squig
Veteran
Have to start exploring sharpening plugins. There's sharpening and then there's sharpening. I tweeted Bloom yesterday and he concurs the detail is there.
5D MKIII specs
- Thread starter squig
- Start date
Have to start exploring sharpening plugins. There's sharpening and then there's sharpening. I tweeted Bloom yesterday and he concurs the detail is there.
dustylense
Veteran
Leica and Nikkor glass. ANy Zeiss would do just the same. Good EOS will as well. Sharpening? Well I'll tell you its not unsharp mask. ANd it took maybe 8 secs to apply. It's a little plug in I stumbled on called tonalizer. It works in FCP7, FCPX, Motion, and I think CS5 (not sure). A little slider called detail sharpener in it, much like lightrooms sharpening. Lots of ways to sharpen digital images. THe base might be unsharp mask, but I NEVER use unsharp mask solely.
ANd yes, add a fine touch of grain to that footage would in fact do wonders.
dustylense
Veteran
AGAIN GUYS, PM me your e-mail and I'll shoot you a shorter PRORES version via dropbox with the shots you've seen and some EOS glass like the 16-35 and the 24-105.
dustylense
Veteran
EVERY shot in that is 3200 I-Frame. Stopped down to 5.6 or so to hold some DOF! That is the beauty with the MK3 that I've been trying to say here. The ISO performance is not just about lowlight anymore. It about holding FOCUS and DOF. Steadicam anyone?
dustylense
Veteran
I wanted to show that this camera is capable of DETAIL. Yes, shooting at camera sharp 0 with the post sharpen could, would, or might get you the look. In the prores version, that thumb that I hit focus on, is so crisp and detailed. Nose up to the monitor you might break it apart. But at a "NORMAL" persons viewing distance, IT'S AMAZING!
I can;t believe none of you have said anything regarding Jello! I shot it hand held just for that test as well. Looks kinda good for those narratives, no? Jello, is different to rolling shutter. Rolling shutter is pans and trains going by. Jello is camera shake gone bad trying to stay still. They are related, but also different.
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squig
Veteran
Yep I think a lot of the criticism of the softness of the MKII and MKIII stems from the fact that people aren't nailing focus a lot of the time. I have a 4yr old and a 6yr old and I've been chasing them for three years with manual glass only. It's a real challenge in low light....it's a challenge in any light!
dustylense
Veteran
http://irudis.com/Products/TonalizerVFXPRO/SystemReq.aspx
This is what I used for sharpening. I bought when it launched at $70. They have since increased the price. FCP7, motion, and fcpx only. I'm sure there are other sharpeners out there. You guys would know more than I would.
This is what I used for sharpening. I bought when it launched at $70. They have since increased the price. FCP7, motion, and fcpx only. I'm sure there are other sharpeners out there. You guys would know more than I would.
squig
Veteran
hehe :embarasse
Do you know if it does the convolution sharpen like jcs suggests?
It's very quiet in here, I think they all jumped on ebay to buy up all the Leica glass.
dustylense
Veteran
hehe :embarasse
Do you know if it does the convolution sharpen like jcs suggests?
It's very quiet in here, I think they all jumped on ebay to buy up all the Leica glass.
I don't know and maybe I don't care. It works. It's not unsharp mask though. Like I said, it acts like lightrooms detail sharpen. All I heard was the writer of the program is some sort of image processing wizard. You don't need Leica glass. You just need good glass. And the 24-105 is not a nice prime. Nikon AIS, Zeiss, Canon FD's There are jewels everywhere. Cp.2's. THe only zoom I ever use and compare to primes is the 70-200 L IS. Maybe the new 28-70 V2 L EOS would do it? Zooms SUCK!
That is some good looking footage. Olympus has a new five axis image stabilization built into the camera body that looks to be pretty remarkable. Just imagine if Canon had something like that. All these Leica lenses you guys are using would be stabilized- no need for any kind of bulky stabilizer. I know Canon and Nikon will never go for in body stabilization but perhaps Sony will improve upon their stabilization and have something as good as the Olympus with their next full frame. And oh yeah, hopefully have video approaching the quality of this Canon!
dustylense
Veteran
A tripod makes a good stabilizer too. I want my sensor to stay put, like a roll of film.
squig
Veteran
hehe, yeah I'm not a big shaky cam fan except where it really enhances a scene...."the script really sux, the characters ar boring, there's nothin goin on in the scene, what are we gonna do........move the camera!"
