Why does the HVX aesthetically look so good?

Relax Kholi... your still in the midst of your 'ive just bought an EX' frame of mind -

I think its only right that the hvx strengths are celebrated too and if thats er throught a self pleasuring (ooh er) topic like this, then lets have one, we've had a few for the EX too ya know.

Nobody is making up these opinions Kholi, i mean heck im buying an HPX and a 2nd hvx, its not like im stupid and i dont see what the EX can do - it just doesnt have mojo TO ME - if it does TO YOU then rock on.

But given this is the dvxuser forum, im sure a bit of celebration for why hvx users love their cam is acceptable without it getting shot down by an excited new EX owner!

We can agree to disagree and let the er hvx self pleasuring begin hehe
 
When you start bringing in Red, or SI 2 k , keep in mind that the resolution of the Red actually winds up being 2.5 K instead of 4 K because its a Bayer sensor. Don't get too fixated on the rez numbers alone. It takes all three ingredients, resolution, color and contrast to make soup.
 
Check the DVXfest section. Username: WARTEZ

This is the kinda example I've been waiting for as far as the EX-1 went. Someone who tweaked the camera out and learned it THEN applied it to a short movie. I guess maybe it's just me, but even with the shortcomings from the 35mm adapter (which have since been fixed) it looks every bit as good as an HVX image and then some.
 
Man precisely, i mean heck my hvx has made enuf $ to buy a good few more hvx's or EX's, and heck even got a promo i directed for marvin estrellado to the final 6 of Fox TV's story teller challenge annnnnd landed me a prospective feature deal...

So when we munch on about numbers who are we kidding - i think we produce best on the cam we love, whatever that cam may be, but lets not throw numbers at each other, let mojo folk love speak for itself.

I mean Kholi why - OH WHY are you on this thread basically saying you think the EX is better, so what - got your opinion... but look at the topic title? Is there a reason your piping on about this other than you've just got an EX... I promise i won't harass xdcam users when i get an hpx500 just to reassure my purchase etc... Surprise surprise but people like different things... things that some folk may never understand over others etc

Folk get too neurotic about all the wrong things! I mean look at the features getting cinema releases with even the HVX my god - isnt the point of res about what we reckon is 'good enough'...
 
Mark Smith said:
When you start bringing in Red, or SI 2 k , keep in mind that the resolution of the Red actually winds up being 2.5 K instead of 4 K because its a Bayer sensor. Don't get too fixated on the rez numbers alone. It takes all three ingredients, resolution, color and contrast to make soup.
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It's one ingredient the HVX has been lacking since the dawn of it's time and it's no dirty secret. It looks like uprezzed SD. It's ENOUGH for what anyone wants to do, that's for sure!

=B Just that it's obviously no longer the only camera that can produce an "organic" image from the digital base.
 
Jeez could you act like anymore like a fanboy if you even tried!

Did you hear? The EX's tears could cure cancer... only the EX never cries hehe

Cooome on... Did you buy a camera or did you just buy a spec sheet for HD aquisition... cos theres more than the numbers to be concerned about. HVX has adorned the cinema for all kinds of top movies... the EX has a lot to do before it proves itself - beyond you and other fanboy rantings!

This thread is about why the hvx rocks in its filmlike image and colour, we got your opinion, theres no reason to keep it flaming - theres like so many more hvx users here who would be peeved at that comment and its not what this thread is about.

Its just my opinion the EX doesnt look filmic, even its adapter footage looks strangely 'crossed' between video and filmlooks. That may sound insane but thats an opinion. You can't argue someone into thinking their cam sucks (whatever it is) and when they buy a new one jeez - theres muuust be the best.

But honestly Kholi just give it a break already! When i see an EX film that looks filmlike without all kinds of crap being done to it then ill sing its praises... as filmlook and cadence is the most important for me... and if i want a super duper hd cam do u think im gonna buy a prosumer EX or HVX? Noooooo.... but given whats getting on the cinema now maybe i don't have too tra lala
 
lawriejaffa said:
Jeez could you act like anymore like a fanboy if you even tried!

Did you hear? The EX's tears could cure cancer... only the EX never cries hehe

Cooome on... Did you buy a camera or did you just buy a spec sheet for HD aquisition... cos theres more than the numbers to be concerned about. HVX has adorned the cinema for all kinds of top movies... the EX has a lot to do before it proves itself - beyond you and other fanboy rantings; a simple search of your recent post history exemplifies this FACT.

This thread is about why the hvx rocks in its filmlike image and colour, we got your opinion, theres no reason to keep it flaming - theres like so many more hvx users here who would be peeved at that comment and its not what this thread is about.

The EX doesnt look filmic, even its adapter footage looks strangely 'crossed' between video and filmlooks. That may sound insane but thats an opinion. You won't argue someone into thinking their cam sucks (whatever it is) and when they buy a new one jeez - theres muuust be the best.

