SHORT: Ruins Ignite - Fantasy / Adventure - Introduction and First day of shooting

[tommetass]

I think I have to start at the beginning.
17 years ago I had a silly plan to make a lightsaber fight video with two friends of mine. Well, this never really amounted to anything other than this practice session here:

I moved away from my local city to study, and my friends had busy lives. Next thing you know, I married, had kids, and work was overwhelming. I tried to keep up my videography journey/hobby and made whatever I felt like, really. But I always looked back at that video and thought: "What if?" - "Some day" - "Wouldn't it be fun?".

Cut to March, this year. After almost a 2 year break from making videos at all.. My wife encouraged me to make a lightsaber video with my son. I though.. why not?

We had some fun and shot this little thing in a hour and a half:

Well.. That kickstarted something in me. (So I have my wife to thank for all this..)
The first thing I thought about after that video with my son was: "Should I call my friends again and ask if they would be up for another try at this silly lightsaber project?"
I called. They answered. And to my surprise, they were eager to try again(!).

I thought, ok, this time I'm going to put some time and effort into it. I don't want to half ass it. We have no sponsors or real budget, so everything we buy is from our own pockets (mostly my own).

For the technical parts: I will shoot it on a Panasonic Lumix S5, and try to only use the Blazar Remus 45mm Anamorphic lens.
I will use the Dehancer plugin in Adobe Premiere to color grade it to try to achieve a filmic-look.
Lighting wise, it will mostly be daylight and interior existing interior lighting. I will definitely throw out the Godox Sl60W with a diffuser inside if I need it.
No sound.. But as there is no dialogue, we will only need sound effects.. This will be a challenge I think.

Anyway.. I wanted to give the fight some backstory. I contacted a few other creative friends and we brainstormed and came up with a short and simple story to at least give the characters some motivation as to why they are fighting.

For the backstory (or introduction of the characters and their motivation). We went to trope-land: And adventurer and a priest. This priestly order is hiding a secret from mankind. The adventurer is looking for this secret. The secret is a lightsaber. The adventurer gets a hold of one, but is then chased by the priest on the top of Slottsfjellet and an "epic fight ensues".

Based on this I made a (pardon the french) shitty storyboard, but good enough.



I'm also lucky that I know a person who has made some props for a Wes Anderson movie. I got in touch with her and she was also eager to help. She made these props:






We went on a location hunt for the fight itself, and we decided early on that we wanted to have the fight on an iconic place in Tønsberg, a hill called "Slottsfjellet". This is a place that has great historic value in our city and it once had a large fortress. Now there's only ruins left (hence the title of the short).

I spent quite a bit of time location hunting for the introduction sequence. We had originally planned for it to be a museum or art gallery, where the priest takes this secret and hides it, or places it on an exhibition.
This turned out to be a challenge in terms of copyright laws.
But.. the public library is.. well, public. We contacted Tønsberg Public Library, and they were very welcoming, and just said as long as we don't film any other people, we could use it.

Yesteday we had our first day of shooting.





I can also show you a rough cut of yesterdays filming:

 

[NorBro]

Keep up the work and creativity and don't get discouraged if no one comments; filmmaking, especially short films, is truly dead besides by the 1% with large audiences.

One of my biggest pet peeves in film production is unstable dolly shots; completely, absolutely rip me out of the film if it's not good, so just a thought (and I know they are hard).

Actually also why I quit using a glidecam 15 years ago (just could never hide the footstep shakes and was too aggravating to look at).

 

[Alex H.]

One of my biggest pet peeves in film production is unstable dolly shots; completely, absolutely rip me out of the film if it's not good, so just a thought (and I know they are hard).

Looks less like a dolly and more like floating handheld. @tommetass Was that straight handheld, or was there an EasyRig in there?

Thanks for starting the production diary, Tomas! Looking forward to seeing this project shape up.

 

[NorBro]

Looks less like a dolly and more like floating handheld. @tommetass Was that straight handheld, or was there an EasyRig in there?

Thanks for starting the production diary, Tomas! Looking forward to seeing this project shape up.

Using the term loosely in the context of filmmaking (that's the word he used in this thread on the picture). It's definitely a floating handheld or poor gimbal, no one's setting up tracks anymore, lol.