Nice work Christoper (dustylense)! I would guess Tonalizer is doing a convolution sharpen if you aren't getting any halos when you crank it up high. If its some form of Unsharp Mask- you'll get halos at high levels (though it's less if you use a small radius). A convolution sharp will get grainy at high levels, exposing any artifacts as well.
Shot some wide shots at 24mm (24-105 kit lens) outside in the street with trees, grass, asphalt, signs. I compared IPB to I-frame and still (scaled down). Based on the stills, there's a bit more detail that could be captured (in some cases, quite a bit). When switching between IBP and I-only, there is a change in colorspace (I-only is brighter or different gamma, perhaps color too). This could also be an NLE issue (PPro does special gamma based on file type (found this info in an XML config file)). I verified the "noise" issue with I-only at low ISO (100, 160, 320). Not sure it's just low ISO, though. The noise looks like aliasing on the edge of a DCT macroblock. This is easier to see after extreme sharpening. I can sharpen IPB to the point of looking like a GH2, however it also matches the GH2's aliasing. When sharping I-only at the same level, there are many artifacts. If I lower the sharpen value for I-only to prevent artifacts, it doesn't look as sharp as sharpened IBP. I'll test a clip in FCPX to see if the I-only issue exists there as well. It looks like a lot of detail is lost in compression- if I-only can be fixed+improved, more detail appears to be available.
Also note that good results can be obtaining using both a convolution and Unsharp Mask filter in post. You can convolution sharpen to bring out fine details (high frequency), and Unsharp Mask to bring out mid-frequency details. Finally, you can use a very large Unsharp Mask size to do Local Contrast Enhancement.
Shot some wide shots at 24mm (24-105 kit lens) outside in the street with trees, grass, asphalt, signs. I compared IPB to I-frame and still (scaled down). Based on the stills, there's a bit more detail that could be captured (in some cases, quite a bit). When switching between IBP and I-only, there is a change in colorspace (I-only is brighter or different gamma, perhaps color too). This could also be an NLE issue (PPro does special gamma based on file type (found this info in an XML config file)). I verified the "noise" issue with I-only at low ISO (100, 160, 320). Not sure it's just low ISO, though. The noise looks like aliasing on the edge of a DCT macroblock. This is easier to see after extreme sharpening. I can sharpen IPB to the point of looking like a GH2, however it also matches the GH2's aliasing. When sharping I-only at the same level, there are many artifacts. If I lower the sharpen value for I-only to prevent artifacts, it doesn't look as sharp as sharpened IBP. I'll test a clip in FCPX to see if the I-only issue exists there as well. It looks like a lot of detail is lost in compression- if I-only can be fixed+improved, more detail appears to be available.
Also note that good results can be obtaining using both a convolution and Unsharp Mask filter in post. You can convolution sharpen to bring out fine details (high frequency), and Unsharp Mask to bring out mid-frequency details. Finally, you can use a very large Unsharp Mask size to do Local Contrast Enhancement.
dustylense
Veteran
Maybe you should be writing us a nice series of MK3 sharpening plugins???:thumbsup: In tonalizer, yes if you take it too far, it's to far. But, it's working. I'm not adding much, but just that extra bit. Most of the softness feel is the fact that it's clean FF footage. To me anyway...
Rick Burnett
Section Moderator
I don't know the 5dm2 as well, but I know the 7D VERY well. That footage looks so much better to me than 7D footage dustylense. I *REALLY* wish they'd have included a crop mode to APS-C. I would have SERIOUSLY considered one! Wow. Again, thanks for the quick test.
Cosimo Bullo
Veteran
Tell that to my Bolex... thing bounces around like a trampoline!
dustylense
Veteran
Yeah. That would have been a great option. Maybe the Rebel will trickle this tech? Rick, send me your e-mail so I can send you the prores shorter version.