7D kit for documentary work - your thoughts?

L

LorenS

Member
I do independent documentary video / photo work, own all my own gear, and am considering selling most of it to switch to a 7D. I'm fully aware there are filming situations where a camcorder would be more appropriate (event doc, etc.). I understand this and if I switched I would be prepared to rent gear when I needed to. Either way I'll be keeping all of my current audio / lighting gear so I'm not going to go into detail on any of that here. In a perfect world I'd love the wide angle / shallow DoF punch of a 5D MKII / 24mm f/1.4L II combo, but can't afford it so I'm looking at the 7D and a more reasonable selection of lenses. The gear I'm currently using and the 7D kit I'm looking at are both listed below so take a look and let me know what you think:


Current Video: Sony HVR-A1U (HDV camcorder w/XLR's)
Current Photo: Sony A700 DSLR, HVL-F58AM Flash, A700 Grip
Current Lenses:
  1. 10-22mm f/4-5.6 Sigma for Sony mount
  2. 17-50mm f/2.8 Tamron for Sony mount
  3. 50mm f/1.4 Sigma for Sony mount
  4. 90mm f/2.8 Macro Tamron for Sony mount

7D Photo / Video kit: Canon 7D, Beachtek DXA-5D XLR adapter, Canon Speedlite, 580EX II, 7D Grip (BG-E7)
7D Lenses:
  1. 11-16mm f/2.8 Tokina
  2. 17-50mm f/2.8 Tamron OR 30mm f/1.4 Sigma
  3. 50mm f/1.4 Sigma (interview medium shot)
  4. 85mm f/1.8 Canon (interview close-up)

----Thoughts?
 
Last edited:
The Sony HVR-A1U is the lowest-end prosumer camcorder that you can imagine. It's almost identical to Sony's very first consumer HDV camcorder, the HDR-HC1. I used to own an A1U. I'm actually not so sure that I can say that it's a better camcorder than the 7D. If it were an XH-A1, or an HVX200(A), or an EX1, etc., there would be no question...
 
Having used both the A1U and 7D I can certifiably testify that, in my opinion, the 7D quality is far superior to the A1U.

Also, before I forget, if you can only afford one lens off of your list you'll want to get the 17-50. I have to get too far back with the 28 to do any run-n-gun sidewalk interviews.
 
Last edited:
If you want to keep a capable small-chip camcorder to complement to your new 7D, then consider replacing the A1U with the Canon HV20, which offers great image quality and all of the manual controls (plus zebra and peaking) that you could want from a consumer handycam. The HV20 would be an an upgrade over the A1U, and it would only cost around $500, which would result in a cost savings after you sell the A1U. Additionally, since the HV20 is also an HDV camcorder, you could use it to play the tapes that you recorded with your A1U. Pretty much the only significant thing that the A1U does that the HV20 doesn't do is XLR input. But you could probably use the Beacktek adapter to cover that.
 
Thanks for all the feedback so far. As far as the A1U goes it's a great b-cam (with any other sony hdv cam), it works very well for event doc which means it has paid for itself, and it's actually designed for pro work as opposed to a $500 consumer cam like the HV20. I know the HV20 has a better sensor / slightly better color, a hacked up canon 24F mode, and a love for having adapters strapped onto it, but that doesn't make it a better camcorder for most users :nads:.

On the pro side I've been happy enough over the last four years with sony hdv cams like the A1U, FX1, and FX7 that I've avoided the urge to drop the extra 3-6k for an HVX, HPX, or EX1. The huge file sizes and limited recording times per card on the panasonics are impractical for documentary work although the 28mm wide end on the new HVX200A / HPX170 is extremely tempting. I've used the EX1 and it would definitely be my pick of the bunch (1/2" sensors, better color, lower data rates, etc.), but it's still expensive and it's a royal pain to handhold. Just my 2 cents. Back to the 7D...

@zim - gotta sell the A1U / A700 to pay for the 7D.

@cjwolff - good point on the 28 being a bit long. would the tokina 11-16mm work for that kind of situation or would it be too wide?

