a7s color test
- Thread starter Samuel H
- Start date
nyvz
Veteran
I would never use it unless you are using a LUT designed for it. With the right LUT it looks awesome.
cyork
Well-known member
Agreed.
macgregor
Veteran
Just my 2 cents.
If you plan on shooting on S-gamut I don't think a LUT won't do much if you work in a different color space. You'll need to convert from S-gamut to whatever you're using (probably sRGB/rec709).
In the same way that you shouldn't be working with adobeRGB images in an sRGB system (system = OS, graphics card, monitor and software): greens will look bad for example if you do that. Given that I don't think anyone in this forum has access to such systems (ie: baselight etc) and that cheaper grading solutions (ie: davinci) doesn't seem to have the right tools for this yet (color space conversions, with ACES this should be fixe at last), it'll be hard to get good results without the immense help of secondaries to map the huge color space of S-gamut back to something smaller that we can view in our monitors like sRGB.
That's why some colors will look weird under S-gamut (Remember that comparison a month ago with the A7s vs GH4 and the weird Tshirt?) and why I think it just make so much more sense to shoot in any of the other modes the camera has (such as cinema or pro).
adobergb / srgb setting shouldn't affect video, atleast it doesn't with the canon cameras. It's for stills and Lightroom / photoshop can cope pretty well with different profiles.
cpc
Well-known member
S-gamut is pointless in the sense that in an 8-bit coding space you wouldn't want too much real color spread anyway. The chance for color banding is increased. The same way as you don't really use AdobeRGB with 8-bit jpeg files if you plan on doing post work.
That said, it isn't that much work really to mould s-gamut into something nice. I haven't played with it since I got the camera, but here are some test grades on the early Roman's dpx samples: http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthrea...ootage&p=1986451505&highlight=#post1986451505 All look decent, I'd say.
@mcgregor:
You can use 3d LUTs for color space conversions in Resolve, but you don't really need that. Resolve is what-you-see-is-what-you-get in its approach, it doesn't care about color space. Your monitoring space is what you work in. And if you deliver in your monitoring color space, you are fine.
That said, it isn't that much work really to mould s-gamut into something nice. I haven't played with it since I got the camera, but here are some test grades on the early Roman's dpx samples: http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthrea...ootage&p=1986451505&highlight=#post1986451505 All look decent, I'd say.
@mcgregor:
You can use 3d LUTs for color space conversions in Resolve, but you don't really need that. Resolve is what-you-see-is-what-you-get in its approach, it doesn't care about color space. Your monitoring space is what you work in. And if you deliver in your monitoring color space, you are fine.
macgregor
Veteran
rad a bit about sgamut and read my post again.
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macgregor
Veteran
Again, working with files shot in a different color space than the one you're working on (sRGB/709) gives you bad results. Without the correct software interpretation, colors are going to be duller, and some (greens and reds mostly) will be off from where they should be. This means a strong red for example could look dull and magenta in srgb without proper conversion. Now fix that in post manually.
cpc
Well-known member
Red actually goes towards orange with s-gamut seen as srgb within most of the usable illuminant range.
Anyway, got your point but still disagree with it. Yes, you will get less saturation (duller colors) when monitoring a bigger space into a smaller space, but you will get this with any log coded image (alexa log, BM film, etc). No, you can't fix it with simply adding saturation because the primaries are off compared to srgb/rec709 or p3. You don't necessarily want to fix it, you want to get a pleasing image out of it. Otherwise people would be fixing film in DI because film doesn't have a single primary "correctly" positioned for grading. In general, s-gamut needs green pushed towards red when monitored in srgb/rec709 in order to have pleasing skin. Anything else is optional and a matter of taste.
Steve Kahn
Well-known member
These discussions are silly and tiresome at this point in time. 5 years ago they were of the time. Now they are dated. The idea that these companies are using codecs to differentiate their range speaks volumes to how poor their technology really is.
After using 14 bit raw I would never go back to working in a limited 8-bit color space and shooting picture profiles.
After using 14 bit raw I would never go back to working in a limited 8-bit color space and shooting picture profiles.
I'll never understand posts like these. Thanks for your contribution, Steve. Feel free to show yourself out and back to your superior 14-bit forum.
dustylense
Veteran
Then enjoy your workflow. Not everything needs to be recorded in RAW. Hope you don't get any 15 minute interview gigs soon with your 14bit RAW.
But we're not talking 14bit Raw, we are discussing how to get the best out of the A7s. I own an f55 and an epic but the A7s has already come in useful on my "14bit" jobs.
Steve Kahn
Well-known member
Eh. It's a good low light camera. Great for documentaries.
But this 8-bit stuff is strictly for videography. Let's not kid ourselves thinking we can get robust color.
But this 8-bit stuff is strictly for videography. Let's not kid ourselves thinking we can get robust color.
You must be a joy to work with, Steve. Give me a break.
benjaminreece
Active member
Dude, you realize you're sh**ting all over a thread full of DPs that do huge/amazing work? Ha....
eddavid
Carbonite Member
Steve brings up a good point - 8 bit processing of an image in the age of 10-12 bit up to 16 bit - but remember the camera sits in the pocket of the dslr - which is still 8 bit h.264 land - even the Canon C300 is 8 bit still. S log-2 would work better in 10 bit - but what we have gotten by the Sony Corp is 8 bit - so we gotta see if its worth trying to make it work in the world of 8 bit - and with my tests and through a lot of smart people on this blog - they have found a way to get beautiful results. Even in 8 bit, it has better highlight handling than the 10 bit gh4 - so how about that.
And let us not forget that Canon and their Canon log that works in 8 bit land has done some very very beautiful things.
And let us not forget that Canon and their Canon log that works in 8 bit land has done some very very beautiful things.
maranfilms
Veteran
I will keep that in mind when I cash my 8 bit check tomorrow upon delivering the project.
rogar-BigGrin(DBG)
TajJackson
Active member
How are u guys nailing white balance. Are u dialing it in. or using some other method?
Thanks in advance.