GH4 Recording school play - my unorthodox solution

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SystemAgnostic

Member
So I recorded a school play last month, and used the tools I had: a Panasonic LX100 shot wide in 4k, which I could crop and zoom in editing, and then either a Canon 70d with a 50-150 2.8 lens, or a Sony small chip camcorder. I recorded audio into a Tascam 4 channel recorder. Setting exposure was the biggest challenge, but on the LX100 zebras and a histogram made it not too bad. On the Canon DSLR and the camcorder, I had no such assistance and I sometimes misjudged couldn't use footage. (Afterwards I installed Magic Lantern on the 70d, which would have been a big help.) Lighting wasn't consistent even within a single scene, so when I changed exposure during the scene - all cameras displayed noticeable "steps" as the ISO or aperture changed. Also, none of the cameras did well in the dark scenes - the LX100 was best, with the camcorder being clearly the worst. Overall, I was happy with the LX100 performance, and disappointed with the other two.

So I'm on a quest for better equipment for next year. I'll definitely use the LX100 as the wide shot. I considered lots of options as a tight camera, including a professional level camcorder so I can use the iris to smoothly adjust exposure. But any professional camcorder will be pretty pricy. So I like this idea the best:
A Panasonic G7
A generic speedbooster (Mitakon Zhongyi) - change the focal length by .72 and give an extra stop of light
A 85mm 1.5 cine lens. Yes a prime!
The total cost will be under $1000 as long as I wait until the G7 is on sale.

My focal length will be about: 85 * .72 * 2.1 = 130mm equivalent. Since I mostly shot the LX100 at 56mm equivalent, having the tight camera starting at 130mm is just about perfect I think. From my position, 130mm is just about 12 people standing side by side. I found that in the really wide scenes I wanted to be at maybe 100mm (with cropping, the LX100 covers that), but on a scene with a smaller group I wanted to be considerably tighter. 240mm is about as tight as I'd want to get to have full height of a person - and about 6 people wide. So if I want to crop to 1:1 pixel I'd be at 260mm.

Most exciting: On my LX100, at 2.8 aperture I went as high as iso 1250. With this combination, the lens is about a 1.1, so I should I should be able to run the G7 at iso 200 the entire time. I think that will be stellar.

Any thoughts on this setup? I'm sure I can do better if I spend more, but I think this is my best choice for spending $1000. Note also that this is for fun, and to record my daughter and share - not to sell.
 
I think the G7 is a fine choice, but I would question the lens choice for this sort of filming. I think you might do better with a native zoom.
 
I personally would never shoot a theatre style production without a zoom. You end up cropping in post, and lose the extra quality you gain with careful kit selection. I'm old fashioned and still use conventional video cameras, decent tripods and heads, and DSLR with expensive add ons just can't cope that well.
 
joe12south said:
I think the G7 is a fine choice, but I would question the lens choice for this sort of filming. I think you might do better with a native zoom.
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Yeah, my inclination was to get a zoom. The 35-100 2.8 would be a good choice. Then I wouldn't have to crop, or crop much, from the 4k image. BUT, I'd lose about 3 stops of light, and I'd lose the ability to smoothly adjust the aperture/iris while recording. So I am thinking those two advantages make up for needing to crop. Or I could just use my Canon mount Sigma 50-150 on the G7 with the speed booster - I'd gain back one stop of light, have a similar focal length, but lose any ability to adjust iris/aperture. I think that would be a no-go because of occasional very bright scenes when I need to stop down the aperture.

Hence I'm inclined to think the 85 cine lens may be a good, but unexpected fit.
 
paulears said:
I personally would never shoot a theatre style production without a zoom. You end up cropping in post, and lose the extra quality you gain with careful kit selection. I'm old fashioned and still use conventional video cameras, decent tripods and heads, and DSLR with expensive add ons just can't cope that well.
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Hi Paul, I think you posted in my first thread where I learned that I needed a stepless iris to control light seamlessly.

