Ticking noise during recording?

F

fajonze

Member
So I recently added a SD 302 in front of my Tascam HDP2 connected via rcas. I got to finally test it out over the weekend on a shoot and I noticed a ticking noise, like a clock, during takes while I was recording. You can't hear it during playback and it doesn't seem to be on the actual mix. I've been using my Tascam for a couple years now, my first time running into this, anyone clues?

To add more info, I was using the oktava mk12 mic.
 
Where is your headphone plugged? Into the mixer or into the recorder? I would strongly encourage you to connect the mixer to the recorder via balanced XLR to reduce the tendancy to pick up stray EMI. Is there anything else in the bag. Often times an unrelated piece of electronics will induce noise. This is especially true to cell/smart phones, even when switched to silent, placed close to a microphone, mixer, or recorder.
 
well i run a 1/8 connector cable from the mixers monitor return to my recorders headphone input and my headphones are plugged into the mixer. I listen to whats being sent to my recorder rather than the mixer itself. Robert at Coffey Sound recommended the female xlr to rcas to connect my mixer and recorder so i went ahead and took his suggestion.

as far as electronics, I make sure i don't have any electronics near my bag, i can usually tell when i hear the interference from the mic. so i'm not sure what it is, this is the first time.
 
So, on your mixer do you have a switch where you can monitor either what's being fed out of the mixer, or what's being returned from the recorder? Can you isolate the click this way?

What happens when you disconnect the XLRs, does the clicking go away? I mean, it's coming from somewhere. Unplug the inputs to the mixer, set the mixer for mixer monitoring and see if it goes away. If not, it's in the mixer.

But your comment about Coffey really confuses me. Unbalancing the signal seems to me would make it far more prone to interference. Can anyone explain why going from XLR to RCA would be a better approach than XLR to XLR?
 
Does the Tascam even have line level XLR ins? I'm assuming not and that is why the XLR to RCA. For a run that short it really doesn't make much difference. Unbalanced line at a foot or so is not likely to pick up RFI unless your in a very intense field.

You may be having an issue because your feeding the return off the headphone out. Assuming the 302 is like the MixPre, it wants a line level return. So that would be my #1 pick for the problem.
 
The manual shows the XLR inputs as mic/line (which is how my 680 is configured) with a switch on top determining the level (page 9). However, in the specs at the back of the manual it only lists the RCA as the line inputs so could be that Coffey went to the back of the manual for the specs. Man, I am not a fan of any non-locking connectors between my mixer and recorder, but I do see your point that short runs are less prone to induced noise.

If it is a headphone level issue, the Tascam has RCA line outs as well.


Noiz2 said:
Does the Tascam even have line level XLR ins? I'm assuming not and that is why the XLR to RCA. For a run that short it really doesn't make much difference. Unbalanced line at a foot or so is not likely to pick up RFI unless your in a very intense field.

You may be having an issue because your feeding the return off the headphone out. Assuming the 302 is like the MixPre, it wants a line level return. So that would be my #1 pick for the problem.
Click to expand...
 
Noiz2 said:
Does the Tascam even have line level XLR ins?
Click to expand...

As gpforet mentioned, the XLR connections are labeled as MIC/LINE, but the specs say otherwise. This is the one thing that bugs me the most about the HD-P2. I've used the machine several times, and aside from that it's a pretty solid recorder.

A friend of mine blew the input circuits out feeding line-level to the XLR inputs on her machine, and the TASCAM service tech who did the repair was very firm about not using line-level in on the XLRs. The labeling is, in my opinion, irresponsible. It's left over from the predecessor to the HD-P2, the DA-P1 DAT recorder. I had one of those, and the XLR ins were truly mic/line switchable. It was a great little machine. I guess when they updated the unit to the HD-P2, they forgot to change the silk screen for the labels...
 
A ticking noise is probably not EMI. Zoom in on you tick in your NLE and see what it looks like. If you have a hole, or a spike one or two samples wide, you have a clocking issue.
If the tick is an actual sound, and you are multitracking, look on the source material. First thing is to find out if you recording something clicking, or whether you are generating a type of noise.
Ultimately, you can declick the final product, but if it isn't on the source material you can fix it at mixdown.
 
Now this is scary considering I'm running my iso's line level into my DR-680 from the Alphamix. The signal is nice and clean. I did have problems using the XLR inputs on my DR-100 as line inputs from the alphamix and ended up using the 1/8" stereo line in from the 1/8" transciptions outs of the the PSC. But so far the DR-680's XLR inputs have been behaving just fine getting line level. Man, what's up with tascam?

