Technicolor teams up with Canon for DSLR's

awelgraven said:
So who do they have to partner with to fix the moire?
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Canon just has to partner with Canon.

Bassman2003 said:
Who says they need to make just one model of the 5D MKIII? They could make a still and a "video" version.
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Exactly. I don't want to see a 5D MIII with XLRs, I want to see a XF-5D & a XF-7D. 1920x1080 full frame & ASP-C chip cameras with all the audio, zebras, TC.. etc features that come basic on the XH-A1.

I highly doubt anyone here would be really disappointed if the next video DSLR was great for video, but sucked for photos by snapping 2Megapixel stills.
 
If it's a video one, then it won't be a DSLR anymore, it will be a video camera. Two 5DmIII's is just not realistic, and would be confusing from a marketing point of view. The whole point is convergence, not divergence.

Anyhow all of this is diverging from the topic, the relationship of Technicolor to Canon and what that means in concrete terms.
 
Interesting thread - I'll throw something out there.

5D mark III - DSLR form factor but able to send RAW vid files right off the sensor to a small external recorder via Thunderbolt with a bunch of built in Technicolor LUT's.

I'm assuming this wont happen, but the technology is floating around out there and we know Canon has those partnerships. Canon has no high end camera model to protect and they only play in the "cine" space via the DSLR stuff anyway. This also gives them a product that lives in both the stills world and the cine world just like the current crop of DSLRs. It would also be good for Canon because this would not really compete with their camcorder market.

As I said - can't imagine this happening........but if it did........ I would so buy that camera!
 
Yoyodyne said:
Interesting thread - I'll throw something out there.

5D mark III - DSLR form factor but able to send RAW vid files right off the sensor to a small external recorder via Thunderbolt with a bunch of built in Technicolor LUT's.

I'm assuming this wont happen, but the technology is floating around out there and we know Canon has those partnerships. Canon has no high end camera model to protect and they only play in the "cine" space via the DSLR stuff anyway. This also gives them a product that lives in both the stills world and the cine world just like the current crop of DSLRs. It would also be good for Canon because this would not really compete with their camcorder market.

As I said - can't imagine this happening........but if it did........ I would so buy that camera!
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+1
 
yoclay said:
XLR outputs in a DSLR?

Umh, I don't think so.
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Obviously, not on the standard 5DIII that will be going to your typical stills photographer, But I could definitely see an attachment akin to the size and weight of the motor drive that attached to the old F1 that could interface to the 5DIII body through ports on the bottom of the camera. This kind of cine module could have XLRs, SDI and the rest of the goodies that a pro would want in a professional production environment. This announcement from technicolor seems to signal that Canon is dead serious on making the 5DIII a professional production tool, meaning if you fork over the extra $1K, you can expand your 5DIII to fit into the workflow of a professional environment :-) . Given what Panasonic did with the GH2, The 5DIII's codec should be pretty clean.

....ah, speculation, I loves the speculation.
 
I think the key other than the codec, will be the Digic V processing. Like someone said earlier - if Panasonic has a proper method of getting to 1080 there's no good reason Canon can't do the same thing.
The problem could be if Canon decides to REALLY up the MP count of the sensor...to like 28 or something crazy like that. Then it's going to take a lot of processing to get that 1080 and to keep the low light performance of the MK2. I really hope they don't do that - for the sake of both photographers and videographers. If you ask most really serious photographers they don't really give a hoot about giant MP counts....at least not at the expense of better DR and better ISO performance.
Canon's recent trend though has been to be conservative and either raise the MP just a bit or lower it on some cameras.
I would love to see Technicolor adjustments and Canon XHA1/XF series picture adjustments as well, but as has been mentioned....who cares if it's still a super aliased mess. However, I'm pretty optimistic that Canon is fully aware of the ramifications of a lackluster MK3.
 
f64manray said:
Obviously, not on the standard 5DIII that will be going to your typical stills photographer, But I could definitely see an attachment akin to the size and weight of the motor drive that attached to the old F1 that could interface to the 5DIII body through ports on the bottom of the camera. This kind of cine module could have XLRs, SDI and the rest of the goodies that a pro would want in a professional production environment. This announcement from technicolor seems to signal that Canon is dead serious on making the 5DIII a professional production tool, meaning if you fork over the extra $1K, you can expand your 5DIII to fit into the workflow of a professional environment :-) . Given what Panasonic did with the GH2, The 5DIII's codec should be pretty clean.

