Stu @ Prolost: no 24P for the 5dMkii
- Thread starter Matt Gottshalk
- Start date
I blogged about this yay. I have a new blog. It's my first time ever. I have screen grabs for now and some clips. But all kinda old.
tarekkandil.blogspot.com I have no comments no nothing still need to learn how to link up.
also, did anyone get a malware warning on dvxuser this morning?
tarekkandil.blogspot.com I have no comments no nothing still need to learn how to link up.
also, did anyone get a malware warning on dvxuser this morning?
This is ridiculous.
There were mobs of people & blogs trying to passionately reason why manual control was not coming, and the majority of them only ended up looking foolish.
We were getting mixed messages from Canon representatives then, and it's the exact same thing now. If Canon reps have absolutely no idea whats going on, neither does Stu and this entire blog entry is worthless as a source of accurate information.
Not that I expect 24p... it could go either way... However, I think its reasonable enough to think that if 24p is a card in Canons hand, it's not something they would announce and may even try to mislead the market on purpose to gain an advantage.
There were mobs of people & blogs trying to passionately reason why manual control was not coming, and the majority of them only ended up looking foolish.
We were getting mixed messages from Canon representatives then, and it's the exact same thing now. If Canon reps have absolutely no idea whats going on, neither does Stu and this entire blog entry is worthless as a source of accurate information.
Not that I expect 24p... it could go either way... However, I think its reasonable enough to think that if 24p is a card in Canons hand, it's not something they would announce and may even try to mislead the market on purpose to gain an advantage.
Michael_Richard
Active member
what's wrong with converting 30p -> 24p in Mpeg Steamclip. Looks pretty good to my eyes.
ethan cooper
Well-known member
That pretty much sums up the entire vDSLR (lower case v intentional) thing right now. It's almost really great, ah well...
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
what are you doing to get it to work without major ghosting in MPEGStreamclip???
Reading through this thread, there seems to be some logic that predicts a $8,000 dollar price point to get to the next level from the 5D mk II and GH1.
I don't think Canon or anybody else can sell a 5D mk II type DSLR with 24p and XLR inputs and just a touch better image for 8K.
There seems to be opinions that $1,500 low end, $2,500-$4,000 prosumer and a $8,000 for professional will continue to be valid price points. It was also suggested that the manufactures need this to survive.
My opinion is just the opposite as to what we are going to get in the future based on price and performance. (some manufactures may not survive, but that doesn't factor into price and performance).
In 1980, a 1 million dollar color computer from SciTex couldn't do 1/1000 of what a $800 computer and Photoshop and Illustrator can do today.
When the first high end DSLR's came out, they were over $30,000 . Some sold to photographers and some were sold to people who put them on digital microscopes. Sorry to say, but the sub $1,000 point and shoots blow those early cameras away today. The 5D is so far better, it's scary.
Flatbed, drum, and 35mm scanners sold for $8,000 -$39,000. The first digital scanner I know of was over 100k. Now you get the same quality and faster speeds in $300 dollar to $2,500 units.
Video editing systems that used to sell for $25,000 to $60,000 can be bested today for $1,500 to $8K.
By the way, my 4k stereo from yesteryear sucks compared to what I can buy today for ¼ the price. How many high end stereo shops are around from 20-30 years ago? How much of that gear is still being made, not much. Technology has brought quality up and prices into near commodity ranges. Photography is already at a commodity price and video is not far behind.
Last week I was shooting some wrens flying around a bird feeder while visiting my sister at her cottage. I was using the 5D on a tripod with an L lens. My wife, hand held, auto mode shot a few shots with her canon point and shoot that cost $350. Guess what, there wasn't a whole lot of difference in the images from the two cameras. Sure, I could see some difference, but even I was disappointed in the difference . She just pulled the camera out of her purse. I was tripod, cameras, lens change, ND filter. I will continue to lug around the gear, but he average Joe isn't going to.
The average Joe isn't going to pay the production costs for an 8k camera if he can't see the difference from the 3k camera. That's life today.
The 5D mkII and GH1 are game changers and they are the new measuring stick.
They aren't going to be able to give use small incremental changes and charge 2x-4x times the price. Just not going to happen.
OT, the sensors keep getting better and better. At some point they will be a commodity. Then prices will really drop. Every time I do a scan on my sub $500 scanner or $2000 Nikon 35mm, I marvel at how good they look with old photos and 35mm slides compared to the expensive scanners of 10-20 years ago. Then I compare them to my 5D images and think how bad the old stuff looks. The same goes for my old video's. There is just no comparison and the gear just keeps getting better and cheaper.
There is just too much history in digital color to suggest that they can put the cat back in the bag. When the 5D came out 8 months ago, it was called a game changer and nothing has happened to change that thought.
The GH1 and 5D have set the bar for price performance and if history is any indication, it will only get better and cheaper, not more expensive.
I don't think Canon or anybody else can sell a 5D mk II type DSLR with 24p and XLR inputs and just a touch better image for 8K.
There seems to be opinions that $1,500 low end, $2,500-$4,000 prosumer and a $8,000 for professional will continue to be valid price points. It was also suggested that the manufactures need this to survive.
