Luis Caffesse
Admin
I'm.... speechless
Welcome to my Nightmare
- Thread starter MagicCat
- Start date
Gabriel Berube
Well-known member
Wow... Just... Wow...
Must be one hell of a customer you got if you're willing to tamper with that kind of footage! I wouldn't touch that stuff with a 10-foot pole...
Must be one hell of a customer you got if you're willing to tamper with that kind of footage! I wouldn't touch that stuff with a 10-foot pole...
capt chuck
Well-known member
Given what you've said so far:
- reshoot is out
- it's a good client who you would like to help if possible
- quantity over quality (as if quality at this point was even possible)
And the laws of physics
- the footage is unkeyable
I think that leaves you two options
- Do the best you can with edits and deliver against the original green background
- spend the rest of your youth manually rotoscoping
or the third option, no matter how good the client you cannot make gold from lead and this is lead. The client may initially blame you, but there is a limit to what you can do despite your desire to help..... RUN AWAY!
- reshoot is out
- it's a good client who you would like to help if possible
- quantity over quality (as if quality at this point was even possible)
And the laws of physics
- the footage is unkeyable
I think that leaves you two options
- Do the best you can with edits and deliver against the original green background
- spend the rest of your youth manually rotoscoping
or the third option, no matter how good the client you cannot make gold from lead and this is lead. The client may initially blame you, but there is a limit to what you can do despite your desire to help..... RUN AWAY!
John Caballero
Veteran
Oh, film school.... Thousands of hard earn dollars down the toilet, as usual. Good luck with that footage.
one thing, if you help the client in a mess, you might force him to make you the go to guy from now on no matter how much you charge.
the sad thing, i see worse footage on weekly bases.
it would cost less to re-shoot(it's not like it was live or a re-shoot cannot be arranged), and actually make something the school could be proud of.
you would have to go frame by frame to do it. I'm guessing you could intern and give credit to maybe 5 junior colorist(with photoshop experience) looking to make a color reel, dividing the work. it's a one day job, it's not a disaster by any means.
the sad thing, i see worse footage on weekly bases.
it would cost less to re-shoot(it's not like it was live or a re-shoot cannot be arranged), and actually make something the school could be proud of.
you would have to go frame by frame to do it. I'm guessing you could intern and give credit to maybe 5 junior colorist(with photoshop experience) looking to make a color reel, dividing the work. it's a one day job, it's not a disaster by any means.
If i were u I tell them to change their strategy. Tell them you can put some icons up and titles plus nice music and maybe some cheesy fireworks. Believe me I have worked with worse. When I explained it to them they understood and let me do what I wanted to do. The following year they hired me to shoot the whole damn thing and everything came out spectacular. To our eyes it would have looked so so but to theirs it looked like magic lol. Think of this as ur chance to shine and make biz. But never even try to key or mask out anybody it would take u forever and give u anxiety attacks lol. Also they will never appreciate it. They would think it is easy to do and that the filming crew did an awesome job.
Hulk Green Screen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnbkqLEiElI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnbkqLEiElI
WOW!! It seems this is almost a viral thread!! Thanks for all the suggestions here.
You know, in thirteen years of operation, I think I can go back to about 95% of my clients for a reference or testimonial. Both personal and professional. Im not mentioning this to boast in any way so pleeeeaase, dont read into that statement too deeply. I mention it because, taking on this job and others like it over the years, is how we have been able to achieve that status. I firmly believe that sometimes you just have to pay it forward.
In all seriousness: As long as the Client has been made fully aware of the outcome, and there are no surprises, we ususally have good luck pleasing them in the end. It takes a lot of talking and listening to accomplish that, but, I would NEVER take on something with the client expecting any miracles.
That being said, I picked through the footage and have found about a half dozen clips ranging in length from 1.5 to 3 seconds each. Some of these that I posted here were simply out of the question due to the talent wearing key-able clothing. It will come out like a low budget, disposable, short run local commercial. The client feels that is acceptable, so the trick will be managing the rims of the keyed talent, so it does not show so much. Thank GOD, these boneheads shot this in 1080. I can shrink many of the keyed elements into Pic-in-Pic style frames, load that with colorful-motion backgrounds, and i hope by the time someone watches it, they wont even know what just happened. This thing may only run 100 times over the course of a few weeks. It is also on a 24hr rotator so for all I know, the cable company will pile them up at 2am-7am in between re-runs of seinfeld.
The thing that angers me as a business owner is not just the sloppiness of this shoot, but the way the client was treated. These persons Yelled at them for everything from questioning their artistic abilities, to their turning the wrong way on the freeway after the shoot and ending up in NY instead of Cleveland. Im sickened by this stuff and it gives the industry a very very bad name. What these two did, IMHO, effects everyone of us who have to put dinner on our tables each night, or support other employees. I WILL do just about anything I can, to prevent that from happening, or prevent a client from walking away from TV advertising due to a rude experience. I have seen that happen a million times, and 90 percent of those times, it could have been corrected and the client could have been saved for me, or my peers in the industry.
