Welcome to my Nightmare

Barry_Green said:
Well, if by that you mean "America", no... if I'm not mistaken, they're Canadian. :)
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Hi Barry,
If my Geography is right, isn't Canada very close to America ?.

Even our own like "croc dundee" could not match Fred & Sharon's unique style.

This whole thread is a Crack-up.

Cheers & "Still Laughing downunder"
Tom K
olinevideo.com.au
 
Thanks for this Barry, I feel somewhat, ummm, "Comforted"

I was in a band once, in my mid 20's We were very very bad and had no right opertating instruments in a musical manner. We invited a buddy over to come hear us. After listening to several songs we asked him what he thought. (you really have to hear it first hand to get the full punch) but

He said, "Hey man! You guys don't suck THAT bad, at ALL!"

I tried to figure out for years how to turn that statement into something I could say to my girlfriends when they ask if they looked fat. It was the perfect "Its Pat" answer that leaves you both encouraged and totally deflated. I think it applies here.


BTW, I guess I started something with this thread, I hope folks remain kind to newB's. I really tried to help the one person who shot all that horrible footage. I simply think he has issues that go beyond our profession. Thankful one second for the advice, and would turn on me the next.

The edit came out "Acceptable" There was a posting on this thread several pages back. It is unfortunate but true. You can make ANYTHING acceptable for air these days. You just have to think outside the box. Many moons ago we took this approach with bad wedding footage. Some may remember the Old Panny AG450 camcorders, and what they would do when the lights were turned down in a reception.

We took the same approach with this. I will put it up on YT with the Clients permission and post a link here.

Dave
 
Tom 4 said:
As far as the words "you get what you pay for", I've heard some producers use this line to charge more and still supply a lesser than "Pro" product. I advise my clients to get samples / references prior to the shoot stage.
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Nothing turns my stomach more, than to hear someone say, "You get what you pay for" when things didn't go right after a production. In my entire career doing this, 85 percent of all problems and discrepancies result from one of the following:

Assumptions from both parties involved,
a lack of educating the client to your needs as they pertain to doing what it is they are hiring you to do,
good communications
and most importantly, good listening skills on your part.

If you have done your job communicating and spending time with the client in advance, then that horrible clich'e term should be re-phrased. You gave the CLIENT everything THEY paid for on a silver platter". You should be able to answer that with 100 percent confidence and the client should be eager to give you a reference, both personal and professional, without hesitation any time you want one. Period.

IMHO, Anything short of that is a Cop-out for lazy, greedy, people with enormous Egos and no compassion or respect for the people who pay them.

Most problems can be avoided with honest, straight forward listening and communicating. This is why I was not worried about taking this fix on. The spot is done, it is "Acceptable" and the client was absolutely thrilled with the end product. Was it worth the 500 dollars in keying headaches, processing nightmares, ETC ETC to correct it? That all depends on what you value. The 500 dollars for the job, or the possibility of the next 5 jobs.

As a result, I just picked up 3 more jobs today because I treated this client fairly and helped her. Those jobs came from referrals from her, not her directly. Future jobs from the client are now as guaranteed as they will get when she is ready to do more for her own biz.

My name IS on this sub-standard commercial, but not for the production value, it is for the service she was given. My bank only cares if the money is green, and in there legally, nothing more. Im not one to freak out when things dont look like they were done on a million dollar budget or even a thousand dollar budget. I'm concerned if the commercial will get the returns she needs, and be effective. That is what pays my bills today, and will continue to pay them tomorrow. I have other high end projects I can display to the public if I am concerned about having a high end production in my companies portfolio.



A little good will can go a long way. After all, content is king in everything. Movies, real life, and marriage.

This is just my opinion.

David
 
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Well, to complete this thread, here is the finished piece.

After I actually processed all the footage from HDV to DVCProHD, upconverted all the DVD footage, I was able to sit down and start editing. As far as keying is concerned, it isnt great, but came out MUCH better than anticipated. Thank god for Primatte Keyer Pro!

Even a bigger problem arose after I started into this, that was the simple fact that the person who shot this, was riding the zoom button and did much of it hand-held. In over an hour and 10 minutes of footage, there were no shots that lasted longer than 4 seconds without being adjusted, moved, dutch angle'd, auto iris'd, Auto Focus'ed ETC. It was insane. ADD of the right hand on Steroids!! So, there was a dancing shot that had to be reversed, forwarded and reversed to form a clip long enough, to be usable. Amazingly, all the shots here are all there was from front to back of each clip, there were no more usable frames per clip, that is where some creativity had to come in.

