FS5: Zacuto - Odyssey 7Q+ Compatibility Issues?

S

SamEdwards

Well-known member
Hey Folks,
I found a great deal on the Gratical Eye, bundled with the VTC Pro BasePlate. There's still one at BH if you're interested...
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1293754-REG/zacuto_z_s5rgreb_gratical_eye_bundle_for.html

But there are issues:
I'm running the SDI out from the Odyssey to the Gratical. The image is incredible, and you can see the image through the selected LUT.
Power is coming from the Swit 8U63 D-tap that is mounted in the camera. I'm using the Wooden Camera Dtap to mini hirose cable.
It looks great but occasionally the Gratical goes black for several seconds. Do you think this is an SDI issue or a power cable issue, or a SWIT issue, or an Odyssey issue? I ordered an additional SDI cable to see if this makes the problem go away.

Also, using the Zacuto extension cable for the handgrip, it seems like the record trigger to the Odyssey also gets flaky, ie it doesn't actually start the Odyssey recording. I have a Smallrig cable that replaces the two cables. I'll be giving that a try.

It's great to have my FS5 balanced on my shoulder, with a great viewfinder, but with complexity comes issues. Any advice would be appreciated.

With all of this gear mounted on the FS5, it's really not a small camera anymore. I will say that the Odyssey on the back rails really helps balance the Fujinon MK zoom.
 
Sam, you just made a great case for why someone should buy an FS7 instead of an FS5. :-) You'd have a better camera with more sophisticated features, a simpler setup for shooting, and probably would have saved money in the long run when you add it all up. I know my comments do nothing to help you now, but I'm saying it anyway for the benefit if others reading the thread. It's always worth it for and owner/operator to get an FS7 over an FS5.
 
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Hey Doug,
No harm in pointing it out. I can tell you that the number of times I've used the FS5 naked and been really happy that it was possible makes it worth it to me. It's also less expensive to go RAW with the FS5. No hardware needed! But I would love to be able to rate my ISO lower than 2000. Of course with the Odyssey, I use the -1 and -2 LUTs all the time, so effectively you do get the lower sensitivities.
Also the FS7 didn't have the variable ND when I bought. I use it all the time. Just goes to show the there's never a perfect camera.
If you're going to put a huge Fujinon MK on your camera, and then lug the Odyssey, the size of the body begins to be a pretty small part of the equation. I use the FS5 a lot with my stills lenses and that form factor works pretty well for me. No regrets.
The FS7II should have had software RAW. I might have upgraded. Unlike many FS5 owners who are worried about a MKII, I honestly would probably jump on it if it had better AF, and lower ISO's.

Thanks for weighing in. I'm still hoping that somebody who's used this combo will speak up. If not I'll ask on the FS5 Facebook group. I have 30 days to return this combo, and frankly if I can't get it to work more dependably I will...
 
SamEd said:
Hey Folks,
I found a great deal on the Gratical Eye, bundled with the VTC Pro BasePlate. There's still one at BH if you're interested...
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1293754-REG/zacuto_z_s5rgreb_gratical_eye_bundle_for.html

But there are issues:
I'm running the SDI out from the Odyssey to the Gratical. The image is incredible, and you can see the image through the selected LUT.
Power is coming from the Swit 8U63 D-tap that is mounted in the camera. I'm using the Wooden Camera Dtap to mini hirose cable.
It looks great but occasionally the Gratical goes black for several seconds. Do you think this is an SDI issue or a power cable issue, or a SWIT issue, or an Odyssey issue? I ordered an additional SDI cable to see if this makes the problem go away.

Also, using the Zacuto extension cable for the handgrip, it seems like the record trigger to the Odyssey also gets flaky, ie it doesn't actually start the Odyssey recording. I have a Smallrig cable that replaces the two cables. I'll be giving that a try.

It's great to have my FS5 balanced on my shoulder, with a great viewfinder, but with complexity comes issues. Any advice would be appreciated.

With all of this gear mounted on the FS5, it's really not a small camera anymore. I will say that the Odyssey on the back rails really helps balance the Fujinon MK zoom.
Click to expand...