But honestly Kholi just give it a break already! When i see an EX film that looks filmlike without all kinds of crap being done to it then ill sing its praises... as filmlook and cadence is the most important for me.
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I specifically quoted you on this to further discredit anything you ever have to say on these forums again.

Due to your ignorance on the subject, you've made avail the information needed to pin you as an over zealous fan of no-one-but-yourself. You've failed to read any other posts in this thread, failed to dedicate any time into researching who you're outright ATTACKING or the motive behind my voice.

I don't own an EX-1. I haven't bought one yet. I'm using my HVX200 tomorrow and Wednesday to put more beans and wieners on my dinner table. I may not get one on account the problems users are having with the hardware at the moment.

I would suggest, from here on out, you cease posting until you've read what other people have to say... B) Ingested the information presented to you in a text-based format (easy ingestion, I would assume, for anyone that can read) as the many different forms of right to speech and freedom of opinion and C) prepared your posts in a fashion that makes proud the educational institutions from which you've hailed.

At the moment, you've come off as nothing more than narcissistic in the fact that you love to read your own idle one-sided prattling about your choice of innimate object.

Short version: Stop posting until you get your head out of your ass.

Do note: I don't plan to respond to anything you have to say after this point. Do yourself a favor and take a moment to think about the idiocy you're displaying.
 
See you just yourself worked up! Take a chill pill cowboy - like i say this thread is a bit of fun really and your getting nuts - sooo relax.

Your the one that felt the need to post and argue to death an opinion obviously not shared by the topic poster or just about anyone else in the thread!!!

So...

"I don't plan to respond to anything you have to say after this point."

Well... *checks watch* I hope so...
 
The hvx has beautiful colours straight out of the camera and needs little tweaking in post to get a good picture. I think this really is a strength because with all these lower colour sampling cameras the more you have to push and pull in post the worse the picture becomes in my opinion. Something happens to it where it loses its fullness and takes on a digital quality. It is hard to explain but i think people can relate. Like with dvx footage if you can get it close in camera its much nicer than pushed and pulled in post.

Cheers
 
Well sure,

Weird thing is though - if EX and adapter was so perfect that it makes me the idiot or whatever kholi said hehe, then hell everyone with an hvx would sell it now... So its not insanity lol its an opinion held probably by most or many - that i don't know (or care to debate) but its credible... i mean sheesh thats why this topic exists bless ;)

Anyway peace out Kholi i respect you bro u do good work, but you gotta appreciate that other opinions can be reaaally different and can appear totally irrational to you, but its vice versa bro! But its all good surely ;P
 
lawriejaffa said:
Well this is the way i've felt, ive yet to see footage that blows me away from the EX in terms of filmlike and cadence/motion and colour its just faulty imo.

Its sharp, but ruthlessly sharp, and even with adapters and alll the other goodies it lacks the mojo! I'll have you know Kholi ive copyrighted that 'mojo' term my god in the image stakes debate!

It may well come to colour and its visual representation, certainly the word organic applies. Folk imo fall for the numbers game and thats why we see such a need for EX folk to go on and on about this resolution difference...

Buuut come on, we live in a world where right now hvx movies are getting distribution deals - and showings in the cinema - so that argument means nothing - but what looks good means everything. In the narrative drama/film look perspective the hvx comes tops imo.

The digi slr looking montages of blooms promo's etc, really show off its rez and many of the cams visual aspects (albeit graded heavily) but seeing the footage from normal folks... and with moving shots, it just seems to stutter a little. Its subjective and just my opinion - but the HVX does a good all round job, the EX just seems concerned with BANG this very marketable high resolution issue :P
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Now you sound like a creationism vs evolution defender, trying to substantiate something you can't measure. But....but...science is wrong!

The EX1 has more res. It has larger chips. (Science)

The HVX has a nice look. it's popular. (Creationism)

ive yet to see footage that blows me away from the EX in terms of filmlike and cadence/motion and colour
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Yes, people ask for the HVX, the HVX has been around long enough to be proven. The vastness and variety of work produced on it is staggering. And yet you expect to see work of that caliber on an camera that's only been shipping in mass quantities since november? Clients are supposed to ask for a camera they've never heard of? These things take time.

Folk imo fall for the numbers game and thats why we see such a need for EX folk to go on and on about this resolution difference...
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And yet at the same time we've got hvx folk doing the same but in reverse. So how are you any better? Are you saying if panasonic made an EX1 clone res wise you'd tell them it was too sharp? When the new HVX comes out you'll tell them to keep the noise in?

And colourspace sounds like a numbers game to me "4:2:2 owns 4:2:0" people say left and right, those look like numbers to me. Hmmm....

