sumix SMX-12A2C fullHD 60p

A

anthom

Member
hi,
i wanted to star this thread cause i cant post at Dvinfo, where
the camera is being discussed.

http://www.sumix.com/products/cameras/smx-12a2m/smx-12a2c.html


i have some questions becaue im pretty new to the digital workflow. i hope
someone can help me.


1.) is the camera ready to shoot when i get it after i attached my lens for 2/3sensors/16mm film, and connected to my laptop?

3.) is there any software included in the package, that gives me control over the camera, e.g. shutter, gain, curves....

4.) is there any other way for monitoring, then using my laptop? any outputs i could use?

5.) which outputs has the camera?

6.) does is get the power from the connection to the laptop?

7.) can i attach it to a tripod?

8.) can i record sound with the camera?

9.) on the dvinfo forum Farhad Towfiq posted this:
"We are considering to move to newer sensor P4562-3T as quickly as possible and limit this version of the camera with P3562 to production of 20-100 cameras. Therefore, this version will be more like a collector item."

is the version that is sold right now (SMX-12A2C) the so called "collector item" or has it already buit in the new sensor, and what would be the differences of the sensors?


best regards, and sorry for my bad english

Julian Holzwarth
 
I know, that's what I was saying under 3k. I'm definitely on board, it's only a matter of time before they update their status again.

I think 24 and 25 are one of the framerates judging by the sample videos.
 
Ah yes, right. They say delivery is about 4 to 5 weeks after you place your order.

What's the workflow like? What do you capture footage to, what do you use to edit, etc. It says 12 bits... what kind of color sampling? I'd guess 4:2:0 since it's using a Beyer pattern...
 
Take a look at the sample images, very impressive, I wonder if the Letus genius guy could make a c-mount 35 mm adaptor?

Thats a commination I would like to see...
 
well i emailed them to get some more info and this is what they said:

Q Does recoarding software come with it?
A. Yes, the recording soft is part of the delivery kit

Q: Can you shoot 24p?
A: Shooting at 24p: yes, at full resolution in 12 bit mode the max fps is 30, in 8 bit mode - 60 frame rate is user controlled

Q. Color Sampling 4:2:0, 4:1:1, 4:2:2, 4:4:4?
A. Camera does no bayer->rgb conversion, it just sends raw frames to PC. Application can use one of the implemented conversion algorithms of camera API or an algorithm developed by user. Camera API provides access to raw data.


One thing i did notice about the footage is that it looked like there was a slight flickering/strobeing effect happening. Has anyone else noticed this?


hope this info is useful.
 
Ah, so there is no color sampling, in fact there's no processing at all. Kind of Red-like in that aspect -- the raw information is sent to the computer and all demosaic'ing and processing is done there.

Interesting. So it's useless without proper software; capture software is necessary but we also need proper image processing software. If we had SculptorHD working with this product, then we'd have something really interesting indeed.
 
thx for the infos neil! i also got a reply from sumix:

> 1) what does the camera cost and when itll be available?
The price is $2500 + shipping cost, lead time - 5-6 weeks after the PO
is placed

> 2) is the camera ready to shoot when i get it after i attached my lens
> for 2/3sensors/16mm film, and connected to my laptop?
Provided you have one free 1-Gigabit Ethernet port on the computer,
recommended Intel integrated
Having installed all needed software (driver, application) you can get
video stream visualized or recorded to HDD.

> 3) is there any software included in the package, that gives me control
> over the camera, e.g. shutter, gain, curves....
Sure, standard camera application is at your disposal. Also, using camera
API you can develop the applications of your own, limited only by your
imagination :)

> 4) is there any other way for monitoring, then using my laptop? any
> outputs i could use?
> 5.) which outputs has the camera?

The camera application can create avi file ready to be played or a file
with raw data (raw bayer frames)
> 6) does it get the power from the connection to the laptop?

PowerOwerEthernet IEEE 802.3af compliant or external power: 5 V

> 7) can i attach it to a tripod?
yes

> 8) can I record sound with the camera?
No


> is the version you are selling right now (SMX-12A2C) the so called
> "collector item" or has it already built in the new sensor,
> and what would be the differences of the sensors?

