G
Guest
Guest
Will there be a new model of the DVX coming out anytime soon? I want to buy the DVX100a but it's a lot of money for me and i dont want to buy it and find out the next day that a new model is available.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: A new DVX model?
It was just announced six months ago, so it would seem unlikely to be replaced any time soon.
The original was only out for 14 months before it was replaced, which was a very short time frame when considered in context with what other camera manufacturers have done. The XL1, for example, was introduced in 1997 and has only had one minor update in the seven years it's been available.
I'd say it'd be surprising if the DVX100A was updated any time soon... but you never know.
It was just announced six months ago, so it would seem unlikely to be replaced any time soon.
The original was only out for 14 months before it was replaced, which was a very short time frame when considered in context with what other camera manufacturers have done. The XL1, for example, was introduced in 1997 and has only had one minor update in the seven years it's been available.
I'd say it'd be surprising if the DVX100A was updated any time soon... but you never know.
G
Guest
Guest
Re: A new DVX model?
:-/ Although, Panasonic did show a working prototype of their new HDV camera at NAB which looked remarkably similar to the DVX100. It too had a great picture - in 720P
:-/ Although, Panasonic did show a working prototype of their new HDV camera at NAB which looked remarkably similar to the DVX100. It too had a great picture - in 720P
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: A new DVX model?
Panasonic has not endorsed HDV. They may make their own variant, or they may someday join the HDV coalition, but as of now they're not members and they haven't announced any HDV product or plans to support HDV.
Panasonic has not endorsed HDV. They may make their own variant, or they may someday join the HDV coalition, but as of now they're not members and they haven't announced any HDV product or plans to support HDV.
kyle_doris
Well-known member
Re: A new DVX model?
HDV is blah...
unless HDV gets 24p, which i doubt it ever will... it's blah.
HDV is blah...
unless HDV gets 24p, which i doubt it ever will... it's blah.
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
Re: A new DVX model?
I agree. HDV looks wonderful but if its not 24p it looks like a wonderful video.
I agree. HDV looks wonderful but if its not 24p it looks like a wonderful video.
Phil
Veteran
Re: A new DVX model?
We should make this topic a sticky!
1. Technology is ever changing, and there will always be a new one coming out.
2. You won't ever get started unless you jump in.
3. HDV is an impractical format because HD isn't in every home. Hell, widescreen isn't even in every home yet and that would make more sense.
4. Instead of HD, I hope they look into widescreen ccd's!
5. Last but not least, no matter what model...24p and Progressive scan makes a great combo!
IMHO Just my 5 cents.
We should make this topic a sticky!
1. Technology is ever changing, and there will always be a new one coming out.
2. You won't ever get started unless you jump in.
3. HDV is an impractical format because HD isn't in every home. Hell, widescreen isn't even in every home yet and that would make more sense.
4. Instead of HD, I hope they look into widescreen ccd's!
5. Last but not least, no matter what model...24p and Progressive scan makes a great combo!
IMHO Just my 5 cents.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: A new DVX model?
The proposed JVC HDV shoulder-mount camera was bragging that it would most definitely offer 24P. That's a $20,000-area camera, so it won't help most end users much, but there may someday be a 24P HDV camera.
Heck, maybe someday there'll actually BE an HDV camera. You know that to this day there still isn't an HDV product on the market? The JVC HD10 predated HDV by about six months, and while it's been grandfathered into the standard, it doesn't even say HDV on it...
The proposed JVC HDV shoulder-mount camera was bragging that it would most definitely offer 24P. That's a $20,000-area camera, so it won't help most end users much, but there may someday be a 24P HDV camera.
Heck, maybe someday there'll actually BE an HDV camera. You know that to this day there still isn't an HDV product on the market? The JVC HD10 predated HDV by about six months, and while it's been grandfathered into the standard, it doesn't even say HDV on it...
DVX100Shooter
Veteran
Re: A new DVX model?
Panasonic said that when the 100 was released then all of the sudden in December 2003, I was surprised to find out they were releasing an updated version of the camera the 100A. I doubt a new camera will be out to take the place of the 100A from Panasonic anytime soon but then again, they just might surprise us with something!