Buuut come on, we live in a world where right now hvx movies are getting distribution deals - and showings in the cinema - so that argument means nothing - but what looks good means everything. In the narrative drama/film look perspective the hvx comes tops imo.
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Compared to what? What has been comparable to the HVX and been battling it out with it for almost 3 years? The EX1? It ships with a Delorean? What are you gonna say when an EX1 movie hits theaters?

And to be technical movies have been shot on much worse than both, so who needs either camera?

The digi slr looking montages of blooms promo's etc, really show off its rez and many of the cams visual aspects (albeit graded heavily)
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That's his job, it's what his clients ask for and he delivers, it doesn't have to live up to whatever unit of measure you're judging these things by, and he's one man, his work shouldn't have to speak for all the hvx footage out there.

but seeing the footage from normal folks... and with moving shots, it just seems to stutter a little. Its subjective and just my opinion -
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Well at least you've admitted it's an opinion because I disagree, at this point 24p is 24p all the manufacturers have figured it out by now.

- but the HVX does a good all round job, the EX just seems concerned with BANG this very marketable high resolution issue :P
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The HVX does do an excellent job. That's what the EX1 is concerned with? It told you that? Or did the people defending it, because you've got to realize they're not the same thing.

The EX1 is a fairly new camera, it'd be insane to say that there are not things about it that sony got right, after all they've had the HVX to look at since 2005.

Statistically speaking there is a higher chance of the EX1 being better than the HVX then there can be of the HVX being better than the EX1. That's just the nature of technology and time.

At this point the HVX's biggest plus and selling point is DVCPRO HD, it's an awesome codec, 4:2:2 is nice, but not a necessity. How many here in this thread or this board have truly pushed the limits of HDV, and on a consistent basis? Now the EX1 is HDV Plus, for what %80 of people shoot it'll be more than enough.

That doesn't mean the HVX is bad, but it's getting long in the tooth. If you like it great, keep it, if you haven't bought anything the EX1 is an attractive option, there's no denying that, it handles better than the HVX, it's got a better LCD, it's got more res, it's got longer recording times. But the HVX is CCD based, has a better codec suited to more graphics intensive stuff and post processing.

Not all of either matter to everybody (bad sentence I know), but some may matter enough to push a person in either direction.

Neither are a bad choice.

PS: So no one point the finger at me I personally own a canon a1, I personally love the image it puts out, but I have no problem using an HVX or EX1, I've used a both and I like both...a lot. I just don't want these two brothers to battle to the death in a knife fight because us parents can only love one. :D
 
Jeez do you realise your totally off-topic? Was this thread concieved for folk to come on and argue why the poster or for example me are just basically wrong or ignorant lol... Your comparing me to a creationist because i think the hvx is basically superior to the EX in filmlook... We are not talking about science, we're talking about the subjective nature of an image - which like any visual artform is open to interpretation.

Does a post-modern painting of angular objects with 3 colours look better than a kids drawing with a 16 crayons (who knows!!) I'm fed up of hearing about this resolution issue, when its not pertinent to either films that are getting on cinema or for the reason many buy hvx's... There apples and oranges...

So everything is subjective... This is a subjective topic for folks leaning to this opinion... to discuss within that what it is that gives the hvx such a nice filmlook...

Ecking i don't see why you think your reply is helpful, its not a debate about this cam and that, its just about the hvx's superior filmlook - an opinion, but its the subject of this topic and it isnt asking for dissenting opinions on the matter from other cam owners is it? Ie. is the HVX the best filmlook? Well no...

If someone makes a topic like 'Why i love my EX, or my A1 etc' is it an excuse for everyone under the sun to come in and argue against why that particular topic starter is wrong and ignorant for not liking their cam. Surely not! Theres no neutrality on this issue whatever cam someone has... its just a case of whether saying 'no the hvx sucks my cam is better' has anything to do with this particular forum topic... it clearly doesn't... So im sure their not necessary or constructive! Sheesh your no devil's advocate and im not a creationist! lol :P
 
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lawriejaffa said:
Jeez do you realise your totally off-topic? Was this thread concieved for folk to come on and argue why the poster or for example me are just basically wrong or ignorant lol...

Everything is subjective... This is a subjective topic for folks leaning to this opinion... to discuss within that what it is that gives the hvx such a nice filmlook...

Ecking i don't see why you think your reply is helpful, its not a debate about this cam and that, its just about the hvx's superior filmlook - an opinion, but its the subject of this topic and it isnt asking for dissenting opinions on the matter from other cam owners is it? Ie. is the HVX the best filmlook? Well no...

If someone makes a topic like 'Why i love my EX, or my A1 etc' is it an excuse for everyone under the sun to come in and argue against why that particular topic starter is wrong and ignorant for not liking their cam. Surely not! Theres no neutrality on this issue whatever cam someone has... its just a case of whether saying 'no the hvx sucks my cam is better' has anything to do with this particular forum topic... it clearly doesn't... So im sure their not necessary or constructive!
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Hey maybe I'm high but I seem to remember the first post being the one that started the EX1 vs HVX thing in this thread. And then you came in and did the same.

