AG-HMC150 Dedicated Turn-Key Editing Appliance?

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Dean Papoutsis

Member
Help please . . .

Don’t care what editing software it is and don’t care if it’s a Mac or PC.

I DO CARE if it stutters, drops frames, crashes or generates video with compression artifacts.

Don’t want to custom configure a store-bought computer to do video work—been burned once this way and will never do it again. Don’t want to play Russian roulette mixing and matching boards, processors and software with external drives and different memory, etc.

Think I need a quality computer, perhaps an HP or Apple that has been configured, tested and proven by an authorized (video editing) VAR, with expertise in HD workflows (ideally AVCHD). Someone that can design and build a dedicated computer capable of doing just one thing well. This ideal supplier would stand behind their work and guarantee it is 100% compatible with a Panasonic AG-HMC150’s AVCHD files—and the workflow would not include stuttering, dropped frames, crashes, compression artifacts or overnight rendering. Or I’d get my money back.

I am 55 years old, I’d like to make my first indie film with this setup and this is not my real job. I am willing to spend what it takes to keep this “hobby” fun. (It’s not fun, when I am pulling my hair out like I did with my DV video and Pinnacle Studio.) And yes, I’m willing to transcode (if it’s still “fun” and still looks sharp on my 10' diagonal projection screen). I’d prefer assembling my edits in clear, big, sharp previews that ideally look like the real finished product. And I don’t want to beat myself up, thinking it is my fault that I bought a slower DDR3 memory module or picked the wrong Raid type when everything does not do what I think it should.

Is there really a solid, stable computer/software system out there that can do this? Or is HD video editing the elusive killer app that high-end computer hardware/software vendors use to lure in would-be videographers (again and again)? Am I dreaming or do I just need my expectations “calibrated?” ;-) Thanks guys.
 
I have a 8 Core Nephalem 2.26 GHz MacPro that I bought for under $3500 with 6 GBs of RAM.

I can edit 720/60p natively in CS4.0.1 Premiere.

It has a stock 512 MB video card. Works pretty well.

PM me and I can set you up with an excellent reseller in Oklahoma for Macs and FCP.

best
 
Dean

Save yourself lots of headaches and buy a MacPro tower and Final Cut Studio. A lot of people seem to think that they should be editing native AVCHD. And these are the same people that complain that there footage isn't playing back or it's stuttering.

Working with Final Cut avoids this by making you transcode to ProRes, probably the best editing codec out there right now. Yes it's an extra step to transcode, but you're not chained to the computer while it's transcoding. Copy your cards to your harddrive first, then you can set up multiple cards to transcode at once.

As to where to buy your system, try to find a local VAR, someone you can call for a little hand-holding as you get used to the system. There's really no magic in configuring the system, there aren't any "under the hood" system tweaks you need to make like you do on a PC. If you have any friends or colleagues locally working with FCP ask them for assistance. True Mac-heads love to help convert others to Mac.

I used to run the Final Cut Pro User Group in Vancouver, we'd gets lots of newbies complaining about this and that, only to point out to them that they were going about something entirely the wrong way. Tech support people like to use the phrase "the problem exists between the chair and the keyboard" and it's very true. I can easily get FCP to stall if I open up After Effects, PhotoShop and I'm reading my online mail while browsing the net. And I've actually heard people complain about situations like that. Your editing machine should be your editing machine, yes it can do other things, but not all at once.

I run a department of 14 FCP edit suites, all editing HD all the time. Just the other day an editor told me he was having an audio problem. Turns out he'd changed a setting trying to listen to Itunes through the Blackmagic card.

I edit AVCHD (converted to ProRes) at home on a 1 year old 24" Imac. Mostly my own little pet projects for the web or charities. It's been great for that, but it's not as expandable as a MacPro. I've also taken ProRes files on a 2.5" FW drive and edited them on my three year old MacBook Pro while out on my boat. Yeah it stutters a bit sometimes, but that's the price you pay when your sitting in a little cove, drinking your morning coffee, while editing and watching eagles out the window :)

Ok I'm rambling now, but I hope this helps.