My opinion is just the opposite as to what we are going to get in the future based on price and performance. (some manufactures may not survive, but that doesn't factor into price and performance).
In 1980, a 1 million dollar color computer from SciTex couldn't do 1/1000 of what a $800 computer and Photoshop and Illustrator can do today.
When the first high end DSLR's came out, they were over $30,000 . Some sold to photographers and some were sold to people who put them on digital microscopes. Sorry to say, but the sub $1,000 point and shoots blow those early cameras away today. The 5D is so far better, it's scary.
Flatbed, drum, and 35mm scanners sold for $8,000 -$39,000. The first digital scanner I know of was over 100k. Now you get the same quality and faster speeds in $300 dollar to $2,500 units.
Video editing systems that used to sell for $25,000 to $60,000 can be bested today for $1,500 to $8K.
By the way, my 4k stereo from yesteryear sucks compared to what I can buy today for ¼ the price. How many high end stereo shops are around from 20-30 years ago? How much of that gear is still being made, not much. Technology has brought quality up and prices into near commodity ranges. Photography is already at a commodity price and video is not far behind.
Last week I was shooting some wrens flying around a bird feeder while visiting my sister at her cottage. I was using the 5D on a tripod with an L lens. My wife, hand held, auto mode shot a few shots with her canon point and shoot that cost $350. Guess what, there wasn't a whole lot of difference in the images from the two cameras. Sure, I could see some difference, but even I was disappointed in the difference . She just pulled the camera out of her purse. I was tripod, cameras, lens change, ND filter. I will continue to lug around the gear, but he average Joe isn't going to.
The average Joe isn't going to pay the production costs for an 8k camera if he can't see the difference from the 3k camera. That's life today.
The 5D mkII and GH1 are game changers and they are the new measuring stick.
They aren't going to be able to give use small incremental changes and charge 2x-4x times the price. Just not going to happen.
OT, the sensors keep getting better and better. At some point they will be a commodity. Then prices will really drop. Every time I do a scan on my sub $500 scanner or $2000 Nikon 35mm, I marvel at how good they look with old photos and 35mm slides compared to the expensive scanners of 10-20 years ago. Then I compare them to my 5D images and think how bad the old stuff looks. The same goes for my old video's. There is just no comparison and the gear just keeps getting better and cheaper.
There is just too much history in digital color to suggest that they can put the cat back in the bag. When the 5D came out 8 months ago, it was called a game changer and nothing has happened to change that thought.
The GH1 and 5D have set the bar for price performance and if history is any indication, it will only get better and cheaper, not more expensive.
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morgan_moore
Major Contributor
Hmm
Pro photographers (still) seem happy (ish) to pay around $3-5k for a decent cam
I have not got the D3x ($6k) but am happy with the D3 at that £3k price point - its anawesome camera - not because of the chip but because of the physical perfomance robustness AF that works - the AF has always been cr&p on the D200 etc
Ist actually about the same price as the 1999 D1
Those pro bodies are basically the same in terms of a pricey physical chasis, weather proof buttons etc - all pricey stuff
Just the electronics are different
I reckon C/N know that we will shell out at that level
Im hoping under £4k uk for a decent controllable nikon
S
Theo Valich says his RedOne cost $50K before he could start filming. Link:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/tg...nwrapping-lamborghini-video-cameras,5156.html
When the GH2 comes out, the GH1 will then be dirt cheap. But, even Phill Bloom says on his blog that the GH1 codec is too weak.
The 5D2 has been out for nearly a year now. It can be far of for a new model.
I have not yet seen 30p converted to 24p smoothly.
If you have, please pst me a link, or better yet, PM me.
I have been in electronics for 27years, and do not belive it would be impossible to modify the clock circuit of the 5D2 to run a little slower - ie 24p.
But, why would you shoot 24p ? The higher the frame rate, the smoother it is.
I can see 24p flicker and judder at the cinema.
All digital cinemas can project in 30p.
The only real need would be to convert to 25p for Europe HDTV broadcast.
Pretty much all new TVs display 1920x1080 natively. This format is most likely going to be you most viewed display format in years to come.
720P displayed on a 1080TV (most new models) does not look as good as it could be, with wither softening, artifacts, or both.
The image sensor in the 5D2 has 2.3x the area of the one in the GH1 - hence the 5d2's low light goodness.
You cannot realy compare the 5D2 to the GH1. The 5D2 kills the GH1 in lowlight.
The codec in the GH1 is pretty duboius - even Phill Bloom says the GH1 codec is 'too weak. I have seen the GH1's streaks, and low light 'tartan' patterns, not to mention the general lack of detail in low light.
The 5D2 even kills the RedOne in low light.
BTW, how can the cheap point and shoot look like the 5D2 when corectly displayed on a quality 50" plasma ?? Even DVD looks rubbish on a quality display device.
squig
Veteran
we like the flicker and judder
It's funny how filmmakers try to add flicker and judder and TV manufacturers try to remove it
Lammy
Well-known member
The funny thing is, I like 48p, 50p, and 60p. And I like high shutters, ala Saving Private Ryan and Crank 1 and 2. I even like slow shutters like a Wong Kar Wai film or Michael Mann.
But 30p looks gash!