Rumor: Canon 4k super35 camera

Danielvilliers said:
Now this is all speculation, what I think should be done is a campaign ala 24 fps Canon 5d mark 2 lobby, to put pressure on them to at least get 10 bit and 422. As the camera is coming in 5 month and that some part of the specification are not set in stone we still have time to make our voice heard loud and clear. This will be what we will expect to see in the future Canon Dslr line up for the next 3 to 4 years, so better get it right from now. Again all this could be changed on the November 3 announcement.
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Yea, I'm down for that. All we have to do is start a big list of all the people who are NOT going to buy the camera if it remains in 4:2:0 color space. With a 300mb/s data rate... 4:2:2 10-bit is definitely possible. And honestly, kind of expected in a 2012 camera system.

I'm not buying ANY new camera above $900 this year that is not AT LEAST 4:2:2 color space. There is just no excuse anymore. I mean c'mon... the GH2 is doing all I-frames at 200mb/s, this new Canon is capable of 300mb/s... quit screwing around with us (you other guys). Just face the fact that you're not going to be able to sell 8 different "tired" cameras to different markets anymore... build a pro-sumer motion/cinema camera with 4:2:2 10-bit up to 60fps and then a 4:4:4 12-bit professional model that goes up to 120fps and be done with it. The technology is there... it just that these companies are still tying to sell us old technology from 2005. Take a hint from Apple... Sometimes you need to cannibalize your own products in the name of progress... because if you don't, someone else will.
 
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GH2user said:
Just face the fact that you're not going to be able to sell 8 different "tired" cameras to different markets anymore... build a pro-sumer motion/cinema camera with 4:2:2 10-bit up to 60fps and then a 4:4:4 12-bit professional model that goes up to 120fps and be done with it. The technology is there... it just that these companies are still tying to sell us old technology from 2005. Take a hint from Apple... Sometimes you need to cannibalize your own products in the name of progress... because if you don't, someone else will.
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+1. I like how you misspelled "tiered" as "tired." It works.
 
GH2user said:
Yea, I'm down for that. All we have to do is start a big list of all the people who are NOT going to buy the camera if it remains in 4:2:0 color space. With a 300mb/s data rate... 4:2:2 10-bit is definitely possible. And honestly, kind of expected in a 2012 camera system.

I'm not buying ANY new camera above $900 this year that is not AT LEAST 4:2:2 color space. There is just no excuse anymore. I mean c'mon... the GH2 is doing all I-frames at 200mb/s, this new Canon is capable of 300mb/s... quit screwing around with us (you other guys). Just face the fact that you're not going to be able to sell 8 different "tired" cameras to different markets anymore... build a pro-sumer motion/cinema camera with 4:2:2 10-bit up to 60fps and then a 4:4:4 12-bit professional model that goes up to 120fps and be done with it. The technology is there... it just that these companies are still tying to sell us old technology from 2005. Take a hint from Apple... Sometimes you need to cannibalize your own products in the name of progress... because if you don't, someone else will.
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Agree 110%.
 
Just got an invite from Filmtools for the Canon event (I'm just on their regular mailing list). Filmtools says it's a product announcement but they don't know what it is.

The invite links to the official Canon event registration site and the invite now says the event is taking place Nov 4-5, 1-9pm on the 4th and 10a-4pm on the 5th (although this just might be exhibit after the big announcement on the 3rd if that's still happening). It's definitely at Paramount Studios. That's a heck of lot of time to be showing off something...must be pretty good!
 
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Danielvilliers said:
Now this is all speculation, what I think should be done is a campaign ala 24 fps Canon 5d mark 2 lobby, to put pressure on them to at least get 10 bit and 422. As the camera is coming in 5 month and that some part of the specification are not set in stone we still have time to make our voice heard loud and clear.
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"[A]t least get 10 bit and 422"? If Canon has to be told that, it is collectively too stupid to understand. But Panasonic, which has otherwise produced intelligent products, really dropped the ball with the AF100. Claiming 10-bit 4:2:2 was too expensive to include, it turns around and releases the HPX250. Sure that camera has smaller imagers, but because it has three, it requires a more complex (and therefore costly) imaging block, plus it also has an expensive long-range zoom (until relatively recently, the AF100's MSRP didn't include a lens), 10-bit 4:2:2 AVC-Intra, and P2. All for a few hundred dollars more than the price of the AF100. Then it announces the AVC-LongG codec, which is 10-bit 4:2:2 but is, I assume, a consumer codec. Its "digital cinema" camera, the AF100, is stuck with a consumer 8-bit, 4:2:0 codec. So, yeah, I suppose manufacturers sometimes really don't get it.
 
Panasonic and Sony seem to use codecs as a way to tier their products. You often have to step up to a whole another price bracket just to get a better codec. But they do this at their own peril because it just opens the door for someone else to put a better codec in a lower priced product. Canon is in the best position to do this because the have no high end product line to protect. I hope they get this one right.
 
