) is paying the ad agency. I'm freelance but hired and paid by the agency so I am still representing the ad agency in the clients eyes for this particular job. The producer is staff at the same ad agency and should be my superior if it were not for the fact that I go back 6y with then and she is reltively new hire. So if the shoot goes belly up she would take the hit and so would the agency but my external relationship with the client would take a huge hit in th collateral damage. FYI I think the cam op is her cousin
 
J Davis said:
No am not union. There was a post on here I think by Gary but I can t scroll because I'm bak on th iPhone but he said the director takes full responsibility and that may be the case bit not in this situation. This client (who is also my client unbeknownst to everyone else) is paying the ad agency. I'm freelance but hired and paid by the agency so I am still representing the ad agency in the clients eyes for this particular job. The producer is staff at the same ad agency and should be my superior if it were not for the fact that I go back 6y with then and she is reltively new hire. So if the shoot goes belly up she would take the hit and so would the agency but my external relationship with the client would take a huge hit in th collateral damage. FYI I think the cam op is her cousin
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I was wondering about that when Gary said that, but figured I don't work on big union shoots and am just a little production guy in Alaska
so what do I know? I've not directed a job where it was 'all on me' even if it was the producer GOING DIRECTLY AGAINST MY ADVICE
who hired a DP who didn't have a clue. That would be on them. ESPECIALLY, if the producer tells you to basically 'mind your own
business' (which it sounds like this one did) when you are trying to ensure the quality of the product! But again, I've just worked on relatively
small jobs, biggest one was 12 grand, so I'm not in the know with the ways the big sets work. In my experience, if they are going to give
you the director's job in name only (ie, you don't have the authority to ensure the DP does certain things), then you are not going to have
to take the fall for things that they choose to do. On the other hand if you are REALLY the director with ultimate responsibility, then you can
at least make sure the DP does things correctly. Giving you the responsibility WITHOUT giving you the authority, just isn't done in the
places I work.

Not sure that there is a good solution to this one. I'd make sure I got an external monitor, preferably one with histogram, and waveform
so you can monitor what the shooter is getting. Then as you said, as long as you can verify the shot looks good, all the shooter has to do
is hit record. It only takes 2 minutes to enter Frank's G-Log Ultimate into the picture profile. If they won't even let you do that, or the shooter
won't do that, heaven help this shoot!! Seriously, best of luck on this!
 
Bring in a sexy assistant in a latex outfit to distract the shooter for a few minutes and hack in my PP - he will never know what happened. :evil:

The only problem is, if the footy comes out beautiful, he will take all the credit.

Frank
 
While not exactly the same I work in a situation where as a freelancer hiring other freelancers, sometimes I'm hiring crew and sometimes someone from the same crew is hiring me. The one thing I've leant over the years is to let people make their own mistakes and to do the job I was hired to do to the best of my ability. If I see something going horribly wrong then I'll be sure to raise it as a concern but ultimately if I'm being hired then the final decision isn't mine to make and it's not my problem to fix.

If I had a direct relationship with the client and I could see disaster looming then I might raise my concerns with them in an off the record sort of way. I'd certainly be raising my concerns with the producer no matter what relationship the shooter has with them. It can be done in a way that's neither combative nor negative. Just a 'He seems mighty new at all this to be working on this project - are you sure he's had enough experience with that particular camera?' sort of thing.

Then on the day, if I can help - say if I were a director with a feed to a monitor that had scopes or a histogram - I might raise the issue of exposure if I see it being an issue. I'd get the shooter's opinion, try to educate him on the reason I think it's an issue and then leave it to him to get it wrong if he wants. I can't count how many times I've been on a shoot in another capacity and thinking "But I would never light it like that..", or "Please move that mic just a little closer to the talent.." - and depending on the demarcation between roles within the crew, I'll raise the concern - but at the end of the day it's not my call. (because if it was my call they'd obviously be doing it my way and issue solved...)

And of course, the one thing not mentioned here is that the shooter may actually manage to get it right. I'd only owned my FS100 for a few days when I shot my first commercial with it (and I'll own up to a certain percentage of luck vs skill in getting it right). Production is a team sport so I'm always mindful not to let my concerns and first impressions prematurely turn things into an 'us vs them' situation it may not need to be.

Cheers
Jeff K
 
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well here's the thing... i expose to 109, and start the day with blacks set to -15, and use REC709, we screen on a Christe proj and a Dolby 4200 ref mon.. if you or anyone else told me had to use fauxlog profiles i would get the producer to look at my work again... then try to pull clean skintones through a secondary with the fayxlog... game - set - match to my work.

Let the DP be a DP, you direct... end of the day, as long as it can be worked with in gradeing, let it be and direct traffic

On the show i'm on now the director (who cames from a stage background) works with the actors for performance, i block and am left completly alone to chose lens - angles - coverage - light.... we are budgeted about the same as a Lifetme or A&E movie, so i have a crew, all but my Acam 1st are from Paris, producers watch dailes everynight, my settings work when in my hands.... no-one's going to tell me what profiles to use... and no-one would switch them on me, my Ac would make sure of that ( not to mention the FS is so fragile that we don't let anyone but cam department near it)

Let the DP decide what works for them, not what the interwebnet thinks

d
 
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