 

[tommetass]

The first shot is just the camera on the tripod to add weight, me backing up and being supported by a friend in the back.

I dont have a good enough gimbal to make the shot more clean, and dont have a dolly.

But.. I could definitely try to take this shot again.. I have a longboard I could possibly use.

Here are more clips from the second day of shooting. And some more editing and added a couple sound effects. Sorry for the long black intro.

 

[CharlesPapert]

You are getting some nice stylish images!

The note I'd give is that the edit feels slow and full of "shoe leather" and while it has plenty of opportunity to tighten up (a feature action film editor would likely cut this down to 1/2 to 1/3 of its current length), it's important to keep those options in mind while shooting. You have a certain amount of "we start on this, then slowly move to this" beats that will make it harder to trim. The gent hiding behind the library stacks for instance--taking the time to tilt from his face down to the paper is OK the first time, but you don't want to repeat the move in reverse a couple of shots later as it feels glacial and doesn't introduce any new information. I would have pitched getting a tight closeup on him (easy enough to get, just push in the camera a few feet) and run through all the beats in that closeup--intercutting that setup would help to pace up the scene to a modern audience's expectation. But without that, you've sort of locked yourself into those slow moves and extended shots.

 

[tommetass]

You are getting some nice stylish images!

The note I'd give is that the edit feels slow and full of "shoe leather" and while it has plenty of opportunity to tighten up (a feature action film editor would likely cut this down to 1/2 to 1/3 of its current length), it's important to keep those options in mind while shooting. You have a certain amount of "we start on this, then slowly move to this" beats that will make it harder to trim. The gent hiding behind the library stacks for instance--taking the time to tilt from his face down to the paper is OK the first time, but you don't want to repeat the move in reverse a couple of shots later as it feels glacial and doesn't introduce any new information. I would have pitched getting a tight closeup on him (easy enough to get, just push in the camera a few feet) and run through all the beats in that closeup--intercutting that setup would help to pace up the scene to a modern audience's expectation. But without that, you've sort of locked yourself into those slow moves and extended shots.

Appreciate it! I agree that it could have been broken up a bit more. It was storyboarded with more cuts and angles, but we were running out of time and had to try to do the scene in one take.

 

[CharlesPapert]

Appreciate it! I agree that it could have been broken up a bit more. It was storyboarded with more cuts and angles, but we were running out of time and had to try to do the scene in one take.

Time constraints are never fun, but they are present across so many levels of production. We have so many "tricks" to sneak in extra setups even on network TV shows--calling an audible in the middle of a shot i.e. "hold!--pick it up from this spot--and go" Much as zooms are looked down on for scripted, this is where they can come in handy--punch in at a moments notice. The question becomes whether having more pieces of coverage and/or more takes is worth the tradeoff in look. Opinions differ.

 

[tommetass]

Time constraints are never fun, but they are present across so many levels of production. We have so many "tricks" to sneak in extra setups even on network TV shows--calling an audible in the middle of a shot i.e. "hold!--pick it up from this spot--and go" Much as zooms are looked down on for scripted, this is where they can come in handy--punch in at a moments notice. The question becomes whether having more pieces of coverage and/or more takes is worth the tradeoff in look. Opinions differ.

We actually were a little happy with how the shot, with the actors, ended up. The priest even looks back at the exact moment the adventurer hid is face again.


I might be able to edit it a bit tighter though. So I really appreciate the feedback!

 

[morgan_moore]

Its good fun. You had some story about conceiving this a decade ago?

I think you need to shoot and edit more often.

In the edit there is 'a thing' which is 'continuity' vs 'time steps forward' it seems that the cuts imply 'continuity' but the camera placement shows 'time has stepped forward' which is a little 'off'

There is a subtle art of connecting .. or not . . the camera moves and positions.

The first shot (chest with logo) is too tight, and not connected at all to the location .. for example
He is walking donwn near the windows and the magically flips to being in the room centre.. for example

Play more. Maybe try a 30s edit.. and also maybe a longer one.

I think the music is too 'big' - edit without music is a nice thing to develop the skills.