....ah, speculation, I loves the speculation.
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That would make sense, a bit like putting a Juicedlink with XLR's on your camera. (I own one). However the real issue is not the accessories. It's that a likely 28Mp sensor is going to have to be averaged, pixel binned down or using line skipping to arrive at 2K. Which means ARTIFACTS. The solution to this issue is more important than any added functionality which everyone wishes for as accessories. I frankly just don't see how they are going to get around that.
 
yoclay said:
That would make sense, a bit like putting a Juicedlink with XLR's on your camera. (I own one). However the real issue is not the accessories. It's that a likely 28Mp sensor is going to have to be averaged, pixel binned down or using line skipping to arrive at 2K. Which means ARTIFACTS. The solution to this issue is more important than any added functionality which everyone wishes for as accessories. I frankly just don't see how they are going to get around that.
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Well, Canon has gotten an earful from Hollywood DPs, I find it hard to believe they are developing a more fexible color space with Techniclor, but guess what, aliasing & moire are still there. I don't think this would be acceptable to Technicolor or Canon. They are saying they are shooting for a professional production tool. They certainly know what the bar is. The 5DII was/is a remarkable cinema tool, and they weren't even trying. They are now trying. My confidence level is pretty high that this will be addressed.

Like others, I want to see canon put their cards on the table before I decide between AF100, FS100 or the Canon "?". With this Technicolor announcement, I have a feeling that it's going to be worth the wait.
 
f64manray said:
Well, Canon has gotten an earful from Hollywood DPs, I find it hard to believe they are developing a more fexible color space with Techniclor, but guess what, aliasing & moire are still there. I don't think this would be acceptable to Technicolor or Canon. They are saying they are shooting for a professional production tool. They certainly know what the bar is. The 5DII was/is a remarkable cinema tool, and they weren't even trying. They are now trying. My confidence level is pretty high that this will be addressed.

Like others, I want to see canon put their cards on the table before I decide between AF100, FS100 or the Canon "?". With this Technicolor announcement, I have a feeling that it's going to be worth the wait.
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Completely agree. I really can't see a scenario like this - "After 3 years of R&D, we've listened...we've learned, teamed up with Technicolor, sat down with respected DPs, added Digic V, and now we present to you the all new Canon 5DMK3 - All new aliasing and moire! All new underpowered codec! All new rolling shutter!"
 
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The thing that is interesting about this announcement, is that the absolute intention is to convey that the next 5D is clearly intended for a professional market. I know that many here don't regard DSLR's currently as a pro tool, despite the fact that they are being used on major productions. I think that going into NAB, if Canon is lacking a major release, by pairing with Technicolor they are signaling their continued intention to be a player and giving enough people a reason to hesitate that they are undercutting their competition. A lot of people will continue staying on the fence because of this announcement. Let's hope they follow it up with something concrete.

However, upon reflection I fear that this is more about marketing than substance. In this case we might just be talking about a PictureStyle, or something similar to a series of Cine Gamma curves with varying pedestals in much the same way Panasonic and Sony cameras have these settings in their menus. This strikes me as the most likely possibility.

Technicolor is a beaten down stock, it needs to be paired with something that is happening today. They are struggling to remain relevant. They obviously perceive Canon as the major force behind the DSLR revolution. Canon on the other hand needs to bond with a traditional icon from the cinema industry in order to maintain or increase credibilty in that world and thus in the eyes of aspiring filmmakers, who are their real intended market. Both may need to buy some more time in order to deliver something to their shareholders which won't be a bomb. In this case this announcement would just be a stopgap until then.
 
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Postmaster said:
Why not, think of something like a battery grip but has extra outputs like XLR or (dream) 3G SDI.

Sounds absolutely doable in my book.

Frank
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If Canon were smart they would listen to this request. We hear it often enough.
But they certainly wouldn't integrate it directly onto the camera itself.
 
I'm sick of Frankenstein DSLR rigs.....

Canon - just release the video/cinema camera form-factor large sensor that we all want!!!!!!
The horse has bolted and Canon is way, way, way behind the curve as usual
 
I think that Canon position in the Market is not as clear cut as what it seem on the surface. Many think that as they have no high end camera offering they don't have any line of product to defend. In the first place we should think, why do they not have a high-end broadcast division in the first place. The reason is simple, Canon is one of the very few (2 to 3 manufacturer) that dominate the very lucrative ENG broadcast camera lens market. In fact they are embedded with Sony and Panasonic. So there situation is quite complicated, they walk on a fine line with this. So they have a set of camera that always comes much latter than the big two so as not to compete and anger them directly. They don't get higher than the Prosumer level, not engaging at all at the higher level. So I think there is a lot of politics going on, how will there hdslr and eventual large sensor prosumer line evolve will tell a lot about there strategy.
 
