speedjunkie
Well-known member
I want to Know where to buy Modified Prop guns that fire the 45cal full muzzle flare rounds .Rifles and Guns and Also a good book on Cinematic Pyrotechs.
Thanks
Thanks
7D where to Buy or Rent Prop-guns
- Thread starter speedjunkie
- Start date
speedjunkie
Well-known member
I have tons of Airsoft stuff but I think the real deal looks and sound better
airsoft works fine for me as lnog as you dont care about blanks. On screeni really dont think you can tell the difference.
At a trip to the local flea market they had a TON of cheap (bootleg?) airsoft stuff. Nice glock handgun replicas for as cheap as $4
Ak and M4 reps were like $29, and shottys were around $20-24
i know where im going nextg time i need some stuff
At a trip to the local flea market they had a TON of cheap (bootleg?) airsoft stuff. Nice glock handgun replicas for as cheap as $4
Ak and M4 reps were like $29, and shottys were around $20-24
i know where im going nextg time i need some stuff
speedjunkie
Well-known member
I'm going for Full Realism and Feel with my project so I need Live Explosive Ordenance For Film and the feel of actualy firing a weapon even tho they are blanks.
J Davis
Veteran
Hey speedjunkie, just be careful with firing blanks. A blank can cause injury and sometime can even kill. You might already know this but others on your set might not. I'm sure youve heard of that actor who was killed by a blank firing weapon near his head. Its here LINK
I once did a 30 minute film (broken into 6 minute sections) and we used lots of guns, sniper rifles, revolvers, nina's, ak's and an uzi at one point. I have also done shorter pieces with real guns, real ammo. Its a sad fact but here in NYC its easier to get hold of real guns than it is to get hold of fake ones for props. Also I'm licensed and I shoot regularly. Make sure you know your rules for the state you live in.
If you are working with any actors who are even half decent then they can fake the recoil of a prop gun firing. No need to get realism and you can add the effects in post. The biggest advantage (other than safety) in using non firing realistic props is that you don't attract attention to yourselves. Having passers by, police etc arriving at your film shoot to see whats going on is a pain in the ass and wastes your time!
BTW if anyone near New York City needs prop guns, blank firing weapons, hand guns, vintage period guns, rocket launchers, m16's, grenades, ammo, clips, holsters, helmets, police badge, bullet proof vests, revolvers, wild west six shooters, sci fi future guns or anything like that for film I highly recommend
Center Firearms
10 W. 37th Street
New York, NY 10018
Tel. 212.244.4040
Fax. 212.947.123
They are good guys there and have helped me out a few times.
Last edited:
plasmasmp
Well-known member
modelguns work fairly well for this purpose.
This forum is the best source of info on modelguns, and usually you can find a few for sale along with caps.
http://mp40modelguns.forumotion.net/forum.htm
If you watch the end of this video below you can see the MGC Thompson and a Smith Wesson .44 magnum (made by another company I can't remember the name right now.) There is no muzzle flash on the thompson because the bore is plugged, but you can get flash caps, drill the bore and get a slight flash when firing. The .44 would have flash if flash caps were used, but you can see the smoke coming out of the bore.
The best part of using modelguns is that they are completely safe, unlike using blanks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZvntdHR9PA
This forum is the best source of info on modelguns, and usually you can find a few for sale along with caps.
http://mp40modelguns.forumotion.net/forum.htm
If you watch the end of this video below you can see the MGC Thompson and a Smith Wesson .44 magnum (made by another company I can't remember the name right now.) There is no muzzle flash on the thompson because the bore is plugged, but you can get flash caps, drill the bore and get a slight flash when firing. The .44 would have flash if flash caps were used, but you can see the smoke coming out of the bore.
The best part of using modelguns is that they are completely safe, unlike using blanks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZvntdHR9PA
speedjunkie
Well-known member
Oh Yea Safety 1st.. I Was a Stand in and Did Stunts as a Police Officer in the Upcoming Film Battle Los Angeles Feb 2011, and We used Real Firearms with Blank 45cal rounds made for Full Flash but the Barrels on the M16s(which were real) were reduced to increase back pressure so you could eject the casing, the Flash was Riduculous not typical for a real firearm, so I thought I would Use the Same Real effect in a Battle Sequence for a Film I am Writting. Im just Doing my Homework as to Aquiring these NON firearms for my film.