Panasonic said that when the 100 was released then all of the sudden in December 2003, I was surprised to find out they were releasing an updated version of the camera the 100A. I doubt a new camera will be out to take the place of the 100A from Panasonic anytime soon but then again, they just might surprise us with something!
Re: A new DVX model?
I Agree HDV is blah...
Lets examin this carefully taking the jvc model as an example
its only 700 somthing lines in 30p? with one chip at 800k Res.
The panny is a three chip with 410 per chip 380k effective pixels, which brings it to at least a million somthing pixels total
plus 24p "films golden standard"
I have had the opportunity to see uncompressesd hdv footage shot on the jvc camera 16:9 and it does not compare to the panny!!!!
I have also seen upres footage/grabs of panny footage to hd resolution that are amazing... and blow the jvc away.
So dont fret we really arent missing anything...
I would also like to say...
"And I may be going out on a limb here but that`s where the fruit is!!!"
I think hdtv is also blah,1080 interlaced? looks in a potential way GREAT but the jaggies, it will always look jagged to me,especially after seeing projected dlp line doubled 1080p DvD movies in a home theater sys.
thats the only way to fly... at least until they go and make a progressive scan hdtv format for movies and leave the inerlacing for tv broadcasts.. and regualr viewing.
I would like to see a 24p 720p res HDVcamera with native 16:9 chips with easy Guidline and crop feature for the cinemascope ratio....!!!! As well.
But right now I dont see it happening and not for under $4,000
Why? Lets be honest for fear of an Independant Film planet...
But I have got My Eye on The future and one company and One camera only, and thats the one that says BAd A$$ M.F. On it...
The panasonic DVX100 Series.
P.S. This was my first post, I love you all!!!!!!!!!!!!
I Agree HDV is blah...
Lets examin this carefully taking the jvc model as an example
its only 700 somthing lines in 30p? with one chip at 800k Res.
The panny is a three chip with 410 per chip 380k effective pixels, which brings it to at least a million somthing pixels total
plus 24p "films golden standard"
I have had the opportunity to see uncompressesd hdv footage shot on the jvc camera 16:9 and it does not compare to the panny!!!!
I have also seen upres footage/grabs of panny footage to hd resolution that are amazing... and blow the jvc away.
So dont fret we really arent missing anything...
I would also like to say...
"And I may be going out on a limb here but that`s where the fruit is!!!"
I think hdtv is also blah,1080 interlaced? looks in a potential way GREAT but the jaggies, it will always look jagged to me,especially after seeing projected dlp line doubled 1080p DvD movies in a home theater sys.
thats the only way to fly... at least until they go and make a progressive scan hdtv format for movies and leave the inerlacing for tv broadcasts.. and regualr viewing.
I would like to see a 24p 720p res HDVcamera with native 16:9 chips with easy Guidline and crop feature for the cinemascope ratio....!!!! As well.
But right now I dont see it happening and not for under $4,000
Why? Lets be honest for fear of an Independant Film planet...
But I have got My Eye on The future and one company and One camera only, and thats the one that says BAd A$$ M.F. On it...
The panasonic DVX100 Series.
P.S. This was my first post, I love you all!!!!!!!!!!!!
Z
Zoomforce
Guest
Re: A new DVX model?
[quote author=ChuckS link=board=nws;num=1087413560;start=0#2 date=06/16/04 at 13:33:19] :-/ Although, Panasonic did show a working prototype of their new HDV camera at NAB which looked remarkably similar to the DVX100. It too had a great picture - in 720P[/quote]
actually, that prototype was made out of Balsa ( i know it looked real ) and didnt do much except look pretty.
[quote author=ChuckS link=board=nws;num=1087413560;start=0#2 date=06/16/04 at 13:33:19] :-/ Although, Panasonic did show a working prototype of their new HDV camera at NAB which looked remarkably similar to the DVX100. It too had a great picture - in 720P[/quote]
actually, that prototype was made out of Balsa ( i know it looked real ) and didnt do much except look pretty.
Z
Zoomforce
Guest
Re: A new DVX model?
and thats one of the best first posts we have ever had catman Welcome!
and thats one of the best first posts we have ever had catman
Welcome!
ChuckS
Veteran
Re: A new DVX model?
