Render GH2 in Vegas

R

Russiana007

Active member
I like to keep same exact 24p files in my GH2 Vegas, I don't want big uncompressed file, I want to keep same like the GH2 record. But I couldn't figure out what settings for rendering so will just keep all native AVCHD native. any friends know which setting to put in Vegas?
 
AVCHD is not a good format for editing. It's fine for image acquisition or for playback, but for editing files you really want a high color-space ( 4:2:2 or better ) low compression format.

I use the Cineform Neo Scene CODEC for all my Vegas Pro intermediate editing files.

VideoGuys.com : CineForm Neo Scene $99.95
 
No, I like native AVCHD, its works perfect in my computer. I don't like Cinform because expensive and extra steps. I like to know if I can set Vegas render setting to maintain native format. Cinform won't make you 4-2-2. Native please?
 
Russiana007 said:
No, I like native AVCHD, its works perfect in my computer. I don't like Cinform because expensive and extra steps. I like to know if I can set Vegas render setting to maintain native format. Cinform won't make you 4-2-2. Native please?
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1- AVCHD utilizes a very high degree of compression which is partly achieved by throwing away some data, thus the video image quality degenerates with each new generation from the original AVCHD video.

2- It takes a lot of processing power to decompress AVCHD video streams, this often means that real-time previews of layered video clips aren't always possible.

The Cineform CODEC is a 10-bit 4:2:2 format designed to retain image quality with each new generation, thus you can make dozens of generations and still have a great looking image.

The Cineform CODEC is also low compression ( bigger files ), thus you can have many layered video streams playing back in real-time previews within your editor.

When you manipulate and composite AVCHD 8-bit 4:2:0 video streams in 32-bit color space ( which most professional NLEs do, including Vegas Pro ), your finished result might no longer fit within the limitations of AVCHD 8-bit 4:2:0 color space, so you will degrade your editing work by storing it back in the AVCHD format. The Cineform 10-bit 4:2:2 format is a much better idea.

I don't know of any NLE that will actually edit AVCHD footage while retaining the native AVCHD file format. You could simply keep a copy of your original acquisition AVCHD files and your Vegas project files, which would retain everything in the original AVCHD video files, as long as you don't work from any rendered AVCHD files. ( creating new editing production files in AVCHD format is a bad idea for the reasons I listed above )
 
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Russiana007 said:
I don't have a money for the Cineform. What's 2nd best choice from inside Vegas 10?
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Three Options:

1- Render as uncompressed : Files are huge but all original data is retained ( I only use this for quick and dirty fixes )

2- Sony MXF HD422 : Files are saved as 8-bit 4:2:2 format. They are two times bigger than AVCHD 24 Mbit format, but fast to load and process. ( this is a pretty good solution )

3- Free Avid QuickTime Codecs LE 2.3.2 : Files can be saved in a variety of formats including 1080P 10-bit 4:2:2 at 220 Mbit. The files are up to nine times bigger than AVCHD. The format is pretty slow to render. Great quality when you need it.

Avid QuickTime Codecs LE 2.3.2 Download

The Cineform CODEC has the quality of the AVID DNxHD CODEC, but is much much faster to work with.
 
TheDingo I think all he's asking for is "what's the best setting to use in Sony Vegas if one chooses to go native?"
  • Russiana007 try this:
In the "Project Properties" just set the "field order" to "None (progressive scan) -- your "Pixel Aspect Ratio" to 1.000 (Square) -- your frame rate to 23.976 (IVTC Film) --- and Choose your "Pixel Format" as 32 bit floating point (video levels) OR 32-bit floating point (full range). <<< If you choose 32-bit floating point (full range) you have the option to choose either 1.000 (linear) or 2.222 (video) under the "Compositing gamma" field. Me personally....I like to use the 2.222 (video)

One more thing....when you get your clip on the timeline just make sure you "right click" every clip and choose "Switches" and then "Disable Resample." You should be set to work from here.
 
Ian-T said:
TheDingo I think all he's asking for is "what's the best setting to use in Sony Vegasif one chooses to go native?"
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All three solutions are "native" to Sony Vegas Pro.

