If you could give one piece of advice to a beginner...

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davbeisner

Well-known member
I'm a beginner at video and I want to learn from the pros. That said, let me give a little history:

I'm only 23, but I've been in the pro audio industry for almost ten years now and I currently run a small recording studio and I do pretty well at it and make some pretty good money. I've got extensive audio experience with studio work, live sound, and installation. That said, I think I understand technology fairly well and so I'm hoping I'll be able to transition to video fairly easily (though I know it's going to take a lot of work to learn everything!) I'm just finishing up college (I graduate in May '09) but my school has already hired me full time. They want me to take my skills in technology, learn how to do video work, and then create over a hundred 5-10 minute promo videos for use in fundraising and admissions. They're pretty much investing a couple months worth of my salary (which isn't bad either!) in getting me trained in videography and video technology.

I'm having weekly training sessions with the Film prof at our school and he's teaching me a lot of stuff with compositing and framing and how to use a camera from an artistic standpoint.

I've spent the last four weeks reading forums here, at dvinfo, apple, adobe, and more, just trying to learn. I'll be using the lynda.com tranining videos to learn FCP, After Effects, Photoshop, and Flash (a lot of the stuff I do will also be developed on our website).

Right now it looks like they'll be buying me an HVX200A with an extra 16GB card (means I'll have two 16gb cards), a Mac Pro with FCP and some basic video/audio hardware (looking at the Blackmagic Intensity Pro for video--want to be able to use HDMI outputs to monitor on HD screen--and the M-Audio ProFire 2626 for Audio--allows me to use a lot of the pro-audio gear I already own including an ADAT HD24 for multitracking and it works with ProTools M-Powered if we decide we need to purchase that eventually.) Then I'll also be getting a good tripod (looking to spend somewhere around $1400 and I'm looking at a Manfroto head on Cartoni sticks). For lighting, I put myself through college by working construction so I already have three 1000 watt lighting trees. I can get old color films and diffusers from our theater department here at the school. I've also read (I think it was here) that hanging a shower curtain in front of the lights is a great difuser.

So I've pretty much got the equipment stuff figured out and planned out. I've been able to keep the total cost for everything under $15k which I think is pretty good. Now I just need to spend time learning the art of the trade.

That's where y'all come in: Three questions for y'all:
1. What's one thing you wish someone had told you when you got started in video?
2. What's the most valuable thing YOU would like to impart to a beginner?
3. What's one piece of equipment I haven't listed that you would like to recommend or what's one piece of equipment I have listed that you think I should reconsider?

Y'all's advice is much appreciated and I look forward to reading your responses!


David

P.S. are any of you in the Chattanooga, TN area and willing to let me spend some time learning from you? I'd be happy to volunteer doing whatever was needed on a shoot (I can wrap cables pretty well!) just to get some time on a shoot learning from the pros...
 
1) Learn still photography first
2) We're happy you're excited, but no one wants to see your cat :)
3) Unless you have a compelling reason to otherwise use Mac/FCP, it isn't, in fact, the best choice for use with the HVX. Edius Broadcast and Adobe CS3.
 
David Jimerson said:
3) Unless you have a compelling reason to otherwise use Mac/FCP, it isn't, in fact, the best choice for use with the HVX. Edius Broadcast and Adobe CS3.
Click to expand...

Can someone expand on this and tell me why Adobe CS3 on a PC would be better than FCP/Mac? Part of the reason for going FCP/Mac is that I'll have some of the advanced film students here helping me and that's what they'll be using in their labs. The idea was that they could take it back and forth between their labs and my main production machine.
 
That would be a compelling reason to do it, I'd say, especially as it's pretty much impossible to trade work with P2 stuff between FCP and other programs without a lot of compromises.

But Edius Broadcast by far has the best P2 integration, and it's followed closely behind by CS3. (And with CS3 you get After Effects and Photoshop, too, both industry standards, as well as OnLocation in the Windows version.) Also, the Windows platform has more tools available for working with the HVX/P2.

Essentially, Edius and CS3 work with the files on the P2 card as they were meant to be used -- as edit-ready video/audio files in and of themselves, instead of converting them to Quicktimes first -- and in so doing, they preserve all of the data and metadata included with the files, much of which makes the whole P2 system so great to begin with. (Lots more info about this in other threads.)

So, even going with the Mac/FCP -- in terms of recommended equipment, I'd at least recommend a Windows laptop alongside it.

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?p=1308410#post1308410
 
Hmm. Those are some pretty compelling reasons there! I've been using the Masterworks collection on my home computer for several months now and I love Adobe's integration. I especially like the idea behind OnLocation. How much would I need to budget for a laptop capable of running OnLocation for the full HD?
 