At the demonstration of the HDV camera at NAB that I saw, the camera was working and they displayed the images of the crowd on a monitor for all to see. It was quite impressive. But I don’t bring this up to get into a debate on which manufacturers are going to develop and support which format, I just wouldn’t be surprised if there was an HDV DVX in the future or possibly one with true 16x9 ccd’s.
Having said that, if I were in the market for another camera I would not hold off purchasing a DVX100a today, you can make a lot of money with this very capable camera in the meantime. I also do not think that this is as much of a format war between standard def and HD as it is between 16x9 versus 4x3. I have seen some very nice 16x9 shot on the Panasonic SDX900 edited together with 720P footage and the results were stunning.
I am not sure I understand why some people think HDV and even HD are “blah.” In addition, granted I may be the one who is confused, but there seems to be some misunderstanding about the look of 24P. I certainly do not mean to offend anyone’s filmic sensibilities – if your intentions are to deliver on film then 24pa is the right choice, but if your deliverable is electronic then it is probably not the right choice. All NTSC CRT’s display in 30(interlaced 60i) fps; if you display 24P on a CRT, it flickers. The DVX interlaces 24P when it records it to tape – it gives the user a choice of standard 3:2 or advanced 2:33:2 which when the interlaced images are combined to make a progressive frame it is a 1 to 1 match for a 24fps film out.
The most powerful tools the DVX100a give the operator are the cine-curves. CCD’s are linear; these curves allow the user to adjust the image logarithmically. The user can set the white point (white balance) and the black point and decide how you want the camera to roll off the bright and stretch the blacks giving you the optimal 8 or 10 bits. This functionality is not a function of frame rate. If you were going to deliver for viewing in the NTSC world 30P would be a better choice providing a 1 to 1 match for the 60i thereby avoiding any 3:2 problems which many of the NLE’s seem to be having.
For HDV to record progressive frames it might need to (mpeg) compress the image a little more to meet the constraints of recording at 25Mb’s but it should be able to record 720P and it will have the same cine-curves. The reason I like the idea of HDV has little to do with the format and everything to do with the form factor. Recently I shot some footage with a Panavision HD-Cam, you would think I was launching the space shuttle, people stopped to watch and ask questions. When I shoot with the DVX100a, I am a tourist walking around (even with a tripod) and hardly anyone pays any attention. It really gives the filmmaker a great deal of freedom and I am sure it is nowhere as stressful for the actors. I am just hoping for a camera that provides the freedom of the DVX100a with HD quality that can be seamlessly cut into footage shot on the more expensive HD systems for the more panoramic scenes.
Neither 1080i nor 720p has “jaggies,” unless you were watching an HD-DVD or a Blu-ray DVD you were viewing an up converted standard def image and that is a little like blowing up a 3x5 to an 8x10 – the original does not have the resolution to look good.
At the demonstration of the HDV camera at NAB that I saw, the camera was working and they displayed the images of the crowd on a monitor for all to see. It was quite impressive. But I don’t bring this up to get into a debate on which manufacturers are going to develop and support which format, I just wouldn’t be surprised if there was an HDV DVX in the future or possibly one with true 16x9 ccd’s.
Having said that, if I were in the market for another camera I would not hold off purchasing a DVX100a today, you can make a lot of money with this very capable camera in the meantime. I also do not think that this is as much of a format war between standard def and HD as it is between 16x9 versus 4x3. I have seen some very nice 16x9 shot on the Panasonic SDX900 edited together with 720P footage and the results were stunning.
I am not sure I understand why some people think HDV and even HD are “blah.” In addition, granted I may be the one who is confused, but there seems to be some misunderstanding about the look of 24P. I certainly do not mean to offend anyone’s filmic sensibilities – if your intentions are to deliver on film then 24pa is the right choice, but if your deliverable is electronic then it is probably not the right choice. All NTSC CRT’s display in 30(interlaced 60i) fps; if you display 24P on a CRT, it flickers. The DVX interlaces 24P when it records it to tape – it gives the user a choice of standard 3:2 or advanced 2:33:2 which when the interlaced images are combined to make a progressive frame it is a 1 to 1 match for a 24fps film out.
