The ModoSteady for the HV20

batesey said:
LOL James, I dont know why but there seems to be a lot of people who are negative right from the get go concerning this item.
I pretty did the same thing you did, looked at the information online and made the decision that this little stabiliser would be good enough for my purposes. It seems the gamble paid off :-) Maybe some feel a little insecure that they have spent a great deal more and must somehow justify the expense. For me, the cost of other solutions far outweighed the results when you consider the price of the camcorder to begin with.
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I've used it, hands on, in person. The very first day it was released to the public.

And no insecurity involved ... I don't feel I wasted the near $30k & 4 years I've spent on my Steadicam(s). And the training.

Glad it's working for you. But don't expect it to work for everyone. And there's nothing to gain in calling out other's reviews as justifications for insecurities. If those of us who do this stuff for a living have a problem with it; we are going to say so honestly for the benefit of those who may not have the opportunity or the experience to test it fairly in comparison to the other options available.

And to continue on my review; if you want to buy something because It's cheap, then the Modo is a good option. But if you want to buy something because it's good, then find something good - and then worry about the price.



- Mikko
 
Oh boy, this costs me more time then I think it is worth.

I tried it shortly with a little handycam and was not happy. Its hard to recall tough. This 3 in 1 concept is oriented for people that do not have any form of stabilization or support. So it is a counterbalance stabilizer, shoulder support, and tabletop tripod in one. It is a one concept doing everything, but nothing fine.

As a counterbalance stabilizer I was not able to have good floating experience, any sudden movement was like a hard shake visible. The counteraction was to small. The balance was not supporting free movements, it was always 'too little too late'. There was 'creeping' in the Z-axis. It was hard to make adjustments to make it a better experience. Positive: It was better then nothing.

The arm extension is laughable strange, there is flex in the whole system and to use it as a comfortable shoulder support, you need to setup it extensionally. The weight remains on your arm/hand. The plastic/rubber parts just do not give you enough support, the joints are too loose, and the system gives no possibility to change anything on camera. Something you can with any shoulder support. As a table-stand you can use anything small and cheap, this ball-joint system is nothing for video (i.e. there is no smooth friction), so no need for the modo here.

Price is going down rapidly, here in EU you have one for 100 Euro. If you want one, just wait.
 
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Hey XRay, are you aware of the removable weight plates?
Just wondering, because there are ways to balance it perfect
and that eliminates the jerk in motion.

- James
 
Ahhh, well here we go.

-mbwkrause

Hmmm assumptions and Attacks hey...interesting. I don’t see any point to your post at all. I never singled out anyone’s posts or attacked anyone directly; all I said was that right off the bat many were negative about the Modo. I don’t see how you can comment on the issue having only seen information on the web. I find it rather humorous actually. Also in no way did I challenge Mikko or Xray concerning their professionalism and knowledge of stabilisers, but i think a lot of people are taking this way to far, I never said it was the all perfect, all mighty SteadiCam or Merlin killing camera stabiliser. All i said that if you want and alternative for your HV20, its a must.
You should reread my first post.

-mikkowilson
mikkowilson said:
And no insecurity involved ... I don't feel I wasted the near $30k & 4 years I've spent on my Steadicam(s). And the training.
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And I'm not suggesting you have, but your also not using the hV20 on such rigs or for those high end productions either. lets keep this in context. we are not trying to stabilise a 35mm film camera as I'm sure is your case on a day to day basis. we are stabilising a $600US Handy cam.

mikkowilson said:
Glad it's working for you. But don't expect it to work for everyone. And there's nothing to gain in calling out other's reviews as justifications for insecurities.
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Come on, review? There is nothing to gain from your first response either. Your very first "review" on the subject was "It's a waste of money. Not worth it." To you, that maybe the case, as a "professional Steady Cam Operator" it may be. But lets remember this thread is about -The ModoSteady for the HV20-. Also I didn’t imply this is a single solution that would work for everyone. I was only suggesting that if you weight up the costs of your camera and a descent stabiliser, the Modo is a good way to go.

mikkowilson said:
And to continue on my review; if you want to buy something because It's cheap, then the Modo is a good option. But if you want to buy something because it's good, then find something good - and then worry about the price.
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and that’s my point, the Modo is good, actually perfect for the HV20; and because its good is why I purchased it...again, I am not trying to stabilise a 35mm film camera or the like on the modo.

At the end of the day if you are considering this item, take the advice of this thread (including my own) with a grain of salt. As with nearly all things in this industry, if you can, test it, and ascertain for yourself if it will suit your needs.
Cheers.
 
