Why do you guys call this a 1080p model??

Feroxfilm

Feroxfilm

Member
Hi!
Says here in a post that this camera is a 1080p camera.

"However, I’m not sure what you mean by “best 24p setting” – 720p and 1080i are two very different things; 720p is progressive; 1080i is interlaced. There are two HD modes on the HVX; the 1080p (not 1080i) mode will be the “best” 24p setting."

In the latest brochure I found these informations –

"It can record in either 1080i or 720p

It allows 24p/30p progressive shooting in both 720p or 1080i

Shooting mode 1080/60i. 30p, 24p"

Why don`t it mention 1080p?

Somebody on a different forum said this:
"And also, some people can't say 1080 without saying the "i" on the back end."

hmmm...
 
I believe the camera shoots 720p at variable frame rates.

It also shoots 1080p, but this is carried in a 1080i video stream, just like how the DVX achieve 24p/25p & 30p in the 50i or 60i DV video stream.

It isn't the same as the Z1/fx1 Cineframe modes or Canon XL1/XM1 fame mode, as these reduce resolution. I believe the HVX will record a true 1080p signal. I think the confusion comes because DVCPRO HD can only encode at 720p or 1080i, therefore the 1080p signal has to be carried in the interlaced stream.
 
For the first time I fully understood this "p" and "i" issue. Thanx mmm.
You know, working with super 8 most of the time doesn`t help the understanding on interlaced video :)
 
I was also a little ham-handed when I wrote that passage above, and I left something critical out -- I should have said there were "two 24p HD modes." The camera will actually shoot three "HD modes" -- 720p, 1080p, and 1080i.
 
Feroxfilm said:
In the latest brochure I found these informations – ...
Why don`t it mention 1080p?
Click to expand...

This rumor is driving me crazy. I've tried to stamp it out on four different forums so far.

Look at the new brochure. Read page 12. It clearly says:
Shooting mode: 1080/60i, 30p, 24p.
720/60p, 30p, 24p
480/60i, 30p, 24p

Then look at this page:
http://catalog2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ModelDetail?displayTab=O&storeId=11201&catalogId=13051&itemId=93120&catGroupId=14569&modelNo=AG-HVX200&surfModel=AG-HVX200

The first line in the specs says, and I quote:
"1080/60i, 1080/24p, 1080/30p, 720/60p, 720/24p, 720/30p, 480/60i, 480/24p, 480/30p"

Please, spread the word, and let us never hear speak of this "no 1080p" rumor again! :thumbsup:
 
Shouldn't it also be stated [again] that the camera has true VariCam functionality in the 720 resolution? One to fifty frames methinks.

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I doesn't quite have that though. I think Jan has confirned it will only provide certain "stepped" frame rates.

Sorry the the uncertainy of my answers. I hate stating 2nd had info as fact.
 
If you look at the Panasonic webpage for the camera, it says "some variable frame rates". So it won't be full 4-to-60, but it'll be certain frame rates within that range.
 
It has changed somewhat from the first announcement on the camera. The first we heard it was going to be variable 4-to-60 ala the Varicam. Then it was stated that while it was going to be variable it was going to be at "stepped" intervals. As Barry states, Panasonic's official specs on the camera as of today states :

"Some variable frame rates in 720p mode"

We'll just have to wait and see what exactly that means...
 
Can anyone explain why they would not allow the same frame rates as a Varicam? DVCProHD supports it. The only real reason would be to limit how cool it is to supposedly lessen the impact on the Varicam right? This can't possibly be something that's too hard for them to include.

If they've gone so far as to include some framerates, then it can really only be a concious choice right?
 
Who knows? Could be a firmware limitation; could be lots of other factors.

Not sure why so many jump to the "they're crippling it on purpose" conclusion so immediately.
 
My question wasn't intended to be negative or bashing. It was a genuine question surrounded by assumptions of what I currently know of the camera. If this camera uses the same codec as a Varicam, and the codec is designed to support it, why would they, and this is strictly hypothetical since nothing official has been said, include only a small handful of the rates when it should be able to do them all? It's all circuits and firmware at work right? Not complex mechanical systems dictating this feature.

I ask because perhaps there's a complex engineering reason that I don't know of. If there really isn't then they would leave it out intentionally for marketing reasons. Isn't that a somewhat accurate assumption? Not bashing, loose logic.
 
The only thing I've heard is that each and every frame rate has to be tested, imported, used, exported, and verified under all conditions, so they know it's verified and usable and good. This is new technology -- the VariCam records to tape, but the HVX is using a brand new file system here -- the other P2 cam, the SPX, doesn't have variable frame rates. So it's a computer-programming thing they have to face. And the more frame rates there are, the testing regimen expands exponentially. And every time something in the firmware changes, they have to go through and re-verify.

So they may have limited the number of framerates to keep the camera's release date practical. Having been in the videogame industry, I can tell you that the quality-assurance cycle was absolutely monolithic -- when we delivered a new version of the game, the testing department had to start from scratch and re-test E V E R Y T H I N G. It was amazing how fixing one little bug over HERE would cause something to break over THERE -- but that's how it worked. That was the reality we faced.

So every variable frame rate they add is in essence a new "format" -- it hasn't been done before. They're stripping out duplicate frames and writing a file system for this new frame rate and then having to verify that it'll work in the FCP frame rate conversion tool or the Focus Info .MXF file converter or whatever else they have to do; it probably is a massive workload. I'm sure it's incredibly easier when you have a camera that shoots straight 60i... but this HVX has probably 30 to 50 different shooting modes! (three in 1080, 9 in 480, and then all the variable frame rates in 720)... I don't doubt that it's an awful lot of work. Adding in every possible frame rate would probably double or triple the workload, and the actual benefit to the end user wouldn't be all that much. Some benefit, yes. But I'm guessing we'll get 95% of the usable functionality, and it'll be half (or less) the workload for them, which means an earlier delivery date than they would be able to deliver if they did go through and offer and verify every possible framerate.
 
Barry,
one thing comes to my mind reading your lines above:
This isHVX v.1.0 or so. In computer world, there is always a higher version with more features.
As the whole framerate thinggy seems to be a computer programming task, wouldn't it be possible to configure the camera in such a way that a later firmware update is feasible? Such nobody would have to bother about "limited" framerates now but expect to come those missing now come months later.
Looking foward to your comment.
 
PKraft, I agree. Didn't they add 24p to the SPX800 after it's release in the form of a firmware upgrade? I thought I read that in here.
 
On SPX cameras firmware upgrade is possible (and easy). It's done using an SD card configured specifically. I expect the same procedure to apply to the HVX so if new features will be implemented on the same hardware version, you will be able to get them.
 
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