Cheers

John Christie
 
TheDingo said:
If you don't want to get locked into a specific software/hardware solution, then you might consider buying either:

Dell Precision Workstation ( use which ever editor that suits you, I use Sony Vegas Pro 9 )
http://www.dell.com/precision

or

Mac Pro Tower and Final Cut Pro
http://store.apple.com/us/browse/home/shop_mac/family/mac_pro?mco=MTE3MDU
Click to expand...
Hi TheDingo,
Thanks for your suggestions. I had not really discovered the higher performance Dells, interesting . . .
Dean
 
jchristie said:
Dean

Save yourself lots of headaches and buy a MacPro tower and Final Cut Studio. A lot of people seem to think that they should be editing native AVCHD. And these are the same people that complain that there footage isn't playing back or it's stuttering.

Working with Final Cut avoids this by making you transcode to ProRes, probably the best editing codec out there right now. Yes it's an extra step to transcode, but you're not chained to the computer while it's transcoding. Copy your cards to your harddrive first, then you can set up multiple cards to transcode at once.

As to where to buy your system, try to find a local VAR, someone you can call for a little hand-holding as you get used to the system. There's really no magic in configuring the system, there aren't any "under the hood" system tweaks you need to make like you do on a PC. If you have any friends or colleagues locally working with FCP ask them for assistance. True Mac-heads love to help convert others to Mac.

I used to run the Final Cut Pro User Group in Vancouver, we'd gets lots of newbies complaining about this and that, only to point out to them that they were going about something entirely the wrong way. Tech support people like to use the phrase "the problem exists between the chair and the keyboard" and it's very true. I can easily get FCP to stall if I open up After Effects, PhotoShop and I'm reading my online mail while browsing the net. And I've actually heard people complain about situations like that. Your editing machine should be your editing machine, yes it can do other things, but not all at once.

I run a department of 14 FCP edit suites, all editing HD all the time. Just the other day an editor told me he was having an audio problem. Turns out he'd changed a setting trying to listen to Itunes through the Blackmagic card.

I edit AVCHD (converted to ProRes) at home on a 1 year old 24" Imac. Mostly my own little pet projects for the web or charities. It's been great for that, but it's not as expandable as a MacPro. I've also taken ProRes files on a 2.5" FW drive and edited them on my three year old MacBook Pro while out on my boat. Yeah it stutters a bit sometimes, but that's the price you pay when your sitting in a little cove, drinking your morning coffee, while editing and watching eagles out the window :)

Ok I'm rambling now, but I hope this helps.

Cheers

John Christie
Click to expand...
Hi John,

Thanks a lot for your thoughts and time. What you've said seems very sensible and I just checked out the possibility of local FCP user groups--and we have some here in the San Francisco Bay Area. I am taking what you've advised to heart and will research this some more. Great ideas--thank you again.

Dean
 
i'd go mac/fcp for overall stability + performance

i'd go mac/fcp for overall stability + performance

i'm a pc person, simply because i can't afford macs.

but if i could, i'd go mac/fcp in a heartbeat. its super stable and reliable in comparison to the constant bugginess of the hodgepodge that is a pc.

if you're on a tighter budget and have to go pc, get the latest fastest 2 or 4-core cpu, at least 4gb ram and some big hard drives and invest in Grass Valley's Edius or Sony's Vegas.

personally, i use edius. i find the interface much easier to work with and the application to be super duper stable and able to handle anything you throw at it.

they both can edit avchd native, but its just not very practical still even with the latest maxed out computer specs. i think everyone agrees that you'll still want to transcode to an editing codec for true blazing fast realtime editing.

also, if you're in the bay area, you'll find that just about everyone else you meet is editing on a mac in fcp. so if you want to be able to work together with other editors or want the support of a local community, go mac.
 
averan said:
i'm a pc person, simply because i can't afford macs.

but if i could, i'd go mac/fcp in a heartbeat. its super stable and reliable in comparison to the constant bugginess of the hodgepodge that is a pc.

if you're on a tighter budget and have to go pc, get the latest fastest 2 or 4-core cpu, at least 4gb ram and some big hard drives and invest in Grass Valley's Edius or Sony's Vegas.

personally, i use edius. i find the interface much easier to work with and the application to be super duper stable and able to handle anything you throw at it.
.
Click to expand...