Who are you talking to?
If me, than you must realize that I work as a videographer/editor over 80 hours
a week, so I'm sorry if I don't feel like making a video to prove something. I like
the product and that is where I stand.
 
I don't have an HV20, but as far as featherweight cams go I do have a Sanyo Xacti HD1000, which weighs in at about 9 ounces. I just recently picked up the Modo Steady at B&H and FWIW, here's my 2-cents on it...

First off, it is NOT a serious competitor to the Merlin. The ball/socket design can not truly effectivey compete with a "true" gimble design, the construction along with the "technopolymer" material is not as rigid nor is it as precise as the Merlin. While there is limited adjustment along the X & Y axis points, It doesn't have the "fine tuning" abilities as the Merlin and there really isn't a way to adjust the Z. The arc can be adjusted, but again not to the extent or precision of Merlin. That being said, it can still be quite useful for very small & lightweight cams.

Using a Merlin with something like the Xacti camcorders is a joke. The cameras are just way too small and light for it to really be effective. Besides, the size and weight of the Merlin somewhat negates the advantage of having such a small camera. The Modo Steady works better in this respect. It's significantly smaller than the Merlin as well as much more portable, and if you follow the same principles to achieve proper balance as you would in setting up the Merlin (it doesn't hurt to download the Merlin manual to get a good idea of the concepts involved in proper balancing), the results can be surprisingly decent. Tip #1: Acheiving proper balance and a light touch are the keys!

Tip #2: One of the main disadvantages of the Modo Steady is it's lack of a true gimble. While you can release the "lock-down" screw to get a fair degree of free motion, there will always be some friction present. I just ordered some "NYOil II" and plan on lubricating the ball & socket joint to help reduce the friction. Of course I don't expect it to be perfect, but I do believe it will help considerably.

Tip #3: Practice, Practice, Practice! Don't expect smooth pans, tilts & glides right off the bat. It's even tougher with such a small & light camera.

To be honest, I'm still in the newbie phase and am nowhere near as proficient as I'd like to be, but I'm working on it! :)

P.S. I also have a Sony HDR-SR1 which weighs in a just under 2lbs. I haven't tried the Modo Steady with it yet, but I'd guess that the Merlin would be a much better choice for this camera.

- Ugly.
 
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Ugly,
I have the Sanyo HD1000 too and bought the modosteady to try out. I've been experimenting a lot with the included weights to balance it perfectly- and can't come to a consensus on what to use. I've tried 2 plates alone and 2 plates with some coins to add a little more. What are you doing to get the balance/weight perfect?
 
trapper said:
Ugly,
I have the Sanyo HD1000 too and bought the modosteady to try out. I've been experimenting a lot with the included weights to balance it perfectly- and can't come to a consensus on what to use. I've tried 2 plates alone and 2 plates with some coins to add a little more. What are you doing to get the balance/weight perfect?
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I'm still experimenting as I've had it less than a week, but so far the setup that's been working best for me so far is:

- 3 weights (drop time is still too quick, but I haven't been able to get balance stabilized with only 2 weights)

- Arc set a "hair" greater than 2 (Getting the arc right seems to be one of the trickiest parts... even the slightest changes has a big effect on the balance with the HD1000)

- Left/right balance screw turned counter-clockwise almost all of the way (to shift the mounting plate to the right to account for the wieght displacement of the display screen)

- Removable mounting plate mounted to the underside of the camera so that the three "empty" holes are towards the FRONT of the camera (This was the best I've been able to do to control the fore/aft position since there's no fine tuning adjustment for that).

I should note that I have a Tiffen UV filter attached, which while negligible in weight I thought should be mentioned. I should also note that I DO NOT have the little hand strap attached to the camera. I also plan on getting a Raynox HD6600 .66x wide angle lens and a 49mm step-up ring for the Sanyo. The wider angle should help further smooth things out and I'm hoping the additional mass/weight will aid in obtaining a better drop time.

- Ugly.
 
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Now this has me thinking about all of the little nits & niggles I have about the Modo Steady and what enhancements I would suggest if someone from Bogen/Manfrotto were listening...

- First and foremost, forget about the 3-in-1 shoulder support and tripod gimick. The shoulder support functionality is virtually useless with this design and mini-tripods are compact and cheap enough not to worry about. Concentrate on the stabilizer aspect... That's what everyone is interested in with this device.

- Improve the head to allow the mounting plate to slide forward or backward (just like what's already provided for left & right adjustment). Also add graduated markings so we can record different settings for different cameras.