Can you talk about why the HVX has such a nice filmlook without talking about the EX1? Because you haven't, you've used the EX1 as punching bag for why the HVX is so great.

If sentences were "the HVX makes a great filmlook because the way it renders motion and colour resemble commonly seen filmstocks" instead of what was basically "the hvx has a great filmlook because the EX1 does not" maybe you'd have a valid arguement, but that's not the way you approached it.

Here's a perfect example:
Ecking i don't see why you think your reply is helpful, its not a debate about this cam and that, its just about the hvx's superior filmlook
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The moment you use words like this, it's a debate.

The thread title is not about why it's THE BEST it's about why IT IS GOOD. But once inside the thread all that's happened is people have been saying why it's the best, which was not the original purpose of the thread.

You guys took it off topic.
 
Wow a lot of great info for both cameras. What does that do to me? It just makes it harder to decide which camera I want to replace my Dvx100 with - dam you all - now I have to sit back and think again!!!!!!! and jus think I was sooo close in deciding! do I want the EX1 or the HVX - Dam Dam and double Dam!

By the way what films have been done with the HVX beside cloverfield?

I think I will head over to Ebay and buy myself some boxing gloves :-)
 
Yah but ive stressed its an opinion ecking, and opinion expressed in a thread that is all about that SAME opinion. This is also the dvxuser forum - the hvx section at that!!! Is there really a deep and insightful need for it to be flamed by the likes of yooouuu and kholiflour hmm? ;) Its all a bit of fun but its tiresome guys. Is it not enough that the hvx section of the dvxuser forum have its users laud what they 'percieve' to be their cams strengths, just as you guys get to roll on about your cams 'percieved' strengths. Must we flame alll the topics... can't we all just get along? ;)

The topic is not asking for anyone to come in and debate that opinion... So can you not see that its no license for folk to come in and get incendiary. As far as im concerned given you guys are just off topic!

You'll find a few Corine, heck im sure the chap thats got a lionsgate distribution deal on this very forum will get his into the cinema too... used in varied fx shots for massive big budget features too, like the departed etc.

But look this isnt the point, and i honestly think you guys are taking the pi*s a bit coming in and making a ruckus... Its not like every EX or A1 or whatever thread is invaded and turn into a barnie!
 
ecking said:
And yet at the same time we've got hvx folk doing the same but in reverse. So how are you any better? Are you saying if panasonic made an EX1 clone res wise you'd tell them it was too sharp? When the new HVX comes out you'll tell them to keep the noise in?
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Boy, did you ever snatch the words right out of my thoughts.

"Too Sharp!"

"TOo much resolution!"

Do say "It's not my preference to have sharpness and resolution of the sort."

Don't say "It's more film like because it's soft!"

Yeah, trying watching a movie in HD and tell me how soft it is. Tell me how mushy the trees in the background are.

The HVX is a good camera. It makes me money weekly but that doesn't mean I'm blind to what's being released. The thing is about three years old!

There's no doubt on the planet that the HVX produces an incredibly Film-Like image. It looks great when paired with a 35mm Adapter and thrown on the big screen (Cloverfield and Sarah Landon are poor examples of HVX on the big screen).

It still has a good three to four years of shelf life and beyond, and it'll still trump all other Prosumer Cameras until Panasonic drops the full-on successor (FULL 1080p, Magnificent Latitude, Very low Noise Floor, Panasonic Flavor) to the camera.

It's a GREAT digital stock, and so is the A1, H1, DVX100, and now the EX-1 proven by Wartez.
 
Um sooooo your back Kholi...

Come on guys this isnt your personal rant topic... why are you here - your FLAMING this thread... don't you see that!? It wasn't even directed to EX or other cam users... its pathetic! I hope the mods clean this up as this thread is like a tribute to a cam 99% of the users of this forum love, and its ridiculous it should be spoilt by debates that can be made (and have been made) a million times already.
 
its a shame its come to this in this guys thread.

Ive tweaked my HVX scene files to the point where we get almost zero noise with a PROFESSIONAL GAFFER.
I was watching "We own the night" last night and was wondering what they shot it with because the blacks were noisy as all get out.
Im sorry but I wouldnt buy anything (other than a Red One) this year... I mean with NAB weeks away, the DVX replacement cam looks llke its set to be on par with the EX1, image wise, how crazy is that? And then theres Scarlet? And where did that Hydra technology get to? And who knows what Panny has up their sleeve as far as announcements (next gen HVX perhaps?)

If you (ANYBODY) love the EX1 thats great, but can we keep this about the HVX, the wonderful bundle of HD camera that it is :2vrolijk_08:
 
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