I'm also a PC person, but not for the same reasons. I'm a PC guy because I build my rigs, and they don't crash. PERIOD. I also use Edius, out of choice. I loved Vegas for audio, but can't stand it for video. Must be because I came from a Premiere 4.X background and Edius is more like Premiere than Vegas.. Actually Edius is more like FCP! If you chose not to go MAC then find a good system builder who knows video editing apps. Preferably someone who has built high end PCs specifically for editing.
 
ATL Media: i build my own from scratch too. the only application i've ever had trouble with is Premiere....and i always have lots of trouble with it. i'm not the only one with these issues, Premiere just seems very poorly/inefficiently coded. my 'rig' doesn't crash, Premiere does. even Adobe tech support is no help.
 
averan said:
i'm a pc person, simply because i can't afford macs.

but if i could, i'd go mac/fcp in a heartbeat. its super stable and reliable in comparison to the constant bugginess of the hodgepodge that is a pc.

if you're on a tighter budget and have to go pc, get the latest fastest 2 or 4-core cpu, at least 4gb ram and some big hard drives and invest in Grass Valley's Edius or Sony's Vegas.

personally, i use edius. i find the interface much easier to work with and the application to be super duper stable and able to handle anything you throw at it.

they both can edit avchd native, but its just not very practical still even with the latest maxed out computer specs. i think everyone agrees that you'll still want to transcode to an editing codec for true blazing fast realtime editing.

also, if you're in the bay area, you'll find that just about everyone else you meet is editing on a mac in fcp. so if you want to be able to work together with other editors or want the support of a local community, go mac.
Click to expand...
Hi Averan,

Thank you for your advice. I've also shyed away from Macs due to the cost, etc. But what I am realizing is Apple makes both the computer AND a sophisticated editing software solution--at least there might be less finger pointing. In the PC world it seems like the editing software company points at the hardware company and the hardware guys point at the software guys. Its maddening.

So maybe going with fewer suppliers should help (?) I've been saving my pennies and gave up the big vacation this year, I think I am going to go for a system like the big boys have :-)

Thanks for the confirmation that I am on the right track.

Dean
 
ATL Media Group said:
I'm also a PC person, but not for the same reasons. I'm a PC guy because I build my rigs, and they don't crash. PERIOD. I also use Edius, out of choice. I loved Vegas for audio, but can't stand it for video. Must be because I came from a Premiere 4.X background and Edius is more like Premiere than Vegas.. Actually Edius is more like FCP! If you chose not to go MAC then find a good system builder who knows video editing apps. Preferably someone who has built high end PCs specifically for editing.
Click to expand...
Hi ATL Media Group,
If you've got the knoweledge to build your own PC it sounds like the way to go, if you can swap parts that seem to be incompatible . . . I am not very good at it and will follow your suggestion, either find a knowelegeable video VAR/builder or go the Mac/FCP route.
Thank you for your time/comments.
Dean
 
Hi Dean, In defense of the AVCHD native editing software. Adobe Premiere Pro, is now working pretty seemless for me. Adobe has updated several of the issues they had.

I don't know if they have the Mac end sorted out yet, but it is worth a look. Especially since you can download a trial version for 30 days free!

I am a Mac lover, but I built a PC with a multi core processor. The same firepower in a Mac would have cost me 3 times as much.

"Hear me now, believe me later" (in my best Schwartzeneggar LOL) do your homework and research. I did, and I have smile (most) everytime I'm editing my footage!

You are on the best DV forum you could find! A great, knowledgeable, helpful bunch here.

Good Luck! Ron
 
You might also want to contact George Dame if you want a PC pre-built for HD video.
Here's his site: EditHD
I've heard many good things from his customers about his products.
 
Hi Ronedee,
Thanks for the suggestions. Downloaded an AVCHD test file I discovered via the "Workflow" section here and brought it into my existing PC and Pinnacle Studio 12. My existing PC is a old so its a bit jerky, but at least it sorta runs-enough to experiment with--it loaded an did not crash. Have a great 4th.
Dean
 
Hi ATL Media Group,
Thanks for the computer lead--had not found those guys on the net. Looks like they really have their act together. Liked the way the platforms were built around various sw solutions.
Dean
 
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