- Change the design to add an adjustment knob on the second joint (just like the one on the first joint) to further tweak the radius of the arc. While you're at it, allow for more travel on the adjustment knob of the foot (that holds the metal plates) so it can be positioned parallel to the head (don't forget the graduated markings here as well)

- Changing to a true gimble design is probably wishful thinking, but one can wish couldn't they?


I guess what I'm really describing here is a Mini-Merlin... with the same features at 2/3 the size made for cameras under 1.5lbs

- Ugly.
 
That would be perfect, and about $400 more.
For $185 you get a good product here.
However it's not for the HV20 if you have the Canon Wide Angle lens attached.
It's just too heavy then.

- James
 
After spending a long time trying to get the balancing perfect-- I had really good results with the Modosteady and my Sanyo HD1000.... The fine tuning required to get the arc/knob adjusted perfectly is pretty annoying- but once set up, it makes a huge difference. I tested it walking around the driveway and up the stairs going very quickly. Without the Modosteady the camera shake is all over and at times very distracting and unwatchable (I intentionally tried to film it acting natural and not paying particular attention to avoid excess hand shake). With the Modosteady I was able to walk just as fast and without trying to reduce camera shake-- the built in ball joint made a very watchable- smooth video. Definately not smooth as a Merlin but smooth enough that I am going to keep it. Now if I actually practice I am sure I can remove the camera shake even more and make it close to perfect.
 
trapper said:
After spending a long time trying to get the balancing perfect-- I had really good results with the Modosteady and my Sanyo HD1000.... The fine tuning required to get the arc/knob adjusted perfectly is pretty annoying- but once set up, it makes a huge difference...
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So... What settings/weights, etc. did you end up using?
 
I followed your advice with 3 weights-- and pretty much set it up just like you had... I think the most important variable is getting the vertical balance knob adjusted PERFECTLY -- because like you said-- even small variations throw off the balance by a lot. I edit my footage on a Mac and I still need to try out the SmoothCam feature in FCP to see if it removes the remaining shake from my videos.
 
Modo, Merlin, JR, Glidecam 2000, tree branch.

They all work, and they all work to produce some very smooth shots, the only requirement is practice. No the Modo doesn't have the same gimble as the Merlin, but does that mean useless? No. A straight 2 foot pipe attached to the tripod mount without a gimble at all will give you shots equal to a Steadicam, but you need practice, simple. A "waste of money. Not worth it.", hardly. But "if you want to buy something because it's good, then find something good - and then worry about the price.", then worry about the price? Hmm, all things Steadicam and to hell with the rest. The Modo is a good tool like the Merlin, and they ALL take time and practice to get the results you want. Nice product, and hardly a "waste of money".
 
mikkowilson said:
May I ask which Steadicam you have used, to come to this conclusion?
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I am always impressed by your calmness mikko!

Common people, it is all about the laws of physics, not about how much you train. If it is a piece of junk in the first place, you can't train hard and someday it will work like a real steadicam.

Sure, you can become better with it, but the results will just be acceptable for you, and not perfect at all. If you are happy enough with that, ok, go ahead. But don't fool yourself and don't try to fool others on this board!
 
Steadicam 3A and the Steadicam ProVid. Many years.

"it is all about the laws of physics, not about how much you train"... apparently you have never used a Steadicam. I'm sure you have some experience Mikko, no question, but your attitude as "the" voice of all that is Steadicam might be a bit premature at this point in your career.
 
I am far from an expert on this, but after playing around with a few home built stabilizers and now the Modo Steady, I'm come to a few conclusions...

First... A stabilizer without a gimble (like the $14 steadycam style) can indeed reduce camera jitter if properly balanced along the x and y axis. The problem seems to occur along the z axis. Without a gimble, the only way to control the z axis is by attempting to use your arm(s) as a shock absorber to control up & down motion as you walk, run, jump, etc. I guess with a lot of practice it can be achieved by some, but I haven't had any luck

Second... Size really does matter. The more mass you have both above and below the center of gravity, the smoother the flow. I would liken this to being aboard a huge cruise ship on the ocean as opposed to a small boat, or comparing the ride of a big old Cadillac to that of a Mini Cooper. So far the biggest issue I'm having with the Sanyo HD1000/Modo Steady combination is that it's so small and light, it's pretty sensitive even when balanced.

Third... Practice, practice and more practice. It's becoming clear to me that this isn't something that I can master in a few days. I'm going to have to decide if I'm willing to put in the effort to reap the rewards.

Just my 2 cents... Ugly.
 
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