There is one thing that springs to mind that might be worth checking. I use a Gratical Eye (although only with my FS7, I've never operated an FS5). The Eye has a screen-saving function to help prolong the longevity of the OLED display, which suffers burn-in if you overlays or other static imagery enabled. By default this is enabled in the menu, but can also be disabled (or, I think, at least change the timeout duration). It's supposed to use the proximity sensor beneath the eyepiece to tell if your face is near the EVF, and switch on the screen when it is, and off when it's not for more than the timeout duration. In my experience though, the sensor is not that accurate/reliable, and so occasionally switches off the display even when you're looking.

I've chosen to keep my screen-saver function enabled in all but the most critical shooting situations, but only because I've developed two workaround habits. If I have a free hand (usually my left hand), then I will just reach up and tap/swipe the proximity sensor to wake up the display (it comes on with <1sec delay). If I don't have a free hand then I find moving my face back a few centimetres and back towards the EVF works similarly, albeit sometimes with a small camera shake due to lack of contact.

It should be pretty easy to test if this is the issue you're experiencing, but I wouldn't be at all surprised! Let us know how you get on.

Real shame that this sensor doesn't work better, because otherwise it's a beautiful piece of kit! :-)

Cheers,

jason
 
Honestly this will sound rudimentary but I own the FS5 with raw upgrade and use an Atomos Shogun Inferno all the time. I have had this exact same thing happen while running SDI to the Atomos. The screen goes black for a few seconds and then the transmission is right back. In the beginning of use I have had this happen a few times sometimes even while actively recording. I found this would happen when I was actively running around a lot shooting handheld. So I wasn't sure what was wrong so I checked the footage and I found that I had lost parts of the image and had many artifacts and other things so I cost it up to bumping / tugging on the SDI cable which accounted for the loss of transmission from the camera to the recorder during recording of those clips when the screen went black. Are you moving the SDI cable at all even slightly while filming? I later played with my cable and found that even the slightest movement or bump could result in a loss of transmission even with the female SDI mounts securely fastened to the fs5 and the recorder. Sounds simple but this would the first thing I would check as I highly doubt it is the FS5, Odyssey, or Gratical failing.
 
Hey Sam, great reply. Thank you for not taking offense at my comments and coming back with a well-reasoned reponse. That is how things are supposed to be done on a forum.
 
sleekmedia said:
Honestly this will sound rudimentary but I own the FS5 with raw upgrade and use an Atomos Shogun Inferno all the time. I have had this exact same thing happen while running SDI to the Atomos. The screen goes black for a few seconds and then the transmission is right back. In the beginning of use I have had this happen a few times sometimes even while actively recording. I found this would happen when I was actively running around a lot shooting handheld. So I wasn't sure what was wrong so I checked the footage and I found that I had lost parts of the image and had many artifacts and other things so I cost it up to bumping / tugging on the SDI cable which accounted for the loss of transmission from the camera to the recorder during recording of those clips when the screen went black. Are you moving the SDI cable at all even slightly while filming? I later played with my cable and found that even the slightest movement or bump could result in a loss of transmission even with the female SDI mounts securely fastened to the fs5 and the recorder. Sounds simple but this would the first thing I would check as I highly doubt it is the FS5, Odyssey, or Gratical failing.
Click to expand...

I'd agree that the first thing to look at is your cables / connections. If you were recording when the 'moments of black' happened, did you lose signal to the odyssey? I've found that the recorders (Convergent / Atomos / etc.) are far less forgiving of minor signal irregularities than a standard monitor. Try changing out your cables for a start.
 
Hey Sleek,
I never had issues like that with the Odyssey, but then I've never used the video outs. I'm suspecting it may be a cable.
Thanks!
Sam
 
I'm going to venture a guess in agreement with Sam that it is the cable. I have had several experiences in recording from camera to Odyssey where I had to switch SDI cables. I have not had any issues with Odyssey video outputs. Or there is always the possibility that there is a problem with the output ports on the Odyssey.

A call to C-D would be in order. Their support is prompt and helpful.