That proved to be the most difficult part of this. In all, I turned the piece in about 15 editing hours. Another 15 went into processing from Mac, to a PC quicklime, to DVCProHD. I don't currently have any macs so this was an experience in itself. My buddy did the transfers to a format Premiere could use. I re-coded those to DVCProHD for the color sampling retention and more importantly, processing speed.

There were some guidelines on this I had to stick to in the layout of this, it was not total free-form, including the VO and music selection had already been done. I used lots of Stock Digital juice stuff and a few tricks of my own to keep it moving. In all, IMHO, it turned out "OK" under the time frame and footage I had available to me. The client was thrilled to pieces and it is now running on local cable.

Im not going to leave this up on our you tube channel for long. I thought I might submit the link here for a short period of time, for a thread finale.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMw8cw8bAMc
 
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Great fixer upper Magic cat.
After seeing the finished product . You wonder why they needed green screen in the first place .
 
it's good, but it lacks the unadulterated panache that Fred and Sharon bring to the screen...

:)

seriously...nice save...
 
Magic Cat,

These are bizarre!

Here's a thought. How about turning this lemon into lemonade by doing some sort of effect on the film, and then in editing, with some skillfully placed photographs in a NLE timeline, if any exist, and some royalty free music.

Something using Photoshop CS4's video capabilities might do it.

I'd just look at this project at this point of how to just make something visually interesting with some sound, maybe titles.

Initiating your original intent doesn't seem feasible. But let your "client" know your intentions.

Just my thought.

Jonathan
 
Actually, had I have read the seven other pages of this thread what I wrote above would have been worded differently.

Nice job!

Jonathan
 
Really impressed with how you saved this commercial... I was feeling really bad for you when I started reading this thread the other day, but it looks like you came through for the client and ultimately took on a job many of us would never touch with a 30 foot pole!

Great work man!
 
Zeakio said:
Really impressed with how you saved this commercial... I was feeling really bad for you when I started reading this thread the other day, but it looks like you came through for the client and ultimately took on a job many of us would never touch with a 30 foot pole!

Great work man!
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Thanks Man. I appreciate that more than you know.

The one thing that I noticed throughout this thread is that very few would take on a job like this. But more importantly is, the reasons they wouldnt. They were afraid of blow-back in the end, not the actual work it would take to make something up that the client would accept. That is commendable that so many could see a do-able product through the smoke of challenges.

Therefore, the heart of the problem it seems, was really, a fear! A fear based on communications, or actually a lack thereof, with the client which would result in a catastrophic endeavor financially, as well as reputation damaging.

This most certainly would have been the case for me if I had not spent some time with my customer, being honest, empathizing with her crude experience and then lowering her expectations for a final product in pre-production, knowing full well I could probably exceed them in the end, making her happy, very happy. Worse case scenario would have been what she expected based on those conversations, a No Go and complete loss. Because I set her up to anticipate a worse case situation, which WAS likely, I also took all responsability off of myself and company. It was a win win for me, and the client.

I have been through this type of situation many times. 95% of the time the reaction from my peers at the onset, is the same. RUN!!! However, I almost always come out on top and gain a loyal client. (I wont pull the wool over your eyes, there have been a few cases where I did NOT come out smelling like a rose, but they are few and far between) Im sure there are others here that, have, and WILL do this for their customers too. Hat off to them!!


If you can convince the client you are really there for them, and will do everything possible for their best interests, any result, good or bad, will be a win-win situation for you and them. It is all about setting the expectations, remaining honest and fair to both yourself and the customer. However, I believe, you must be sincere in your intentions or it will end up as many here feared. An avoidable mess.

I Don't mean to preach, but, wanted to use myself as an example. to show that it CAN be done and you CAN recover a client that has gone astray without fears. Not to mention, you may just help change the opinion of someone who may have walked away from video production, permanently. Yes, it is true, she set herself up for this, but, in the end, feeling guilty or blametossing doesnt matter when one more dollar walks away from our industry unnecessarily. That is a win-win for all of us in the industry.

We try to keep on the forefront of our minds with every new project and customer. That, much of what a client remembers about a project or company, is the Experience, not the actual video or quality thereof. It is easy to get caught up in the rigors and stresses of production and start treating the person in front of the lens like a piece of meat or another object for artistic framing. We try very hard to step back from what we are doing all the time and consciously force ourselves to take a mental inventory of what we are doing and how we are acting. If we dont, I.m confident I will hear it from the customer eventually.

Pay it forward.

David Walker
 
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