@dandobi - just read up on the 11-16mm tokina and I'm definitely going to go with that for my ultra-wide. they never made one in sony mount so I was completely unaware it even existed :laugh:
 
B4 you use this for doco think carefully about the focussing implications maybe do some tests - im not joking

Lenses in the 16-55 range are good, GV through to a hand on a mouse filling the frame with the rest blurred out

S
 
morgan_moore said:
B4 you use this for doco think carefully about the focussing implications maybe do some tests - im not joking
Click to expand...
I'll try to do some tests with my current gear today.


morgan_moore said:
Lenses in the 16-55 range are good, GV through to a hand on a mouse filling the frame with the rest blurred out
Click to expand...
Since it's so wide the tokina 11-16 should give me some serious deep focus for on-the-go shooting when stopped down a bit. The 50/85 will be more for sit-down interviews or staged shots. GV?
 
I also have the A700 stillcam. Great tool. On the stillside I stick to that and only get the necessary lenses for the 7D. I am sure SONY will bring a VDSLR soon, so the lenses will be in use soon again.
 
LorenS said:
it's actually designed for pro work
Click to expand...
Sorry for nitpicking, but I just gotta clear this misconception. The A1U was not really designed for pro work. It's actually exactly the same camcorder as the HDR-HC1, which is Sony's first consumer HDV camcorder, with only three differences:
1) Add-on XLR module; essentially no different from using a Beachtek adapter
2) Slightly tweaked firmware that includes a few extra features from higher-end models, such 24F and CineGamma modes
3) Beefier lens hood

So I'm not sure how that makes it any more suitable for pro work than the HV20. The HV20 has all of the manual control features that you'd want from a prosumer camcorder, and just like the A1U, they tend to be buried in menus instead of implemented as switches on the camera body. So anything that you could do on the A1U you could also do on the HV20, and possibly also do better. And the HV20 is a true 24p camcorder, not a hack like Sony's 24F mode.

My first HD camcorder was the A1U. The only Canon camcorder that I've ever owned is the XH-A1. So it's not like I'm an A1U hater or an HV20 fanboy.
 
LorenS said:
I'll try to do some tests with my current gear today.



Since it's so wide the tokina 11-16 should give me some serious deep focus for on-the-go shooting when stopped down a bit. The 50/85 will be more for sit-down interviews or staged shots. GV?
Click to expand...

GV - General View (maybe a stills term) wide opener of a location/room etc

Tests with what kit ?? You vidcam will be very different

11-16 you will get more DOF, but its still tricky at 16

I imagine wider than that you could get some very horrid distortion expecially hand held - it is hard to control a horizon on a wide

Also you are going to need to practice pulling focus in a shot and maybe a monitoring solution to enable you to do that

Seriously I own an EX1 and a 7d, the 7d is a battle to operate and when you fall over you fall over really badly - I dont know which to use now half of the time

S
 
Anyone have any more comments specifically on the 7D kit I'm looking at? Are those lenses good choices? Am I going to need to purchase anything else I'm not aware of having not shot video with a DSLR before?

I'm going to make the purchase soon so any comments would be extremely helpful. Thanks!
 
LorenS said:
Anyone have any more comments specifically on the 7D kit I'm looking at? Are those lenses good choices? Am I going to need to purchase anything else I'm not aware of having not shot video with a DSLR before?

I'm going to make the purchase soon so any comments would be extremely helpful. Thanks!
Click to expand...

I'd take a hard look at the Canon 17-55mm f2.8 IS.

Love mine and would be a great docu lens for the 7d, IMO.
 
mcgeedigital said:
I'd take a hard look at the Canon 17-55mm f2.8 IS. Love mine and would be a great docu lens for the 7d, IMO.
Click to expand...

Coming from Sony I totally forgot about in-lens IS ! Does anyone have an image-stabilized lens they're using with their 7D? How helpful is this when shooting video?
 
I've heard that it's mostly helpful when doing handheld at focal lengths beyond 50mm. Less than that and it won't matter too much. In other words, it's not going to kill your ability to get good, reasonably steady handheld footage at shorter focal lengths.
 
James Longley, Oscar winner documentarian for "Iraq in Fragments"has been using a production model 7D in India of rhos next film. He shot with only one lens the 17-55mm 2.8 from Canon.
He's loving it!

More info can be found at www.d-word.com
 
alexdias said:
James Longley, Oscar winner documentarian for "Iraq in Fragments"has been using a production model 7D in India of rhos next film. He shot with only one lens the 17-55mm 2.8 from Canon.
He's loving it!

More info can be found at www.d-word.com
Click to expand...

Can you link me to the thread? The D-Word site always confuses the heck out of me :(
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top