The camera we are selling now uses 3652, about the 3652 - 4652
difference - later

------------------------------------------------------------------------

i really need a camera, but i wont buy it till i saw sum more sample
videos. the ones on the site didnt really convince me,
and those square pixel pattern scared me a lil bit and the extrem low saturation
of the previews is strange, when i color correct them they are
extremly noisy, first i thought the previews were shot under low
light conditions, but i dont think because u can see extrem highlights
on the glass, so they were lights...
or has this sum to do wit the raw format? can i capture them wit a higer saturation? somebody knows dat?

and i searched at b&h for sum lenses and they have a lot 2/3 c-mount lenses,
but for industrial/surveillance use...
has someone experience with those lenses? can they be used for normal
feature films either? are they corrected against chromatic aberrations,
distorsion, do they have a nice bokeh,...?

here is a conversion chart for the lenses

35 mm: Equivalent focal length HD 2/3":

14mm 5.6mm
16mm 6.4mm
20mm 8mm
24mm 9.7mm
28mm 11.3mm
32mm 13mm
40mm 16mm
50mm 20mm
85mm 34mm
100mm 40mm
135mm 54mm

what happens when i attach sum 35mm lenses wit an adapter?
somebody knows dat? becaue u can buy pretty cheap
nikon to c-mount adapters....
 
I used still-camera lenses with a c-mount 16mm camera many times, they work fine.

Keep in mind you're already going to get very nice shallow DOF with a 2/3" chip; watch our Hallows Fest film "Unawakening" to get an idea of the kind of DOF you'll get with one of these even without using a 35mm adapter.

For c-mount lenses look for the Switars on ebay, they're pretty decent and reasonably cheap.

If this thing was $1,000 I'd take the gamble and buy it and report on it, but at $2500 I'm not quite so adventurous.

As for the striping or patterns, that might be due to their software maybe... in other words, with a better demosaic'ing algorithm perhaps that could be fixed. Sure would be nice if SculptorHD worked with this!
 
u took 35mm still lenses?
does that mean when i take a 50mm focal length (for 35mm film),
i get a focal length of 20mm on 16mm film/2/3sensor? so i have a wide angle lens now?

i watched the short movie, i really like it!
with this sensor size there is really no need for a 35mm adapter
in my opinion.
 
The focal length doesn't change just because you mount it on a different-sized sensor. The field of view changes, but the focal length doesn't.

Put a 50mm still lens on a c-mount adapter and mount that to a 16mm camera or a 2/3" sensor, and it'll look exactly like as if you took an ENG lens and zoomed it to 50mm.

A 2/3" sensor is very close to the size of 16mm film and will provide a field of view and depth of field that's in the same ballpark as 16mm film.

If you took a lens off of a 35mm still camera and put it on a 35mm movie camera, you'd notice that it looks more "telephoto" (owing to the 35mm movie frame being about half the size of a 35mm still-camera frame). If you took that same lens and put it on a 16mm camera (or 2/3" video camera) you'd see it looking even more telephoto.
 
I dunno. I think it's worth the 2-2500.00. Especially if you can do 24p. I'd like to see where the de-mosaic is going because I'm not a fan of the little lines I'm seeing. If they're saying it's for cinematographers as well, then the image should be a little cleaner than that.

It is a start, though, and thousands upon thousands less for 120FPS 720p AND 1080p60p. That's pretty impressive.

Not Hydra, but still a start.
 
Where Can I download the API documentation? I might be able to program a nifty little camera control tool..of course free for all DVXusers:)
 
don't worry found it there website, I think I'm gonna build a camera tool ! I just had a scan read of the API docs and you can control just about every imaginable parameter, I should be able to do some excellent stuff.. :)
 
Well it certainly makes pretty pictures. If someone can jerryrig a workflow together this would be a cost effective Andromeda/Hydra successor.

Go Anhar go. :)
 
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