The free AVID CODEC has to be downloaded and installed, but once installed you can access it when rendering from Sony Vegas.

To use the AVID DNxHD CODEC from within Vegas, simply do the following steps:

1- Choose File ---> Render as usual
2- Choose QuickTime 7 as the type of file you want to render.
3- Choose the AVID DNxHD 1080P template from the list of formats
4- Choose CUSTOM to open up the AVID DNxHD controls
5- Chose the Video Format "Configure" button to select from a couple of dozen AVID DNxHD presets.
6- Render your file to disk as normal.

The same process is used for the Sony MXF HD422 format, but you choose Sony MXF as the file type instead of QuickTime 7.
 
Does Sony Mxf play in quicktime or wmp? Seem like only will play in Vegas timeline.
Avid will play smooth in timeline?
 
Russiana007 said:
Does Sony Mxf play in quicktime or wmp? Seem like only will play in Vegas timeline. Avid will play smooth in timeline?
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The three formats I listed previously ( Uncompressed, Sony MXF, AVID DNxHD ) are "editing" formats that are designed for editing production work, and are NOT meant for delivery.

AVCHD is a great format for acquisition ( filming ) and for delivery ( playback ), but is a lousy format to store production editing work.

Yes, AVID DNxHD will play smoothly if you have good hard drive speed. Many laptops have poor internal drive speed due to power-saving features. ( switch to solid-state or to external hard-drives for better speed )
 
I like the Sony MXF because files not huge! But it only play on timeline, not with Media Player or Quicktime! That's crazy!
 
Russiana007 said:
I like the Sony MXF because files not huge! But it only play on timeline, not with Media Player or Quicktime! That's crazy!
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You have to understand the difference between an "editing" CODEC ( which is designed to retain the most data from your edit, and will usually keep it's quality over many generations ), and a "delivery" ( playback ) CODEC which is designed to play video smoothly with minimal file size and minimal playback hardware.
 
Thanks for sharing TheDingo!
Let say I converted all my videos from avchd to cineform format.
What is the best setting I need to choose in Vegas If I want high quality videos to be uploaded for vimeo?
 
cam123 said:
Let say I converted all my videos from avchd to cineform format.
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Remember, the Cineform CODEC is for editing, when it comes time to upload to a video web service like Vimeo, you will have to export to the format recommended by the service.

I am not an expert on uploading to Vimeo, but most services usually recommend 720p or 1080p ( requires a Vimeo Plus account for 1080p ) formats exported as Mpeg-4 ( AVC ) files.

With Vegas Pro you have the option of using the Main-Concept AVC format or the Sony AVC format. I haven't done a comparison, but I have heard that the Sony AVC format produces better looking files. I would try using both and pick the one that looks better to you.

Here are two tutorials on exporting video from Vegas to Vimeo:

Sony Vegas 9 Render Tutorial

Exporting for Upload to Vimeo with Sony Vegas 10
 
I have previously been editing AVCHD in vegas from an HMC40.

Are you guys saying here that you bring the footage into vegas as AVCHD, render to DnxHD and then bring it back in to further edit? Does this reduce the quality?
 
Heartfelt said:
Are you guys saying here that you bring the footage into vegas as AVCHD, render to DnxHD and then bring it back in to further edit? Does this reduce the quality?
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Yes. There is no real quality loss when you export with the AVID DNxHD or Cineform CODECs, both of these will hold up extremely well after many generations.

These CODECs are also useful when you want to archive the finished video in a high quality format.

Also, these CODECs are cross-platform between Mac and PC editors, so you can export a video from Sony Vegas, which can then be opened in Final Cut Pro without having to import into FCP's Pro Res format.
( I've used this to share project work with Final Cut Pro editors )
 
Heartfelt said:
I have previously been editing AVCHD in vegas from an HMC40.

Are you guys saying here that you bring the footage into vegas as AVCHD, render to DnxHD and then bring it back in to further edit? Does this reduce the quality?
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Yes. I wanted to keep it native avdhd, but I guess better make cnform first.
 
I might also suggest 5DtoRGB for your intermediate, in the current versions of Vegas cineform is very error prone. It's free and corrects a few problems with the GH cameras.
 
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