 

[morgan_moore]

yes tp 'jump' across the location might mean for the character to exit frame. (or not)

Currently..
walking with the box by the window
jumps to
walking with the box in the middle of a different room.

Should be
walking with the box by the window.. exits frame left
smooth transition to
enters frame right and walks down room centre.

 

[CharlesPapert]

We actually were a little happy with how the shot, with the actors, ended up. The priest even looks back at the exact moment the adventurer hid is face again.


I might be able to edit it a bit tighter though. So I really appreciate the feedback!

That did work out! For these kinds of shots, when shot static you have the possibility of "slipping" one side so that you can fix any errors in timing--in this instance it worked out, but when under the gun as you were it can help the possibility of not having to do multiple takes.You just do a simple split screen and adjust the timing of the two clips.

On the tighter edit--I'd challenge you to cut it down in half. There's just so much business with the box, it doesn't gain more import/weight if you hold on it longer--it's kind of the opposite. Even if you don't agree, it's a good exercise!

 

[tommetass]

Thanks! I'll try to kill my darlings as they say and make a shorter edit.

I can also agree with that the chain shot is a little disconnected because it is too close up.

 

[CharlesPapert]

I can also agree with that the chain shot is a little disconnected because it is too close up.

I promise I'll stop armchair quarterbacking after this!

I don't actually have that much of an issue with that shot in terms of how tight it is, but had it been not dead-centered and instead just a little raked it would have included more of the background to give it some sense of place (and not be nearly all torso).

I also slightly disagree with @morgan_moore on the fix for the time jumps--I think you just eliminate the first of those two tracking from behind shots entirely (or move it earlier, between the feet or hands carrying box shot). I'd cut from :27 to :36. Especially when more quickly cut, the geography becomes less noticeable. And as far as having him leave one shot and enter another, the only real reason to do that is streamline the flow of a cut to avoid a jump, not needed to indicate "he was here and now, later, he's here". Again--shoe leather, and the audience is now used to seeing radical jumps in time and space.

Final thought on the closeup on the pendant. Understood that the point of it is to tie in with the drawing. This is conjecture now since it's after the shoot, but another way to tell this story could have been to jump ahead in the scene to where the adventurer looks down at the diagram, then cut to a tight raking shot across the pendantwith the priest's hands bringing the box down in the background (possibly racking focus to it). That would help lock the connection in for the audience while keeping the action flowing.

 

[morgan_moore]

My 'issue' is the 'vibe' of the scene and the editorial sense (intelligence) needed to make it 'hang' together better. Geographically and temporally.

No specific suggestion of mine is right/wrong good/bad.

I think that a couple more options would be presented to the editor by..

-shooting characters the leaving frame

-presenting connection where possible. (eg chest of man to the location)

-sound design telling us about the location being the same place.. or not.

I did a shoot recently (doco) and found that a few pan downs the subject made for many cut point options

 

[morgan_moore]

Rewatching again 'connection' is worth thinking about.

(A) carries the box

My understanding of the story is that the second character (B) understands that (A) had the correct Macguiver due to the logo on his shirt/the box. matching the paper he (B) holds.

We do not see this connection being made..... B scoping A

That would be an OTS or shot from the POV of (B) looking at the shirt/box of (A)

 

[CharlesPapert]

I did a shoot recently (doco) and found that a few pan downs the subject made for many cut point options

Yes, as long as the classic guidance is observed: hold for a few beats at the beginning and end of the move, giving the editor the option to use either section as a static, or include the move. The mistake so many newer shooters make is moving the camera continuously, which limits options in the edit. One only has to edit one's own footage a few times to see why this is crucial.

(separately--PAN DOWN? oh dear)

 

[morgan_moore]

(separately--PAN DOWN? oh dear)

Its my standard lingo now. 'pan up' 'pan down' - double irony X

 

[tommetass]

Appreciate the discussion here! And sorry for the short responses. Just insanely busy atm.
Working a full time job, wife and kids, and also trying to work on three different video projects in parallell

 

[tommetass]

I tried a somewhat tighter cut now. And I decided to edit it in a 2560*1440 timeline, so that I could zoom in without too much of a drop in quality.
I only managed to chip off around 25 seconds.. but hey.. It feels a little bit better at least..

I also did a slightly more teal and orange color grade.