Technicolor teams up with Canon for DSLR's

Because the f3's upgrade outputs a true, full uncompressed, 10-bit 4:4:4 logarithmic signal.

This picture profile outputs an extremely compressed, 8-bit, 4:2:0, "faux" log signal with the midtone area more or less linear, but redistributing the extremes on a more log response curve. Only real way to fit a "log" signal into an 8-bit space and have it not look like poop. Still better than rec.709 though

You can't compare apples and oranges
 
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Fohdeesha said:
Because the f3's upgrade outputs a true, full uncompressed, 10-bit 4:4:4 logarithmic signal.

This picture profile outputs an extremely compressed, 8-bit, 4:2:0, "faux" log signal with the midtone area more or less linear, but redistributing the extremes on a more log response curve. Only real way to fit a "log" signal into an 8-bit space and have it not look like poop. Still better than rec.709 though

You can't compare apples and oranges
Click to expand...

I know, I was just joking around.

...but still, just because one camera has less compression, doesn't mean that it should cost more to put it into Log color space. I know Log in 10-bit space is more valuable, but Is there something about the F3's Log upgrade that literally makes it more expensive? For example... do you have to send it in to get another board or is there some expansion slot on the back?

It is a Sony product though... and I'm actually surprised the F3 doesn't charge you $5 every time you turn it on... :laugh:
 
There's a lot more to technology then simply parts and implementation. Don't forget about patents, licensing, etc. and yes the parts themselves can cost way more even if they're not much more complicated but simply because there aren't as many of them made (since a need for it is much more uncommon). This was discussed in the thread about the new Black Magic Uncompressed Recorder where people were complaining about it's lack of codec options and other things when they had no clue just how much that costs in licensing (not all codecs are royalty free LOL).
 
Part of the pricing is also what the market will bear. I'm sure that in a year or two someone will include a 10-bit log codec with their camera. Then Sony's will make their upgrade a standard (free) feature.
 
I'm going to be Devil's Advocate fo a moment and say the 5DIII will have NO video functionallity AT ALL.

Why?

Because as Paul V Doherty said it is "freakish"

Now I dissagree with why he said it, but on reflection, including movie modes in what is essentially a photographers tool is freakish. What is also sad is the way some on here kick Canon (et al) as if they'd screwed up in making a video camera, when they're making stills cameras that happen to record movies as well.

I think what will happen is Canon will look at the ergonomics, power requirements and cost of getting high quality moving pictures out of a DSLR form-factor camera, and decide they're on a hiding to nothing, instead they'll work to produce a hypothetical "XF 35" or whatever they'll call it with all the video gubbins that people need in a video form-factor camera, with a 35mm sized sensor and a robust codec.

Believe you me, there'll be plenty of die-hard 'togs who'll dance in the streets if Canon did this.

Do I really think Canon will do this? No, but neither do I think we'll see amazing video from what is a DSLR after all.

Anyone who thinks Canon can't pull off anything world-changing has forgotten the shock-waves when their original 300 f/2.8 L (Fluorite) FD lens was used to photograph secret papers from across the UN chamber, and the words were legible! unheard of at the time.
Also remember Canon have had interchangerble lenses on 1/3" video cameras for a long time, it's just a matter of applying what they already know.

Now anyone who dissagrees with me is welcome to shoot me down, providing:
They actually know, of their own knowledge what Canon is up to, and
Are not under a NDA preventing them from saying anything.

Dave
 
daveswan said:
I'm going to be Devil's Advocate fo a moment and say the 5DIII will have NO video functionallity AT ALL.

Why?

Because as Paul V Doherty said it is "freakish"

Now I dissagree with why he said it, but on reflection, including movie modes in what is essentially a photographers tool is freakish. What is also sad is the way some on here kick Canon (et al) as if they'd screwed up in making a video camera, when they're making stills cameras that happen to record movies as well.

I think what will happen is Canon will look at the ergonomics, power requirements and cost of getting high quality moving pictures out of a DSLR form-factor camera, and decide they're on a hiding to nothing, instead they'll work to produce a hypothetical "XF 35" or whatever they'll call it with all the video gubbins that people need in a video form-factor camera, with a 35mm sized sensor and a robust codec.