f64manray said:
Obviously, not on the standard 5DIII that will be going to your typical stills photographer, But I could definitely see an attachment akin to the size and weight of the motor drive that attached to the old F1 that could interface to the 5DIII body through ports on the bottom of the camera. This kind of cine module could have XLRs, SDI and the rest of the goodies that a pro would want in a professional production environment. This announcement from technicolor seems to signal that Canon is dead serious on making the 5DIII a professional production tool, meaning if you fork over the extra $1K, you can expand your 5DIII to fit into the workflow of a professional environment :-) . Given what Panasonic did with the GH2, The 5DIII's codec should be pretty clean.

....ah, speculation, I loves the speculation.
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Firstly, I'm only a stills photographer with no real knowledge of video or filmmaking, and I've just been following this site and others to learn a bit about the subject. I very much agree that this sort of add on is the obvious way to go for making a stills DSLR a more usable video orientated camera, without interfering with it's stills capability. The majority of DSLRs sold are for stills, and even now many stills photographers get wound up about there even being video on their stills camera. So too many overt video features on camera whose volumes sales are to stills photographers, would not be a good move, from the point of view of marketing the cameras to stills photographers. Therefore the obvious route out of this double bind is an add on that makes a stills camera a far more usable video camera - without either feature set interfering with the needs of each set of users.

If this is thought about at the design stage of the camera, and not as an afterthought, there's obviously a lot of potential. The add on could have more than just XLR connectors, and could work in tandem with the main camera body's hardware i.e. extra processing power. In fact you could make a whole range of add on video devices, from an affordable one, to a really high end device. The only proviso is that obviously this does need to be thought of at the design stage. However, whether Canon will be that smart is another question. You would have thought that they'd be smart, because so far Canon appears to have been quicker to respond to what was being asked for on video DSLRs.

I think the interesting question not being mentioned here is the Digic V or 5 processor. When the Digic IV or 4 processor was released I specifically remember a Canon spokesperson saying that the Digic IV processor was just a stop gap on the way to the Digic V or 5. This was before the whole DSLR video thing caught on, and the indication at the time was that it was only a year or 2 before the Digic V or 5. So it was a bit odd that the 7D and 1D mkIV were released with Digic IV processors. What this indicated to me was that something had caused Canon to scrap its proposed Digic V or 5 processor design, and start afresh. It would seem obvious that this thing was video, because when Canon were first talking about the Digic V or 5 processor, the VDSLR thing had not happened. The Digic IV was released on the Canon 50D, which had no video, and a month later appeared on the Canon 5D mkII. The rest is history, and it's clear that when Canon introduced the 5D mkII, that they had no idea of the potential of video in DSLRs, and it was thought to be just a useful feature for photojournalists, who wanted to make a few web videos. So the original design of the Digic V or 5 wouldn't really have taken video into account. But we can be sure that it does now, and it's most probably why it's been a long time coming. We can be pretty sure that when the Digic V or 5 does appear, that video from Canon stills cameras will be much improved.
 
Ah, sense, from another 'tog :)
Yes just check out some of the comments that go around the Amateur Photographer forums to see how most feel about video.

Modularity.

That's the key, and anyone who thinks it was invented by Red has forgotten the Canon F1 / F1n or the Nikon F, or for that matter any number of 35mm SLRs from that era.

So consider a camera body with interchangeable sensor modules (Keeping most of the computing power in the body) FF35 24 mp for stills or s35 3k or so for cine, interchangeable VFs, pentaprism and mirror for 'togs, EVF for cine, with a mechanical mirror lock so as not to drain the battery. Then add plug-in modules for XLR input HD-SDI output etc, etc.

Would we see that at 5DIII level? No, I don't think so, but we could do at 1D level.

Dave
 
There is a point where interchangeability is pointless. At that point it is more economically expedient for Canon to just create a seperate video camera.
Add-on grips with video accoutrements, yes. Interchangeable sensor modules? Doubtful.
 
Well consider.

Landscape specialists especially love Real 35mm sized sensors since their wide lenses are still wide, whereas sports and wildlife 'togs love cropped sensors to give their tele lenses more reach, therefore modules could give both, a 36x24 sensor for the landscape bloke and a "C" size for sport / wildlife and perhaps even a sensor without bayer (Or IR) filter for the mono maniac or for the astrophotographer. The requirements for video are different still.

Perhaps we'll see a phase change symmetry breaking and the vDSLR will disassociate into true stills cameras and true video camera and the whole video-in-DSLRs will be history.

Dave
 
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