Woah...does this film suck...

Success is hard....

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Man, I wrote that second post at like 3am....that film had been burning a hole in me since mid-evening. Sorry about the spelling, and missing entire words when I asked about really wanting to know what anyone could like about TLITW...I was just surprised how bad it really was.

The thing of it is, I saw The Sixth Sense in the theatres, and I was impressed at the time. Here was a guy only a few years older than myself making films that were interesting and in some ways powerful...at least in how they got you at the end. People discussed things in it like we discuss No Country For Old Men on here. You have to admit, the film made quite a splash.

Unbreakable was pretty good. A bit dark, but so was the first film. It was neat how the theme was like the first edition of a comic, where the story of the hero is established. The twist was a bit far fetched, but still...not a bad film.

Then I stopped going to his films, because I got the feeling that all the whole experience would boil down to waiting for the twist...and that ruins the process. Friends usually said they were ok, but not really worth going to see...and the complaint about The Village was that it was a long build up to basically nothing. The twist wasn't as powerful as in the other films...probably due in part to you actually expecting it, and having high expectations.

Wasn't Sigourney Weaver in The Village? Didn't she say she had no clue what the film was about while they were making it? I know you want to keep twists hush-hush, but...

Signs just looked weird. Nothing about it's dark and sinister tone attracted me...and yes, you would figure intelligent alien life would have noticed the massive H2O deposits on this floating rock...and made a note of the potential danger. And from what I heard, a kid keeps leaving half-empty (or full..all depends on your outlook) glasses of water around the house, and they are used to defeat the aliens. How many friggin' glasses could a kid leave before someone cleaned up after him, or made the kid clean them up himself?

What were the other guys drining out of... their hands?

When I heard about TLITW, I just didn't get it. Giamatti looked uncomfortable discussing it on talk shows, the clips were an enigma, and the commercials told us nothing. Then when I heard it stunk, I understood it all. The dude made a mess, and now they were trying to salvage it through vague ads...

I heard they spent almost as much selling it as they did making it...the budget for production alone was around $70 million.

I also read somewhere (IMDB?) that M. insisted the location for filming be no further than 45 minutes from his house. What the hell...? I know he has a family now, and maybe he wanted to have time for his kids, but seriously...

I actually read that Spielberg had contacted M. Night (Mother Night?) about doing Indiana Jones 4....WTF?? Why? (I don't think he is a very good writer.)

Apparently his latest script had trouble selling...which is what Luis was probably talking about, but did finally get sold. I cringe at the thought of what it will bring about cinematically.

Either he continues with the egomaniacal self indulgement, or he goes back to his wait-for-the-twist ways...

Neither one sounds appealing right now.
 
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i think this is another simple case of M not making these movies for YOU.

I happen to really enjoy them, some more than others, and I've rewatched them many time.

For me the thing i love most about his writing is that, IMHO, he plays these fantastic notions very logically, from a normal guys perspective. I love Unbreakable BECAUSE it's so dark and full of doubt. It's a REALISTIC super heroes movie (ok, i don't want to argue about realism, but i think you know what im getting at). It's the only "realistic" super hero movie i can think of. SIGNS is like that also. when aliens land, they hole-up and watch TV.

And, just personally, I think the "twist" thing has suffered greatly from hype. Honestly, I don't see these things as "TWISTS", they're just logical conclusions to the story, and help give a really satisfying sense of closer to me.

Again, i'm just saying if you don't like the dude, don't watch his movies. I definitely feel he makes his movies "for me" so I hope he has a long career continuing to do what he does.
 
DeSica said:
I really would like what anyone found redeeming about the film...and a couple of nice shots doesn't really count.
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I co-wrote and edited the main doc on the dvd, 'Reflections of...' and the money i made largely paid for a feature we made last year, 'White Knuckles'. I'm doing the behind the scenes again (at his request) on his latest, 'The Happening' which will be his first R-rated feature.
 
Zak Forsman said:
I co-wrote and edited the main doc on the dvd, 'Reflections of...' and the money i made largely paid for a feature we made last year, 'White Knuckles'. I'm doing the behind the scenes again (at his request) on his latest, 'The Happening' which will be his first R-rated feature.
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Congratulations...finally something positive. At least someone is benefiting from his later stuff.

...did you enjoy TLITW?
 
DeSica said:
Congratulations...finally something positive. At least someone is benefiting from his later stuff.