Believe you me, there'll be plenty of die-hard 'togs who'll dance in the streets if Canon did this.

Do I really think Canon will do this? No, but neither do I think we'll see amazing video from what is a DSLR after all.

Anyone who thinks Canon can't pull off anything world-changing has forgotten the shock-waves when their original 300 f/2.8 L (Fluorite) FD lens was used to photograph secret papers from across the UN chamber, and the words were legible! unheard of at the time.
Also remember Canon have had interchangerble lenses on 1/3" video cameras for a long time, it's just a matter of applying what they already know.

Now anyone who dissagrees with me is welcome to shoot me down, providing:
They actually know, of their own knowledge what Canon is up to, and
Are not under a NDA preventing them from saying anything.

Dave
Click to expand...

I'll make a bet with the Devil then! I think the 5DMk3 will produce amazing video. Everyday, the evidence seems to be stacking up for it to go this way....the technicolor partnership, the recent interview with Chuck Westfall, the ads that Canon has been producing, etc. Why do i think Canon will do this on a stills cam? Because it's a cash cow, without having to actually build a new platform and this is truly the beginning of the next generation of Canon's VDSLR
Gen 1 - 5DMK2...then T1i -Was for photo journalists...any video was better than no video. Canon didn't really care about it
Gen 2 - 7D, T2i, T3i 60D -Canon caught a glimpse of what people were doing and added new framerates/resolutions to the 7D and incremental video upgrades to the lesser cameras.
Gen 3 - 5DMK3 Canon now know's what's up...they're selling a ton of cameras for video use only...and now Chuck Westfall is saying they're very determined to fix the biggest video complaints on this generation of camera and he wants to hear from his customers..actually directing people to complain.
I'm usually very skeptical by nature...but I'm very optimistic on this one. The 5DMK3 features will be Canon's basic video DSLR platform for the next few years...so it's going to be much improved just to stay ahead and keep that momentum rolling.
 
pulpfiction007 said:
I'll make a bet with the Devil then! I think the 5DMk3 will produce amazing video. Everyday, the evidence seems to be stacking up for it to go this way....the technicolor partnership, the recent interview with Chuck Westfall, the ads that Canon has been producing, etc. Why do i think Canon will do this on a stills cam? Because it's a cash cow, without having to actually build a new platform and this is truly the beginning of the next generation of Canon's VDSLR
Gen 1 - 5DMK2...then T1i -Was for photo journalists...any video was better than no video. Canon didn't really care about it
Gen 2 - 7D, T2i, T3i 60D -Canon caught a glimpse of what people were doing and added new framerates/resolutions to the 7D and incremental video upgrades to the lesser cameras.
Gen 3 - 5DMK3 Canon now know's what's up...they're selling a ton of cameras for video use only...and now Chuck Westfall is saying they're very determined to fix the biggest video complaints on this generation of camera and he wants to hear from his customers..actually directing people to complain.
I'm usually very skeptical by nature...but I'm very optimistic on this one. The 5DMK3 features will be Canon's basic video DSLR platform for the next few years...so it's going to be much improved just to stay ahead and keep that momentum rolling.
Click to expand...

RAW or uncompressed 4:2:2 output WILL happen... Ill put $$ on it...
 
in my opinion,
the ratio of buyers in photographers vs. filmmakers is 1:10 (a figure i cannot back up :D)
I agree canon has somethign up their sleeve.. i just dont think 5D mk III would be it.

would they enjoy the additional sales from the filmmakers community? sure.
but i highly doubt theyll focus on a market that barely bumps majority of their sales.

Do i think 5DmkIII would have better video? slightly. highly sceptical. not their utmost priority on a Stills cam.
I think theyre making a large sensor Video camera instead of making a hybrid.
 
Well now I've broken my 666 count, I'll say that I think (Actually I hope) that Canon will improve the video quality / functionality of the 5DIII, but only to the extent that it won't increase the cost, or more importantly the perceived cost to photographers.
Remember, this is a photographers tool, not a film-makers, the majority will be bought by people with no interest at all in video, and having to pay for things they don't want, or actively hate will loose market fast for Canon.