Well, as Barry says in the article at the link above:

My Lenovo is currently sporting a 160GB internal drive, and an additional 320GB internal drive in the UltraBay dock. That gives me almost half a terabyte of storage online, internally, with no clutter of separate drives and cables and power supplies. And two drives means instant/easy redundant copying at full SATA speed, for instant duplication for safety. If shopping for a Lenovo, google around for discount coupons, I’ve found 10% and 15% discount coupons readily available from the www.lenovo.com online store. You should be able to put together a very capable offloading station for well under $700, and a basic system for around $500.
Click to expand...

OnLocation runs fine with it.
 
maybe my workflow is different from davids, but i work with the hvx and final cut studio 2 (as well as all the adobe stuff) and i have ZERO problems.
 
If meta data isn't important to your workflow, for many FCP users and there are many using it with p2 data, then you can't beat the integration among FCP and the rest of the suite.

And if you want mxf direct access go with Raylight.

But I guess I differ with David about what is the best available NLE on the Mac. No way I would use Premiere over FCP just to get mxf direct access.

If that is important, mxf direct access is $200 more.

But Barry Green's straw view of HVX200 users indicate that the majority of them are on a Mac, and in all probability FCP. That says something.

And remember, because you posted this elsewhere, that you need redundant backups for tapeless media. So I usually copy to a HDD and log and transfer to FCP.

THAT workflow facilitates preserving the meta data on the original p2 volume, and allows me to work directly in QT.
 
1. What's one thing you wish someone had told you when you got started in video?

dont try to do everything yourself. there are sound guys, light guys and grips for a reason

2. What's the most valuable thing YOU would like to impart to a beginner?

ALWAYS double check your camera settings. you cant just assume nothing has changed since you last used it.

3. What's one piece of equipment I haven't listed that you would like to recommend or what's one piece of equipment I have listed that you think I should reconsider?

- microphones! you'll need at least 1 good lav and 1 good shotgun. if you only have one lav, id suggest going wired as opposed to wireless. i have a sony ecm77 that serves me well. for shotgun, my tool of choice is the sennheiser mkh416

- lights! although it can be done - i HIGHLY suggest not going ghetto with work lights. id suggest a basic kit of 2 500w softboxes and one 250w spot would be a good "get-ya-going" setup
 
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wgzn said:
maybe my workflow is different from davids, but i work with the hvx and final cut studio 2 (as well as all the adobe stuff) and i have ZERO problems.
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I never said you couldn't use FCP; obviously, many do.

I'm saying, don't go with it because you simply assume it's the best option. Explore others and find out the advantages they offer, and THEN make your choice. I don't see how anyone could have a problem with that.
 
David S. said:
But I guess I differ with David about what is the best available NLE on the Mac. No way I would use Premiere over FCP just to get mxf direct access.
Click to expand...

Not the only advantage, of course. As I say, some thorough research is in order before you make a decision.
 
I agree.

Having had Premiere CS3 since its release, and having used it occasionally since direct mxf was added, I'm still a FCP guy.

It integrates well with AE, PS, etc. Not as well with Encore CS3 when working with blu ray projects.

But AE and PS work nicely with FCP, and I also have Motion, Soundtrack Pro, Cinema Tools, Color, LT, Compressor, and DVD SP.

Basically, if you're on a Mac, it's probably FCS2.
 
Also there is the consideration of having a job outside of your own personal work. Learning FCP or Avid would be a wise thing to do if you intend to work as an editor for hire. Very few post houses are using anything else. Something to think about.

Noah
 
oh! id also suggest on your tripod choice - flip your recipe. cartoni head on manfrotto legs. most sub $1000 manfrotto heads are kinda lame
 
davbeisner said:
I'm a beginner at video and I want to learn from the pros. That said, let me give a little history:

I'm only 23, but I've been in the pro audio industry for almost ten years now and I currently run a small recording studio and I do pretty well at it and make some pretty good money. I've got extensive audio experience with studio work, live sound, and installation. That said, I think I understand technology fairly well and so I'm hoping I'll be able to transition to video fairly easily (though I know it's going to take a lot of work to learn everything!) I'm just finishing up college (I graduate in May '09) but my school has already hired me full time. They want me to take my skills in technology, learn how to do video work, and then create over a hundred 5-10 minute promo videos for use in fundraising and admissions. They're pretty much investing a couple months worth of my salary (which isn't bad either!) in getting me trained in videography and video technology.

I'm having weekly training sessions with the Film prof at our school and he's teaching me a lot of stuff with compositing and framing and how to use a camera from an artistic standpoint.

I've spent the last four weeks reading forums here, at dvinfo, apple, adobe, and more, just trying to learn. I'll be using the lynda.com tranining videos to learn FCP, After Effects, Photoshop, and Flash (a lot of the stuff I do will also be developed on our website).