...did you enjoy TLITW?
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I haven't seen it. The truth is, I was hired to tell the story of a close-knit crew making a film together. I enjoyed meeting everyone on the shoot. Night is (against rep) one of the nicest filmmakers out there -- always laughing, always hugging everyone. he really nurtures a family-like atmosphere on his sets. Christopher Doyle is a mad genius. I have footage of him that will never see the light of day. he has a drinking problem and it will rob us of his talents one day. The section on him (in my doc) was originally twice as long, it was a love letter to his ideas and philosophies on filmmaking -- WB made me cut it down.
 
Zak Forsman said:
Night is (against rep) one of the nicest filmmakers out there -- always laughing, always hugging everyone. he really nurtures a family-like atmosphere on his sets.
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I've never heard anything bad about him in terms of how he treats his cast or crew...

Christopher Doyle is a mad genius. I have footage of him that will never see the light of day. he has a drinking problem and it will rob us of his talents one day. The section on him (in my doc) was originally twice as long, it was a love letter to his ideas and philosophies on filmmaking -- WB made me cut it down.
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You might want to pursue that as a stand alone documentary or character study...I would.
 
DeSica said:
?

What part of this poorly written, non-sensical, ill conceived, make-it-up-as-you-go along excercise in muddled and meandering, at its best mediocre movie making did you find so compelling and well executed so as to make you love it? Seriously...

The fairy tale was pure crap. Fairy tales have a point. They illustrate things...and are made for kids. This thing was so convoluted, it made you not care. There was no mytsicism, no issue of faith...nothing. What was the moral? You could get arrested for child abuse telling that story to children...


An eastern fairy tale?...From where? What culture would dream up this third rate tale? Is an acid dropping Dennis Hopper their leader? (No offense, Mr. Hopper..I'm a fan.)

It took days to explain it fully, and more and more out of left field junk was thrown into it. None of the characters were really developed. Cleveland was likeable enough, and Story (there has to be some meaning here...did Shyamalan know he was making junk, and name her Story to represent the director's vision? Maybe the grass dog things were producers who had mauled it, poisoned it, and tried to drag it into the darkness...) was okay, but you never got the impression anything of great importance was on the line here.

The guy pumping iron with only one arm was just stupid. Not interesting, not compelling...not even around for most of the film...just silly.

The Korean girl was just there to reval the fairy tale...which she knew nothing about, so she had to ask her mom...over the course of days. It was like pulling teeth...and the whole mud thing? He held his breath a long friggin' time...

The whole party thing was a joke...300 people don't see a wet albino woman get dragged off by a 250 pound rabid patch of astro-turf? The film critic manages to get mauled to death in the one empty corridor while looking for a washroom? There are forests in Philly? It's America, but nobody in the apartment complex owns a gun? They intend to fend off a fierce creature with brooms?

The whole thing feels like whenever he had a hole in the script, he just made something up and went back and wrote the corresponding character in and then forgot them until he needed them again.

And what was with the cookbook/manifesto? Was that part of the plot even needed...apart from satisfying M. Night's ego? If the part was so important, why not ge a real actor to do it? The best person for the job...

The kid deciphers cereal boxes? WTF? Where is the correlation to the existing situation? At least give him some runes or something...

Even when they do figure it all out, there is no collective sigh of relief...because you couldn't give a rat's ass by this point.

The more I reflect upon this film, the more I hate it. I know many of his films are said to be unable to stand up to outside scrutiny, and fall apart upon repeated viewings, but this one didn't even last through the first reel. This is so scattered and thin that it can't even draw you in for more than a few minutes...there is nothing to anchor you there.

If I were Giamatti, I would have had myself digitally remved from the whole film...or tried to pull off what Cosby attempted when they released Leonard, Part 6.

I really would like what anyone found redeeming about the film...and a couple of nice shots doesn't really count.
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In brief... I was along for the ride... every step of the way...

:beer::Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)
 
Zak Forsman said:
I haven't seen it. The truth is, I was hired to tell the story of a close-knit crew making a film together. I enjoyed meeting everyone on the shoot. Night is (against rep) one of the nicest filmmakers out there -- always laughing, always hugging everyone. he really nurtures a family-like atmosphere on his sets. Christopher Doyle is a mad genius. I have footage of him that will never see the light of day. he has a drinking problem and it will rob us of his talents one day. The section on him (in my doc) was originally twice as long, it was a love letter to his ideas and philosophies on filmmaking -- WB made me cut it down.
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Hey ZaK, lucky you are to have the chance to hang around with Christopher Doyle. In The Mood for Love, Heroes, 2046 to only name a few are so nice piece of work. I know for is drinking problem, I hope to have a chance to see some other pieces of art from him before that habit take him and his talent away from us.
 