J Davis
Veteran
Cool. You are no noob and you know the drill then. Please understand I was just checking not lecturing as I would hate to see anyone get hurt.
BTW - another reason to consider post production sfx as a way to get muzzle flash is that you can control exactly the amount of flash you want. This also goes for shell casings being ejected and muzzle smoke. Often these are very very easy to comp into the footage as they are only in there for 2 or 3 frames.
I've even rotoscoped stuff like that with photoshop .psd files simply because it was faster to do that than start an AE project and render !!
J Davis
Veteran
Here's one I did with a real gun, real ammo and muzzle flash rotoscoped in with photosop .psd files onto a final cut pro timeline. LINK
I chose to go with real because I have complete trust in the actress and my assistant on the shoot is also very cautious and we were on private property,
plus there was no budget to rent a prop and this real one cost us nothing (as its mine).
I chose to go with real because I have complete trust in the actress and my assistant on the shoot is also very cautious and we were on private property,
plus there was no budget to rent a prop and this real one cost us nothing (as its mine).
Last edited:
speedjunkie
Well-known member
I thought I saw a Real MAG.. Good Work.. I sure Hope when the gun was pointed at the camera the bullets were out!
Perry Wilson
Well-known member
if you are going to use fake guns though that mean syou need fake sound effects... And nothing ruins a film for me than people not getting the sound timing right... please be sure to take into the account of bullet speeds, fall of due to gravity and also the speed of sound... and if you are shooting a shot of a person being sniped or somethig understand that the sound of the gun being fired is going to be the last thing the person being shot at hears... first is the bullet wizzing by...
Perry Wilson
Well-known member
please do your math... I cannot stress this enough it bothers me even in big budget films, even band of brothers gets it wrong sometime... kills me
J Davis
Veteran
Actually if you look carefully the bullets only appear in one shot which is the close up of her hands when she reloads and the muzzle points towards the floor. All other times the gun was empty and also had no mag in it. I'm super big on safety.
The main thing I wanted to show you was that in that vid the muzzle flash only goes for 2 frames. I actually used the same .psd at different scaled sizes and rotated a bit for variation.
To help make it realistic there is also a very faint color correction curve on her forearms that only lasts for those two frames. If you look carefully the skin color gets brighter to simulate reflected light from the flash.
Its a little trick that is very easy to implement and really helps.
speedjunkie
Well-known member
Im going to leave the Effects to someone else, but I see the Need to get the Sound right. I agree. If you see the Film Tears of the SUN with Bruce willis. In one scene the Seals are Hidding in tall grass and one of the seals get hit by a sniper in the trees, The shot shows the Bullet going through his Shoulder and blood coming out the back just as the sound plays out and echos . I thought This was So realistic.
speedjunkie
Well-known member
So My question is going to be more specific Where in CALI or TEXAS can you buy these Modified REAL, NON Guns that simulate the real thing. Does anyone Know? The ones im looking for specificaly are the ones with the reduced Barrel and fire FULL auto. M16s, M249, belt fed, and so On
J Davis
Veteran
Hey speedjunkie, why don't you give my contacts at Center Firearms a call and ask them. They might have connections on the west coast.
WhiteMonkey
Well-known member
I met a guy at the Houston Film Industry Meetup who is a stuntman and propmaster. He has a cache of weapons that fire blanks. Skim through the members list or come by the meetings to find him.
speedjunkie
Well-known member
whitemonkey,, I would love to go to the meetings, where and when..
roxics
Veteran
Wow I've never even heard of model guns. Thanks for the info. I checked out a few sites and some videos and they look perfect. Like a cross between an airsoft and a real blank firing gun. Seems to me like they would be perfect for indie film shoots since you get the smoke, slide action, slight muzzle flash to affect the sounding lighting of the environment (especially dark scenes) and the shell ejecting. You'd probably just want to add a heftier sound effect in post and maybe enhance the muzzle flash for dark scenes. But for daylight I wouldn't even bother.
I'm kinda of curious why anyone would even consider using airsoft guns if they know about these model guns. Is it the price that is a drawback or are there other things that make them problematic?
Where can you buy these in the US? What can you typically expect to pay for say a Beretta style model handgun that does all of this?