The most powerful tools the DVX100a give the operator are the cine-curves. CCD’s are linear; these curves allow the user to adjust the image logarithmically. The user can set the white point (white balance) and the black point and decide how you want the camera to roll off the bright and stretch the blacks giving you the optimal 8 or 10 bits. This functionality is not a function of frame rate. If you were going to deliver for viewing in the NTSC world 30P would be a better choice providing a 1 to 1 match for the 60i thereby avoiding any 3:2 problems which many of the NLE’s seem to be having.
For HDV to record progressive frames it might need to (mpeg) compress the image a little more to meet the constraints of recording at 25Mb’s but it should be able to record 720P and it will have the same cine-curves. The reason I like the idea of HDV has little to do with the format and everything to do with the form factor. Recently I shot some footage with a Panavision HD-Cam, you would think I was launching the space shuttle, people stopped to watch and ask questions. When I shoot with the DVX100a, I am a tourist walking around (even with a tripod) and hardly anyone pays any attention. It really gives the filmmaker a great deal of freedom and I am sure it is nowhere as stressful for the actors. I am just hoping for a camera that provides the freedom of the DVX100a with HD quality that can be seamlessly cut into footage shot on the more expensive HD systems for the more panoramic scenes.
Neither 1080i nor 720p has “jaggies,” unless you were watching an HD-DVD or a Blu-ray DVD you were viewing an up converted standard def image and that is a little like blowing up a 3x5 to an 8x10 – the original does not have the resolution to look good.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Re: A new DVX model?
I also don't understand the reticence towards HD and HDV. Better is better, right? The JVC camera that's out now is completely unusable, but an actual professional HDV camera could be very enticing.
I completely disagree with you about the 24P notion, though. You can explain in theory why 30P should look better, but when you play the footage, 24P looks like film and 30P looks significantly more "video"-like, especially from the JVC HD camera. We shot the same scenes on the DVX/24P/Anamorphic and on the JVC/HD/30P, and while the JVC blows the DVX away for resolution, there was absolutely no question that the DVX was much more filmlike, the JVC just looked like video.
Assuming they can get an image that looks as good as the DVX (color, saturation, gamma, etc) but with the resolution of HD, I say bring it on, even if it is HDV (which records 720p at 19mb/s, not 25... 25 is only used for the 1440x1080i mode).
I also don't understand the reticence towards HD and HDV. Better is better, right? The JVC camera that's out now is completely unusable, but an actual professional HDV camera could be very enticing.
I completely disagree with you about the 24P notion, though. You can explain in theory why 30P should look better, but when you play the footage, 24P looks like film and 30P looks significantly more "video"-like, especially from the JVC HD camera. We shot the same scenes on the DVX/24P/Anamorphic and on the JVC/HD/30P, and while the JVC blows the DVX away for resolution, there was absolutely no question that the DVX was much more filmlike, the JVC just looked like video.
Assuming they can get an image that looks as good as the DVX (color, saturation, gamma, etc) but with the resolution of HD, I say bring it on, even if it is HDV (which records 720p at 19mb/s, not 25... 25 is only used for the 1440x1080i mode).
Re: A new DVX model?
And, I rarely go anywhere public with the DVX and not attract attention.
And, I rarely go anywhere public with the DVX and not attract attention.
ChuckS
Veteran
Re: A new DVX model?
Using a DVX100 I locked off a shot on a tripod and shot various setups in both 24P and 30P and not a single viewer could tell the difference until I zoomed out or panned left or right, the 30P was smoother. I think the comparison that you described simply demonstrates that the DVX is a better camera than the JVC.
~chuck
Using a DVX100 I locked off a shot on a tripod and shot various setups in both 24P and 30P and not a single viewer could tell the difference until I zoomed out or panned left or right, the 30P was smoother. I think the comparison that you described simply demonstrates that the DVX is a better camera than the JVC.
~chuck
G
Guest
Guest
Re: A new DVX model?
Panasonic IS working on a NEW 3 chipper that will be announced soon, and I'm not referring to the GS400. Stay tuned. ;D
Panasonic IS working on a NEW 3 chipper that will be announced soon, and I'm not referring to the GS400. Stay tuned. ;D