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It was genuinely, embarrassingly, loathsomely awful.

But yesterday I saw the remake of The Wicker Man, which by comparison made it look...well, still not good, but at least less awful.
 
Haven't seen LITW yet, but I accidently caught the first half hour of Delta Farce today.

Horrible.

Not that I was expecting greatness, but I was still shocked how bad it was.
 
Sad Max said:
It was genuinely, embarrassingly, loathsomely awful.

But yesterday I saw the remake of The Wicker Man, which by comparison made it look...well, still not good, but at least less awful.
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I saw that on HBO too.

I turned it off after 20 minutes, checked IMDb and I was right. It was about a 2.5/10.
 
Okay, I liked signs, the idea of the aliens being allergic to water was okay, what if the aliens never came across water? you guys just find any excuss to dog a movie. Signs was his best, it was more character driven then Six Sense and it had better writing. Lady was okay definetly his least good one. I dont us ethe word "worse" because I like his films.

M. is not a very visual director more story driven (to me anyways). Even though this script felt rushed, it's like he cared that people thought The Village was crap. He felt like he needed to put something else out there and it shows in the writing because the idea is great. But I'll tell you one thing, people are stupid. Just because the village had no real monster in it, they didnt like it. The movie was great; people loved it, got scared and felt attached to the characters; but once they found out the monsters werent real they hated it (they're morons the movie wasent supposed to be about monsters) and it's sad really because lady could have been so much more.

but I gotta give it to him with that last shot of the movie' where that giant teflon (the big eagle thing) takes story and it's shot from beneath the water in the pool. I tell you one thing I thought that was amazing and if none of you can appreciate that shot then you guys suck.

Anyone have pool enough to get Night in here and discuss this or is that not feasible? It would be awsom to see him defend himself.
 
pest22o said:
...what if the aliens never came across water?
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That's always been my take on it.
If they'd never been exposed to it - they don't know.
Either way, I was willing to roll with it, and I enjoyed the ride.

pest22o said:
M. is not a very visual director more story driven (to me anyways).
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Really?
Looking at ...well, pretty much all his movies, I've always had the opposite impression of him. I think his strength actually lies in his use of the camera.
Even 'The Village' (which I honestly thought was laughably bad) was a well visually constructed and shot movie. Then again, with Roger Deakins behind the camera, it had better look good.

Just because the village had no real monster in it, they didnt like it. The movie was great; people loved it, got scared and felt attached to the characters; but once they found out the monsters werent real they hated it (they're morons the movie wasent supposed to be about monsters) and it's sad really because lady could have been so much more.
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Just for the record - the lack of monsters had nothing to do with why I didn't like the Village.


...if none of you can appreciate that shot then you guys suck.
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See? He is a visual director after all.
:)

It would be awsom to see him defend himself.
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I seriously doubt he feels threatened.
Being one of the highest paid screenwriters and directors of all time is probably enough to give you some confidence in what you're doing.
 
pest22o said:
Okay, I liked signs, the idea of the aliens being allergic to water was okay, what if the aliens never came across water?
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Yeah, right. They posess hundreds, maybe thousands of years of engineering knowledge that has enabled them to traverse light years across the cosmos and they never came across water! Since hydrogen and oxygen are two of the most basic elements in the universe I find that HIGHLY unlikely. We know they are familiar with oxygen because THEY BREATHE IT. In fact, any species that breathes oxygen likely comes from an oxygen planet, which means it likely has water, which makes the whole concept of the aliens themselves even existing implausible. On top of that, hinging the whole climax on the fact that one of the characters has a habit of leaving glasses of half empty water lying around the house is lazy writing in the extreme. The film has some good moments and a decent set-up, but mostly seemed half-realized.
 
Batutta said:
On top of that, hinging the whole climax on the fact that one of the characters has a habit of leaving glasses of half empty water lying around the house is lazy writing in the extreme.
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i think you missed the point, it wasn't JUST the glasses, it was the glasses, the bat, his wife's words, the asthma. It's about coincidence, and more specifically, faith. there's a reason after all those random coincidences the last scene is of him putting his collar back on.

Again, I guess it's just not for everybody...
 
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