FS7: URSA or FS7? Give me pros and cons, I am planning on purchasing either on in 2 weeks

JoeJITSU

JoeJITSU

Veteran
Please help me out in picking.

I was starting to watch some footage of the URSA with 80fps and 4k but what really struck me was the URSA Sensor could be upgraded in the future, So the URSA is future proof.
 
Depends on what you are shooting. I had an opportunity to test an FS7 with a BMPCC and S-log3 held up really well against the BMPCC. More dynamic range and less noise. Really surprised with the results as I was thinking 12 bits was going to blow away 10 bits internal XVAC-I. Also something to take into consideration is that it will take a little more to grade S-log3 than BM material.
 
goodgoings said:
Depends on what you are shooting. I had an opportunity to test an FS7 with a BMPCC and S-log3 held up really well against the BMPCC. More dynamic range and less noise. Really surprised with the results as I was thinking 12 bits was going to blow away 10 bits internal XVAC-I. Also something to take into consideration is that it will take a little more to grade S-log3 than BM material.
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SO the Dynamic Range is better on the FS7? I just seen a review where a guy says that comparing it to the RED Line, That the URSA has better dynamic range.
 
Being that today is April 5th, I would think this is not something you want to talk about until after NAB because it is highly likely that there will be announcements of things that will affect both the FS7 and the URSA - rendering today's discussion ..... "obsolete".
 
JoeJITSU said:
I just seen a review where a guy says that comparing it to the RED Line, That the URSA has better dynamic range.
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Nonsense. The blackmagic has 12 stops of DR. It doesn't come anywhere close to either the RED Dragon (the current model) or the FS7, both of which have at least 14 stops and depending on the RED model, even more.
In terms of your choices, do you really want to carry around a huge, heavy, totally unergonomic piece of kit or a light, built for the shoulder unit, that has clearly garnered the interest of both Canon and RED users for it's portability and 4k level of quality?

Also, it takes no more effort to grade SLOG than Raw. They both need to have their contrast leveled out, before grading. All it takes is looking at your blacks and whites on a scope, leveling them out, and then adjusting midtones to your liking after that. LUT's are not a necessity, just a shortcut.
 
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These are two different cameras for different applications. It seems a non-sequitor that you're even asking which one. The answer lies with what kind of images you plan on shooting. The URSA is a beast, heavy, cumbersome and technologically dated. If you like this sensor, the BMDCC is more in line with the FS7.
 
Like DPStewart said, NAB is coming up... of course the unfortunate thing is that BlackMagic will likely announce some new camera for summer release and miss delivery dates until fall/winter finally come around. So you'll get a new camera announcement that makes the URSA out-dated but you won't be able to get the camera for a while.

I'm sort of hoping after two years of BlackMagic's over-promising, they'll hit this year with "New camera, available NOW"... but I'm not holding my breath.
 
Who knows what will be introduced at NAB, but the FS7 is here now. I've been working with it for a few months, preparing to shoot a direct to DVD/ limited theater release feature, starting this Friday. Last month I shot a dramatic short for a church to project during an Easter presentation and was very pleased by how well the resolution stood up when projected on a rented $18,000 projector. And that was at 1080P.

last days screen.jpg
 
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Extremely different.

FS7 is for single operator use, better DR, low light, NDs.

Ursa is for larger crews and has a global shutter, better internal codecs and SO MANY SCREENS.

I personally like the FS7 a lot more.
 
Can the Ursa be used handheld ?

...I picked one up at a product demo with just the body and a V-mount battery mounted on the back, and it felts like I was lifting a boat-anchor. I can't imagine using the Ursa shoulder mounted or on a gimbal.
 
TheDingo said:
Can the Ursa be used handheld ?

...I picked one up at a product demo with just the body and a V-mount battery mounted on the back, and it felts like I was lifting a boat-anchor. I can't imagine using the Ursa shoulder mounted or on a gimbal.
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I'm surprised you were able to pick the thing up! The body alone is over 16lbs. Certainly won't go on any gimbal I've seen. My FS7 + extension unit, v-mount battery, lens, matte box, VCT baseplate, Gratical HD EVF, and 7Q monitor (for an AC on the side) clocks in around 20lbs I believe. And that's fully loaded! I can strip the thing down to probably around 8 lbs (body+lens) if I want.
 
Curious Josh, do you know the weight of the Gratical on it's own?

And yes 18 pounds on a gimbal. There are larger gimbals around but try and hold 18 to 25 pounds directly in front of you with out stretched arms. Even on a Steadicam 20 pounds is a lot unless you have been doing it for a while.
 
JoeJITSU said:
I was starting to watch some footage of the URSA with 80fps and 4k but what really struck me was the URSA Sensor could be upgraded in the future, So the URSA is future proof.
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It's only "future-proof" if the following happen:

1) BMD actually offers a new sensor
2) It's a sensor you want
3) It's a sensor you can afford

And that only applies to the sensor. Not the processor or other hardware components.

And sure, all 3 might happen. Or might not. Either way, best advice is to be sure you'll be happy with whatever comes in the box when it arrives and not hope that one day an upgrade will satisfy your current needs.

And I wouldn't buy either one a week before NAB, unless you absolutely HAVE to - ie, that you have a project you MUST start work on in the next 14 days.
 
I would strongly recommend taking an evening and reading through the URSA threads on the BMD forums. Realworld experience from real users. It changed my mind in just two hours.
 
Hey man that "Phillip Bloom..." thing on your signature is really not something you want to advertise. It's like saying you are a "certified writer" because you spent 10 hours listening to a guy lecture you about how he wrote a couple of Lifetime "movies of the week". Maybe you meant it as a joke but it doesn't read that way. ;)
 
I don't know who and why BM cam up with the odd shapes and functions of their cinema cameras but it's the wrong way to go. On the opposite side is the FS7 which built upon proven features and designs.
 
You know as an FS7 owner I think the URSA is not a total joke.

4k 80 (vs 60P FS7)

On sticks it is pretty tidy.

On the shoulder just add some handles and an EVF.. it even has rod mounts built in.

The kit out cost is significantly lower.

It is IMO shoulderable in a planned shot manner.

The big downer.. no way you can shoulder it all day covering an event.

Basically I would not use it without having an assistant to carry it (and manage my NDs)

S
 
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