Ned Soltz
 
I would like to hear more about the proximity sensor. The screen goes black, not blu as if there’s no signal.
 
sleekmedia said:
Honestly this will sound rudimentary but I own the FS5 with raw upgrade and use an Atomos Shogun Inferno all the time. I have had this exact same thing happen while running SDI to the Atomos. The screen goes black for a few seconds and then the transmission is right back. In the beginning of use I have had this happen a few times sometimes even while actively recording. I found this would happen when I was actively running around a lot shooting handheld. So I wasn't sure what was wrong so I checked the footage and I found that I had lost parts of the image and had many artifacts and other things so I cost it up to bumping / tugging on the SDI cable which accounted for the loss of transmission from the camera to the recorder during recording of those clips when the screen went black. Are you moving the SDI cable at all even slightly while filming? I later played with my cable and found that even the slightest movement or bump could result in a loss of transmission even with the female SDI mounts securely fastened to the fs5 and the recorder. Sounds simple but this would the first thing I would check as I highly doubt it is the FS5, Odyssey, or Gratical failing.
Click to expand...

I shoot with the FS5 with the RAW upgrade into the Shogun Inferno using in fact the Convergent Design SDI cable (the thin one). I have never, ever had any blackouts. I also used the same combo on the FS700R, with no blackouts. I shoot mainly in the field, so the camera/recorder experience plenty of movement.
 
Hey Folks,
I got this response on the facebook FS5 page:

"Hi Sam, Mandy from Zacuto- It sounds like the proximity sensor on the Gratical Eye. Have you tried adjusting the settings? email us at sales@zacuto.com for some troubleshooting help."

I'll be giving it a try tonight, along with a new cable for the Odyssey>Gratical connection.
 
SamEd said:
I would like to hear more about the proximity sensor. The screen goes black, not blu as if there’s no signal.
Click to expand...

Same problem with the sensor as Jason describes ..Grat Eye.. just goes black even with my face /eye right up against it.. I disabled the function in the menu.. yes shame that sensor is rubbish really.. also dont get correct battery info with iDX batteries.. but thats another issue.. try disabling the function and see.. but your recorder should ofcourse still be recording .. its only effecting the EVF..
 
Hey Folks,
Just to finish up the thread.

The link in the OP to the bundle at BH is a great deal. You get a gratical eye and a decent shoulder rig for less than the regular price of the Gratical Eye alone. And besides the issue of the proximity sensor, the image is incredible. It came down last week by about $700, and I don’t expect it will last.

I also want to thank everybody for their help and gentle suggestions. You guys are great. Thanks for sharing. I know I can be a bit of a image quality zealot, so thanks!
 
Doug Jensen said:
Sam, you just made a great case for why someone should buy an FS7 instead of an FS5. :-) You'd have a better camera with more sophisticated features, a simpler setup for shooting, and probably would have saved money in the long run when you add it all up. I know my comments do nothing to help you now, but I'm saying it anyway for the benefit if others reading the thread. It's always worth it for and owner/operator to get an FS7 over an FS5.
Click to expand...

This is not a joke. I have sold my FS700+Odyssey7Q but i still have tons of stuff lying around in my shelves that i had to buy to make that frankenrig work for me. In the end, the camera and setup was so large and fragile, that it hindered my work. When the FS7 came into my home, it felt like i had discovered jesus (no joke). It really lifted a burden off my shoulders (pun intended).

But i still have tons of junk lying around reminding me of that dumb camera purchase :P
 
SamEd said:
Hey Folks,
I got this response on the facebook FS5 page:

"Hi Sam, Mandy from Zacuto- It sounds like the proximity sensor on the Gratical Eye. Have you tried adjusting the settings? email us at sales@zacuto.com for some troubleshooting help."

I'll be giving it a try tonight, along with a new cable for the Odyssey>Gratical connection.
Click to expand...

Adjusting the settings..? AFAIK its either off or on..? basically its a more than decent OLED EVF for half the price as others.. but the sensor is a no starter.. might as well not have it there..I dont know if newer Eyes have an improved sensor..I bought it up with them ages ago.. didnt really get an concrete reply.. I guess they are not going to admit its rubbish..
 
Donny 123 said:
Adjusting the settings..? AFAIK its either off or on..? basically its a more than decent OLED EVF for half the price as others.. but the sensor is a no starter.. might as well not have it there..I dont know if newer Eyes have an improved sensor..I bought it up with them ages ago.. didnt really get an concrete reply.. I guess they are not going to admit its rubbish..
Click to expand...

I think mine is pretty recent and the sensor still doesn't work.
 
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