C2V said:
A friend of mine blew the input circuits out feeding line-level to the XLR inputs on her machine, and the TASCAM service tech who did the repair was very firm about not using line-level in on the XLRs. The labeling is, in my opinion, irresponsible. It's left over from the predecessor to the HD-P2, the DA-P1 DAT recorder. I had one of those, and the XLR ins were truly mic/line switchable. It was a great little machine. I guess when they updated the unit to the HD-P2, they forgot to change the silk screen for the labels...
Click to expand...
 
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Are you running timcode? If so, what's the master? Usually a clicking sound like this is a sync issue, and nothing to do with cable-age or audio inputs.
 
I've got a similar setup (442 to HD-P2). I take the tape out of the mixer into the RCA of the recorder. Then take the RCA out of the recorder back into the return of the mixer, and I've never had a problem doing that. By going this way you can turn on the speakers without having to unplug anything (useful to listening without headphones on and playing back stuff for other people).

I'd check your cable going out of the tascam, then check the input of your mixer. If it's not on your recording then the noise is happening after the recorder (check there first). Also, try recording in a different location.

As for the unbalanced cable, mine are 8" long (RCA to TA3) and I've never had a problem. It's a great recorder IMO, and has never let me down.
 
DrDave said:
A ticking noise is probably not EMI. Zoom in on you tick in your NLE and see what it looks like. If you have a hole, or a spike one or two samples wide, you have a clocking issue.
Click to expand...

That was the first thing I thought of but he's not going digital to digital so clocking shouldn't be an issue.
 
davefisk said:
Are you running timcode? If so, what's the master? Usually a clicking sound like this is a sync issue, and nothing to do with cable-age or audio inputs.
Click to expand...

True about sync, but that would be mismatched word clocks not TC. TC isn't used for "sync" with a digital recorder it's just used as a positional reference.

But to the OP. Dave brings up a point. If this is printing to tape (you implied not) then a sample would go a long way in identifying the issue.

Part of my headphone suggestion was because he said he wasn't getting it recorded, just in the headphones. Some folks might hear clipping and describe it as "clicking", I've had that happen before. If it's not getting recorded then it has to be after the recorder, which pretty much leaves the monitor return.
 
It is also posible that it's a bad connection. If that is the case then moving cables will change the problem. If moving cables around doesn't cause or "fix" the problem then it's probably not a cable or connector.
 
Wow thanks for the replies guys, I appreciate the help.

Yeah the mixer has a switch that lets you solo whats being sent to recorder, mixer itself, etc.
Not running TC at all. I tried unplugging and checking out the connections but it still seems to be there, i'll try and listen to the mixer only.
I'll take a look at the live level return, all of the suggestions you guys gave me, and come back to you guys with results.

@VGER- What do you think of the rca-ta3 set up, bag friendly? The set up I have with the female-rca becomes real tight working out of the bag, blah!
 
If it's not making it to the recording, then hmmmm.

Usually I've seen when people are running TC, they'll get a clicking sound sound if the recorder is at one frame rate, and the incoming timecode is at a different frame rate.

But now I'm puzzled. If I were troubleshooting this, the first thing I would do is swap out all the cables, one by one, and see what happens. If that doesn't fix it, then I would switch out machines. Try eliminating things one by one. If you are close to a rental shop, bring in the gear and see if they can help you out. I used to do it all the time at Coffey.
 
fajonze said:
Wow thanks for the replies guys, I appreciate the help.
@VGER- What do you think of the rca-ta3 set up, bag friendly? The set up I have with the female-rca becomes real tight working out of the bag, blah!
Click to expand...


I like it. My RCAs are pretty small, but you could always use a right angle one or just get an adapter. They were pretty simple to make too. I just grabbed a regular RCA to RCA cable at target and cut out the middle part, then soldered on the TA3 to the cuts.
Picture 001.jpg

Right angle rca adapters: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/252323-REG/Hosa_Technology_GRA_259_RCA_Male_to_Female.html
 
Thanks Vger, i'll def check that out

So I did some tests and I noticed the ticking is more prominent when the channel fader is turned all the way to the left, which pretty much turns the mic off
and it does seem to be coming from the Recorder, I flipped to hear the mixer and there was nothing. Flipped around the cables and all that jazz with no result, but what was interesting
was when I changed the bit depth to 16 from 24, the digital sounding ticking was faster. I took out the return line out and plugged my headphones into my recorder, the ticking wasn't
present. It must be coming from the return line connection somehow, tt doesn't seem to be recording onto the mix so I guess i'll just live with it.

If any of you guys are willing to test your tascam-hdp2 who have the same set up, let me know if you experience the same thing. i'm pretty much running hot on the gain like almost full cuz of the -10db attenuation on the xlr outs into the rca giving me such low readings.
 
It could be a cell phone. I hear that when my phone s too close to my cables, even in my studio. It's a click, but with a faint tone too. Almost like the muffled sound of the internet connecting back in the old days of dial-up.
 
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