IMHO, a few good deeds for a client, can and will come back to you 100fold. Maybe not tomorrow, but, it does come back. There are a million people that would walk away from something like this, I cannot blame them. On the other hand, this client will talk about what we did for her for many years to come. That makes me happy, currently the workload isnt compramising anything we have in-house and Im going to learn something new. Ohhh, Man, Im sure that is an understatement.
Red Giant Primate Keyer Pro in AE7 has been working well for me, this is sincerely putting that plug-in to the test. So far, Im pleased.
Get this: In the ongoing SAGA, you know these two told me it was the CLIENTS FAULT for this mess?! They blamed her for asking them to green screen something, and furthermore, let her pick up some plastic table clothes to use for the screen. I just about fell out of my chair!!! They also blamed her for dressing the girls in green, refused to compensate her for her losses, and the commercial they DID make from this was two weeks past airtime startup, aaaannnd, The client actually went to the trouble of making up a complete storyboard for the project. It was scripted and all laid out for them. The completely strayed from it. (I must admit, for a client with little experience in production, her storyboarding was not too shabby either!) When she questioned why they did not produce the spot she wanted, one of em told her straight up: "Your Idea sucked, mine was much better" They went off on her when she did not like the spot they made, I quote: "I cannot believe you dont like this, NObody has EVER been critical of my work before?!" I think that last statement speaks for itself.
There are so many things wrong with this, and on so many levels, it isnt funny. However, this is how many kids operate these days, there is Little or NO accountability. (Please, nobody take offence to that here, It is just that out of every 65 interns we see, about 5 have what it takes, and about half of those will be able to call us one day from the studios of the History Channel, NBC, CBS, or a good production facility in general, ETC telling us of how they succeeded. It is a numerical fact, not an opinion) IMHO, some of this can also be blamed on the schools for not preparing these kids properly.
This isnt the first time Ive seen this and Im sure it wont be the last.
David
You know, in thirteen years of operation, I think I can go back to about 95% of my clients for a reference or testimonial. Both personal and professional. Im not mentioning this to boast in any way so pleeeeaase, dont read into that statement too deeply. I mention it because, taking on this job and others like it over the years, is how we have been able to achieve that status. I firmly believe that sometimes you just have to pay it forward.
In all seriousness: As long as the Client has been made fully aware of the outcome, and there are no surprises, we ususally have good luck pleasing them in the end. It takes a lot of talking and listening to accomplish that, but, I would NEVER take on something with the client expecting any miracles.
That being said, I picked through the footage and have found about a half dozen clips ranging in length from 1.5 to 3 seconds each. Some of these that I posted here were simply out of the question due to the talent wearing key-able clothing. It will come out like a low budget, disposable, short run local commercial. The client feels that is acceptable, so the trick will be managing the rims of the keyed talent, so it does not show so much. Thank GOD, these boneheads shot this in 1080. I can shrink many of the keyed elements into Pic-in-Pic style frames, load that with colorful-motion backgrounds, and i hope by the time someone watches it, they wont even know what just happened. This thing may only run 100 times over the course of a few weeks. It is also on a 24hr rotator so for all I know, the cable company will pile them up at 2am-7am in between re-runs of seinfeld.
The thing that angers me as a business owner is not just the sloppiness of this shoot, but the way the client was treated. These persons Yelled at them for everything from questioning their artistic abilities, to their turning the wrong way on the freeway after the shoot and ending up in NY instead of Cleveland. Im sickened by this stuff and it gives the industry a very very bad name. What these two did, IMHO, effects everyone of us who have to put dinner on our tables each night, or support other employees. I WILL do just about anything I can, to prevent that from happening, or prevent a client from walking away from TV advertising due to a rude experience. I have seen that happen a million times, and 90 percent of those times, it could have been corrected and the client could have been saved for me, or my peers in the industry.
IMHO, a few good deeds for a client, can and will come back to you 100fold. Maybe not tomorrow, but, it does come back. There are a million people that would walk away from something like this, I cannot blame them. On the other hand, this client will talk about what we did for her for many years to come. That makes me happy, currently the workload isnt compramising anything we have in-house and Im going to learn something new. Ohhh, Man, Im sure that is an understatement.
Red Giant Primate Keyer Pro in AE7 has been working well for me, this is sincerely putting that plug-in to the test. So far, Im pleased.
Get this: In the ongoing SAGA, you know these two told me it was the CLIENTS FAULT for this mess?! They blamed her for asking them to green screen something, and furthermore, let her pick up some plastic table clothes to use for the screen. I just about fell out of my chair!!! They also blamed her for dressing the girls in green, refused to compensate her for her losses, and the commercial they DID make from this was two weeks past airtime startup, aaaannnd, The client actually went to the trouble of making up a complete storyboard for the project. It was scripted and all laid out for them. The completely strayed from it. (I must admit, for a client with little experience in production, her storyboarding was not too shabby either!) When she questioned why they did not produce the spot she wanted, one of em told her straight up: "Your Idea sucked, mine was much better" They went off on her when she did not like the spot they made, I quote: "I cannot believe you dont like this, NObody has EVER been critical of my work before?!" I think that last statement speaks for itself.
