Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

disjecta

disjecta

Lucky Duck
I'm just curious if uprezzing letterbox-originated DVX footage to HD or HDV will look any better on an HD display. Particularly with Adobe's announcement that they will be providing a free plug-in to Premiere Pro 1.5 that will allow native HDV editing.

The SD DVX footage looks pretty good on my HD display and it's really the TV itself that is doing all the work to make it look good....
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

disjecta. I don't know how good the DVX would look but premiere 1.5 can edit HD footage natively I believe.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

Ah yes the Cineform plugin. Darn, sorry, my bad :-X
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

If I had a HD TV I could run the test with FCP HD, but unfortunately...

(I think it really should look better, even if not as good as native HD, afterall, I really doubt your TV do as much as a bicubic uprezz in real time, imagine a s-spline. )

The thing is, S-spline looks a lot better than bicubic, wich looks a lot better than plain resizing. If it works on my computer monitor, why wouldn't it work on a HD TV set, right?

--EDIT-- On the other hand, we might not know how S-spline handles over time, so maybe it is a great still resampler, but it could be dancing grain all over it when it's a still sequence.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

I am the perpetual self-promoter, I know... but I put examples of DVX up-rezzed to HD on the new DVD. Since a DVD is standard-def, there's no way to show the full frame in all its glory, so I extracted a standard-def patch and show that full-frame. You won't see the full 1280x720 frame, but you'll see a high-def-resolution subsection of it, 720x480 that's resized to full high-def.

It does get a bit grainy, but I was floored at how well it held up compared to the actual high-def footage I was comparing it to.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

"DMN Interview: Adobe's Townhill Talks HDV and Premiere Pro
Wavelet compression for HDV editing to be offered free to Premiere Pro 1.5 users


Adobe Premiere Group Product Manager Richard Townhill again talks with DMN's Charlie White, this time in a conversation about the new HDV format and Adobe's plans to support it within Premiere Pro 1.5. Just before this mid-October 2004 interview, Sony had unveiled its new $3700 3-chip 1080i HDV camcorder, and Adobe announced its upcoming support for the new HDV 1080i format, showing its wavelet-based compression technology that it will offer free to Premiere Pro 1.5 users. Also in this wide-ranging discussion, Townhill talks about differences between Premiere Pro 1.5 and Final Cut Pro, and Adobe's ongoing relationship with Canopus"
 
PinnRe: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

PinnRe: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

Pinnacles new upgrade 6.0, will do HD. However, it won't do 24P. I will be ordering mine before Christmas, I'll have to supe up my computer though to run it.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

Barry-
You mentioned something I've always been curious about. If we are forces to stay standard def because of the whole NTSC/DVD standard bit can you TRUELY see a difference if you up rez DVX footage to HD and then after that have to down rez it to fit it on DVD? If so do you personally feel its a big enough difference to deal with the long rendering times and batch limitations of s-spline? I saw your examples you posted already but thoughs are highly compressed web examples. What I want to know is what YOUR eyes tell you when you watch it on DVD on a HD TV and a standard def TV. Thanks!
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

Up-rezzing and down-rezzing leaves you right back where you started. Better to just shoot native standard-def and distribute that.

Don't have an HDTV, but I've watched my up-rezzed footage on the computer monitor at high-def resolution, and the HDVX100 is very competitive with the JVC HD1. Don't know how it would hold up against a better camera like the FX1, 'cause there are no FX1's to test against yet. But I'd say the HDVX100 matched the HD1 very closely for overall resolution, but blew it away for color saturation, color rendition, latitude, motion rendition and overall picture quality. The HDVX100 looked like Super16, and the HD1 looked like very sharp "plastic" images.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

So just for the hell of it, I uprezzed a 16:9 frame from the DVX to 1920x1280 and brought it into a HD project in Vegas 5. When I put it on the timeline it is smaller than the available frame in the monitor window. Even though the project and the file are both 1920x1280....what's up with that? I'm not very familiar with Vegas so maybe I'm not doing something obvious?
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

[quote author=Barry_Green link=board=Events;num=1098229373;start=0#10 date=10/20/04 at 09:42:18]...the HDVX100 is very competitive with the JVC HD1.  Don't know how it would hold up against a better camera like the FX1, 'cause there are no FX1's to test against yet.  But I'd say the HDVX100 matched the HD1 very closely for overall resolution, but blew it away for color saturation, color rendition, latitude, motion rendition and overall picture quality.  The HDVX100 looked like Super16, and the HD1 looked like very sharp "plastic" images.[/quote]

Barry, when you say HDVX100, do you mean up-rezzed DVX100 footage?
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

I believe Barry jokingly refers to DVX-uprezzed footage as HDVX
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

Fine with me ;), just wanted to make sure I understood it correctly. It appears I did.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

So it sounds like this up rez process is of no practical use for now because were all limited to the DVD/NTSC standard. So that means the only way to watch up rez footage from the DVX is on a computer. Not too practical. The only compromise I can think of is something they did for the Special Edition of Terminator 2. They put two versions of the movie on the DVD. One version was the standard def MPEG2 so it could be played in any stand alone DVD player. The other one was in HD and was recorded in windows media player 9 format. Of coarse nearly no DVD player can read this format so you were once again forced to pop it in a computer to watch it in HD. So we wait....when blue ray DVD's come out and are common place then we can uprez our work...but then again by that time we will be shooting with true HD cameras anyways. So it appears the only point of using s-spline on video footage is if you need to uprez a portion of the screen, spit it out to HD tape for film festivals or if your actually doing a film out....Seriously how many people TRUELY do that?
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

Not many...I'm just playing around for the hell of it right now.

Uprezzing letterbox footage to 16x9 anamorphic is useful to me so I'm using Photozoom for that.
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

..ditto what disjecta said, but also , just running your footage through it, and keeping it at the same res will really sharpen up the footage nicer than a NLE sharpen filter. it works great for digital projection at local theatres...
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

And yes, for clarification, what I meant by "HDVX100" was a high-def up-rez from the regular DVX100. It looks about as legitimate high-def as the JVC HD1, so DVX100+PhotoZoom Pro = HDVX100! :)
 
Re: Uprezzing to HD - does it look any better?

So there is a new camera??!!?? You heard it here first, straight from Barry Green. ;D ::)
 
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