So what could we realistically see?

A new sensor with a resolution that makes the down-conversion to 1920x1080 arithmetically easy, with increased dynamic range, and a fast enough read-reset time to reduce skew to unimportant levels.
A Digic V processor (Or 2) with enough power to do the de-mosaicing and down-sampling without any nasty moire by-products
And a more robust codec, the XF 50 mbps 4:2:2 sounds realistic, uncompressed 10 bit or raw video doesn't.
They may even give a choice of codecs, an H264 for non-critical use with lower spec cards, and the XF for critical use with expensive cards.

Or not. ATM we're all guessing, as those who really know are probably under a NDA and cant tell us,

Dave
 
dcloud said:
in my opinion,
the ratio of buyers in photographers vs. filmmakers is 1:10 (a figure i cannot back up :D)
I agree canon has somethign up their sleeve.. i just dont think 5D mk III would be it.

would they enjoy the additional sales from the filmmakers community? sure.
but i highly doubt theyll focus on a market that barely bumps majority of their sales.

Do i think 5DmkIII would have better video? slightly. highly sceptical. not their utmost priority on a Stills cam.
I think theyre making a large sensor Video camera instead of making a hybrid.
Click to expand...

They already have. EVERY commercial I've seen from Canon in the last year is centered around video...that's focusing a lot of advertising dollars on video. Do I think they'll make the 5DMK3 an unbeatable cam for video purposes? - no. (it is a stills cam afterall) Do I think they'll improve greatly upon the video function? - absolutlely. The part of the market buying these for video is the piece of the pie that's growing a lot, and for photography many buyers have gone to smaller sytems, esp in Japan. Canon will not ignore a segment that is helping them to grow market share...at least I hope not!
 
dcloud said:
in my opinion,
the ratio of buyers in photographers vs. filmmakers is 1:10 (a figure i cannot back up :D)
I agree canon has somethign up their sleeve.. i just dont think 5D mk III would be it.

would they enjoy the additional sales from the filmmakers community? sure.
but i highly doubt theyll focus on a market that barely bumps majority of their sales.

Do i think 5DmkIII would have better video? slightly. highly sceptical. not their utmost priority on a Stills cam.
I think theyre making a large sensor Video camera instead of making a hybrid.
Click to expand...

Really? "Barely bump" sales because of the video feature? I would say the video feature alone means thousands and thousands more units sold than a 5DIII without it. I can't prove it, but my gut tells me there's tens of thousands of wannabe film makers out there that want the new and improved version of the cam that that was used as an "A" cam on House. The cinema market is deeper and broader than you might think. I think it may even be equal to the photographer market. Just my belief, but inside every still photographer is a budding DP trying to break out. Even if these budding DP's never act on that impulse, they want a cam that will let them if they so choose. I'm sensing Canon feels that way as well.
 
I agree with you again f64manray. The video feature started out as a tool for photojournalists but has evolved into something completely different and has probably been the main reason to boost the incredible year Canon posted in 2010. While I don't think it's equal to the photography market, there are now TONS (All models combined) of these things being sold for video only...2 years ago - No....but as Dylan said "The times they are a changin' "
Canon DSLRs are being used everywhere, in the markets where you would have seen HVXs, XHA1s etc. While I don't think the full frames get the phenomenal sales figures the lower models do for video only...the 5DMK3 and DigicV will be the place where the next lower end models get their video features from, so I think it'll be a great improvement.
 
This is the most dynamic range i could get from Canon 550D,contrast on lowest setting and then you can rise shadows and lower bright overexposed areas ,first one is contrast in the middle,next one is contrast on lowest setting (-4),last one is corrected to rise shadows and keep it from overexposing.I dont know if this new technicolor thing will help,we will see.
contgamma.jpg
 
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^^ ive seen some of the footage of the technicolor stuff from NAB and it looks even more flat that that with way less grain...\
 
According to Cinema 5D News, Technicolor postponed the release of their “CineStyle” from“later this month” to “We are targeting a release in the coming weeks but the date is not fixed!”

Not a biggie unless you're prepping a shoot in the next couple of weeks. At least I hope it's not a biggie.
 
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