There are so many things wrong with this, and on so many levels, it isnt funny. However, this is how many kids operate these days, there is Little or NO accountability. (Please, nobody take offence to that here, It is just that out of every 65 interns we see, about 5 have what it takes, and about half of those will be able to call us one day from the studios of the History Channel, NBC, CBS, or a good production facility in general, ETC telling us of how they succeeded. It is a numerical fact, not an opinion) IMHO, some of this can also be blamed on the schools for not preparing these kids properly.
This isnt the first time Ive seen this and Im sure it wont be the last.
David
Last edited:
your talking from the client perspective, reality might be different.
the client was trying to do something as cheap as possible, so to an extent you might imagine the client painting a really small picture to the two guys to be able to set a very low price then trying to screw them over with something they did not agree upon. if you don't set an hour or day rate, this will happen. you have been warned. and they were trying to do something cheaper then you would offer them, no matter what that would be.
changing the agreement(whatever that may be - something as simple as asking for a green-screen after they arrived on set, or showing the costumes after getting the green-screen, the client telling them about the storyboard on the shoot day, not abiding to any additional costs(if that happened in that manner and they chose to continue with the shoot and said "f%$# it, will do it")), they are desperate but you can't blame them either, if the client doesn't care, why should the crew.
trying to screw people is a dangerous business, it can back fire.
the client was trying to do something as cheap as possible, so to an extent you might imagine the client painting a really small picture to the two guys to be able to set a very low price then trying to screw them over with something they did not agree upon. if you don't set an hour or day rate, this will happen. you have been warned. and they were trying to do something cheaper then you would offer them, no matter what that would be.
changing the agreement(whatever that may be - something as simple as asking for a green-screen after they arrived on set, or showing the costumes after getting the green-screen, the client telling them about the storyboard on the shoot day, not abiding to any additional costs(if that happened in that manner and they chose to continue with the shoot and said "f%$# it, will do it")), they are desperate but you can't blame them either, if the client doesn't care, why should the crew.
trying to screw people is a dangerous business, it can back fire.
In the past, I have recieved "unusable" footage. In todays world of video, anything goes! Think out of the box... why can't you use this footage? Being in the industry for nearly 20 years now (has it been that long...whew getting old), I often got frustrated with people in the business saying you can't do this or that... why not? We are creative professionals and times have changed. Of course this maybe wouldn't work for a natioinal McDonalds commercial, where they would want a perfect key, but I would attempt it. It may enter into the surreal category, but if NO other options are at hand, you take what you have and make it work. I know this isn't the "professional" rule, but it would get the job done. I say throw in the distort plugin, and heck...any ole key at this point (luma, chroma) and have some 60's psychedelic fun! Tell them it's "Art" 
sigepwriter
Member
Lol wow those two make people who graduated from film school look bad... mutlicolored green screen... green costumes/pom poms, full body shots in carpeted area...
Oh well, I like the idea someone had about making it look like a behind the scenes video, and hamming it up... better than nothing.
Oh well, I like the idea someone had about making it look like a behind the scenes video, and hamming it up... better than nothing.
I would take the footage and turn it into something cheesy. I wouldn't try to key out anything - it's going to be even more embarrassing. So go with the bad and turn it into something great. Perhaps add a main character who created "the footage of the century" and turn it into a comedic thing. Funny sells. Crap doesn't. This is what I would do.
Nick Walters
Mentholated Member
This is just priceless.....as to the crew perhaps being forced into this?? I doubt it. I see usable materials in some of these shots. The crew could have ditched the green pom-poms and only used the blue ones....the green shirts under the purple outfits could have been covered in some way...the green outfits could have been just altogether ditched...perhaps trading out to those purple outfits....if nothing else the green outfits could have been used without a green screen....I see and find interesting spots to film constantly, and there's no reason these guys couldn't have.
This was just done in all the wrong ways.
Ditching the storyboard?!! This just isn't what one does. I could care less who you are...you decide major changes before you shoot, and get new storyboards completed...once you're on set the client should know and understand what is going to come out the other end.....I'm not saying a little experimentation and a little deviation isn't possible, cause hell I strive for those moments when amazing ideas, angles, and perspectives come about....but you gotta have a plan and stick to it. Hell I am constantly looking at the storyboards, cause to be quite honest I get into an odd mindset while filming and need that constant refresher of what comes next.
This was just done in all the wrong ways.
Ditching the storyboard?!! This just isn't what one does. I could care less who you are...you decide major changes before you shoot, and get new storyboards completed...once you're on set the client should know and understand what is going to come out the other end.....I'm not saying a little experimentation and a little deviation isn't possible, cause hell I strive for those moments when amazing ideas, angles, and perspectives come about....but you gotta have a plan and stick to it. Hell I am constantly looking at the storyboards, cause to be quite honest I get into an odd mindset while filming and need that constant refresher of what comes next.
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
Steve Laramie
Veteran
that job would make me physically sick.