Right now it looks like they'll be buying me an HVX200A with an extra 16GB card (means I'll have two 16gb cards), a Mac Pro with FCP and some basic video/audio hardware (looking at the Blackmagic Intensity Pro for video--want to be able to use HDMI outputs to monitor on HD screen--and the M-Audio ProFire 2626 for Audio--allows me to use a lot of the pro-audio gear I already own including an ADAT HD24 for multitracking and it works with ProTools M-Powered if we decide we need to purchase that eventually.) Then I'll also be getting a good tripod (looking to spend somewhere around $1400 and I'm looking at a Manfroto head on Cartoni sticks). For lighting, I put myself through college by working construction so I already have three 1000 watt lighting trees. I can get old color films and diffusers from our theater department here at the school. I've also read (I think it was here) that hanging a shower curtain in front of the lights is a great difuser.

So I've pretty much got the equipment stuff figured out and planned out. I've been able to keep the total cost for everything under $15k which I think is pretty good. Now I just need to spend time learning the art of the trade.

That's where y'all come in: Three questions for y'all:
1. What's one thing you wish someone had told you when you got started in video?
2. What's the most valuable thing YOU would like to impart to a beginner?
3. What's one piece of equipment I haven't listed that you would like to recommend or what's one piece of equipment I have listed that you think I should reconsider?

Y'all's advice is much appreciated and I look forward to reading your responses!


David

P.S. are any of you in the Chattanooga, TN area and willing to let me spend some time learning from you? I'd be happy to volunteer doing whatever was needed on a shoot (I can wrap cables pretty well!) just to get some time on a shoot learning from the pros...
Click to expand...


1. Learn how to use light ! It's 10,000 times more important than what gear you have. Get a basic three light kit.

2. Learn how to block out a scene.

3. Location Location Location. Where you're shooting or what you're shooting has a ton to do with how it looks. One of the things that you'll see in student films is that they are often photographed in someone's tiny apartment with empty white walls. No design, no interesting angles or colors.

4. What's in your background? Does it work for the scene? Learn to use DOF when necessary but don't become obsessed with shooting every single shot wide open on a long lens. Often it's too much.

5. Don't get caught in the technical "measurbator" black hole (it's VERY easy to get stuck there) It's good to know how to use the tools that you work with... but your MAIN objective is to tell a story with composition, light & movement. Your job is not to be the super tech. If you feel inclined to be that techie all the time then perhaps you're better suited being a DIT and not a DP.

I prefer FCP and if you can wait a little while I'll bet the HPX-170 will be a better camera in many respects than the 200A.
 
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1. What's one thing you wish someone had told you when you got started in video? Be diligent in your casting. Don't underestimate the fact that there are really good actors out there who will work for whatever you can pay, because they want to break in just like you do, and really good actors are critical.

2. What's the most valuable thing YOU would like to impart to a beginner? Story and style trump every piece of equipment and budgetary constraint humanly imaginable. If you can't come up with a story/script on paper or in-camera, then find someone who can and treat them like gold.

3. What's one piece of equipment I haven't listed that you would like to recommend or what's one piece of equipment I have listed that you think I should reconsider? Soft box lighting. So critical to getting brightly lit shots that are flattering and cinematic without harsh shadows. I say all you need is a camera, a softbox and a microphone! ;-)
 
This is an excellent thread for anyone who is learning the art, regardless of whether they are brand new or have some experience.
 
wgzn said:
- microphones! you'll need at least 1 good lav and 1 good shotgun. if you only have one lav, id suggest going wired as opposed to wireless. i have a sony ecm77 that serves me well. for shotgun, my tool of choice is the sennheiser mkh416
Click to expand...

Already got some excellent studio microphones from my pro audio business. I run mostly Neumann and high-end AKG with a few Audio Technicas and Sennheisers thrown in for specialty applications. I don't yet have a good shotgun or lav, but they're both already in my equipment request list... just forgot to list them here. Anything major that I shoot is going to be very well miked and recorded multitrack using an ADAT HD24 digital multitracker. It's just for the random "run and gun" and interview stuff that I need to increase my collection. What are the pros and cons re: using a camera mounted shotgun as opposed to one on a boom? I won't always have a boom operator to help me.
 
1. What's one thing you wish someone had told you when you got started in video?
Click to expand...
Don't seperate yourself from your competitors. Embrace them as a part of your field and as colleagues and teammates.


2. What's the most valuable thing YOU would like to impart to a beginner?
Click to expand...
Learn how production crews work on feauture film sets and study the specific job descriptions, what the work is and how the work is carried out.


3. What's one piece of equipment I haven't listed that you would like to recommend or what's one piece of equipment I have listed that you think I should reconsider?
Click to expand...
Hollwood Camerawork DVD box set.
 
davbeisner said:
What are the pros and cons re: using a camera mounted shotgun as opposed to one on a boom? I won't always have a boom operator to help me.
Click to expand...

A camera-mounted mic will almost never yield you good results. The bedrock rule: get your mic as close to your sound source as possible.
 
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