Piolet said:
Panasonic and Sony seem to use codecs as a way to tier their products. You often have to step up to a whole another price bracket just to get a better codec. But they do this at their own peril because it just opens the door for someone else to put a better codec in a lower priced product. Canon is in the best position to do this because the have no high end product line to protect. I hope they get this one right.
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At least with Sony, you can move up from the FS100 to the F3 or F65. Panasonic has, as yet, no high-end large-sensor camera. Ironically, the GH2 has been hacked to run at a far higher data rate (176 Mbps) than the AF100 -- and without GOP. Now, if only Vitaliy Kisselev would hack the AF100 to run at 10- or (12-) bit 4:2:2 (or 4:4:4) and at the full resolution of the sensor.
 
androbot2084 said:
Still nothing radical or revolutionary coming down the pipeline.
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And what would you do with it if there was?What we have today is infinitely betterthan anything we've ever had before. The simple fact is: if you can't shoot something amazing on an AF100, there's only one reason why. People should spend more time shooting and less time complaining.
 
I think a lot of us are shooting. I am (dustbrandfilms.com). But I am very curious and eager to find out whats next. I have shot 40 plus music videos on the 5d since 2009 and have gotten great results. I almost got a fs-100 a few months ago, but it didnt feel right. The 1dx sounds pretty amazing if the bit rate turns out to be correct and its 10 bit 422 at least. If canon's releasing a video camera style body with some similar specs then I think this will pull a lot of people off the bench who have been patiently waiting. NO company has done the leap frog product yet, someone should (Canon might)
 
I think it comes to times like these where we should also just be thankful for what we do have. Imagine what Orson Wells or Alfred Hitchcock would have thought if we could go back and tell them we're shooting films on a Canon SLR. Things will get better, it will take time, but look at what we've got now and then use what we've got now to make films that ol' Wells or Hitchcock would be proud of.
 
kylevant said:
I think it comes to times like these where we should also just be thankful for what we do have. Imagine what Orson Wells or Alfred Hitchcock would have thought if we could go back and tell them we're shooting films on a Canon SLR. Things will get better, it will take time, but look at what we've got now and then use what we've got now to make films that ol' Wells or Hitchcock would be proud of.
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And they might also say... you mean you can't trust your dp or your own skills. you have to look at a monitor... I'm guilty also of this..
 
Okay, one last thing on this... Canon has apparently hired Sunshine Sachs to coordinate and administer this November 3rd event.

Do you know how many Canon DSLR or camcorder product introductions have had their own event? Think about it. It's never happened before. Even the 1D X, their king of DSLRs, a $7,000 product, didn't get an event, they just dropped a press release on the market. That's how Canon has always operated. They don't do shows and events. Heck, traditionally they haven't even timed their camcorder introductions to even overlap with major industry events like NAB or IBC either.

This whole thing is so far out of the ordinary for them, that I would expect that whatever they do on November 3rd, it will be completely out of the ordinary.

This event can't possibly be for the introduction of a 5D Mark III or an FS100/AF100 competitor. It just can't be. It wouldn't make any sense. This event is about something substantial for Hollywood. Not for consumers. This event has to be associated with their Canon Hollywood service center, or that they're buying Paramount, or something like that. It's all Hollywood connected, all Hollywood based, they are doing it at a major Hollywood studio, they've hired a premiere Hollywood PR agent to administer the event, and they're opening a Hollywood service center for Hollywood customers.

Who knows... maybe they'll drop a camcorder or two while they're at it, but the whole thing seems like it's far more and far different than a camcorder introduction. I mean... they even mentioned that the 1D X is aimed to be their premium DSLR moviemaking product, so why introduce it now instead of at the event? Only reasonable explanation would be: because the event isn't about a product introduction, right?

Oh well, doesn't matter, we're only nine days away so I guess we'll see soon enough.
 
Maybe they figured out how to manufacture their own film ultra cheap, got a patent on the process, have new Canon Film Cameras coming out and plan on bringing cheap 35mm Film shooting and processing to Hollywood to fill the void and increase the interest when Kodak et al vanish...

...

How's THAT for ultra-wild speculation!?
 
The more I read about the Canon service center they announced, the more I think that Red & Jannard are right to be focusing their attention on Canon. It really sounds like Canon is making a major push into big-budget Hollywood film production, and that's Red's bread and butter. Read the press release from the Wall Street Journal No wonder Jannard came out with some fighting words. Although I'm still not sold on the idea that Canon would be making a motion picture camera to compete with the likes of the Red or the Alexa.

Read the story again and see what you think.
http://online.wsj.com/article/PR-CO-20111012-906716.html
 
Barry_Green said:
The more I read about the Canon service center they announced, the more I think that Red & Jannard are right to be focusing their attention on Canon. It really sounds like Canon is making a major push into big-budget Hollywood film production, and that's Red's bread and butter. Read the press release from the Wall Street Journal No wonder Jannard came out with some fighting words. Although I'm still not sold on the idea that Canon would be making a motion picture camera to compete with the likes of the Red or the Alexa.

Read the story again and see what you think.
http://online.wsj.com/article/PR-CO-20111012-906716.html
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You'd think RED would be far more worried about Alexa - it's a known, already existing camera, that by most accounts I've read is being used for the majority of productions in LA...

Of course if you're right Barry, then this camera will be something Alex-like, both in ability and pricing.
 
jdv said:
You'd think RED would be far more worried about Alexa - it's a known, already existing camera
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For now, at least, they have two major things going for them... resolution and size (Epic). 3D productions with CGI crave both.

I think the F65 and (the rumoured) Alexa 4K will bite into their share though.

Will Canon dare step into such a fight? I doubt it.... But you never know. I wonder if they are seeing all this buzz around digital cinema and have something non-camera related to bring to Hollywood. Lenses being the obvious.
 
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