If I had a larger budget, I'm sure you are right. But if I want to limit myself to about $1000, I'm stuck with a consumer camcorder which won't (based on my research so far) have stepless iris (Sony cx900 or ax100 if I stretch, or a smaller sensor Canon/Panasonic) or perhaps find an older professional model with a small sensor. When at low iso, the cropped LX100 footage looks better than my small sensor Sony camcorder or my 70d. I'm inclined to think that in a dark scene, the G7 with a 1.1 lens and low iso will beat almost anything else which would be at a higher iso/gain (unless my budget when up by a few thousand).

I also gotta admit, I like the idea of not needing to be as skilled in my zooming, panning and shot positioning. For example at one point, the actors are standing together and then suddenly dance apart. I was zoomed in too far, so had to jerk back to catch them. By cropping / panning with 4k to do the fine tuning I wont make as many mistakes, and I think the outcome may be just better. Of course, there may be times when they are wider than 130mm equivalent would catch - but for that I have the wide camera.

Oh, and lastly - I also film dance performances. I really want 4k for the reason described above. In dance they are always quickly moving and forming groups and splitting up. Filming dance is just stress - I can't enjoy the performance. With 4k, I record the stage and worry about it in editing. If I were to get a second 4k camera - I'd have my LX100 from one location and slightly wider, and this second camera would be a bit narrower and from a different location. For dance I don't necessarily need a second camera, but I'd use it if I had it.
 
It would also serve best to be mindful of the record limitation of the G7. You would need an external recorder to overcome the record limitation.
 
SystemAgnostic said:
Hi Paul, I think you posted in my first thread where I learned that I needed a stepless iris to control light seamlessly.

If I had a larger budget, I'm sure you are right. But if I want to limit myself to about $1000, I'm stuck with a consumer camcorder which won't (based on my research so far) have stepless iris (Sony cx900 or ax100 if I stretch, or a smaller sensor Canon/Panasonic) or perhaps find an older professional model with a small sensor. When at low iso, the cropped LX100 footage looks better than my small sensor Sony camcorder or my 70d. I'm inclined to think that in a dark scene, the G7 with a 1.1 lens and low iso will beat almost anything else which would be at a higher iso/gain (unless my budget when up by a few thousand).

I also gotta admit, I like the idea of not needing to be as skilled in my zooming, panning and shot positioning. For example at one point, the actors are standing together and then suddenly dance apart. I was zoomed in too far, so had to jerk back to catch them. By cropping / panning with 4k to do the fine tuning I wont make as many mistakes, and I think the outcome may be just better. Of course, there may be times when they are wider than 130mm equivalent would catch - but for that I have the wide camera.

Oh, and lastly - I also film dance performances. I really want 4k for the reason described above. In dance they are always quickly moving and forming groups and splitting up. Filming dance is just stress - I can't enjoy the performance. With 4k, I record the stage and worry about it in editing. If I were to get a second 4k camera - I'd have my LX100 from one location and slightly wider, and this second camera would be a bit narrower and from a different location. For dance I don't necessarily need a second camera, but I'd use it if I had it.
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For dance I think you would need UHD60P to get the smooth motion and none of those small 4K cameras do that only 30P. At least that is my opinion and why I use a FDR-AX1 in UHD60P for a full stage camera.
 
video652 said:
It would also serve best to be mindful of the record limitation of the G7. You would need an external recorder to overcome the record limitation.
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Yes. The LX100 is limited to 15 minutes, so I had to stop and start recording for each scene. I think only one scene was over 15 minutes, so I needed a second camera running to bridge the gap. It would be nice to record all in one go - it would make editing easier because I'd have less work to line up audio and video. But basically, a 30 minute limit is just an inconvenience.
 
Ron Evans said:
For dance I think you would need UHD60P to get the smooth motion and none of those small 4K cameras do that only 30P. At least that is my opinion and why I use a FDR-AX1 in UHD60P for a full stage camera.
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Ah-ha. I have never recorded in 60p. I should look into this. I guess for now I'll have to choose between 4k at 30p or 1080p at 60p. This may be a good excuse to splurge on the GH5 when it comes out since it may have 4k at 60p. I don't think I'll want to spend the money though.
 
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SystemAgnostic said:
Or I could just use my Canon mount Sigma 50-150 on the G7 with the speed booster - I'd gain back one stop of light, have a similar focal length, but lose any ability to adjust iris/aperture. I think that would be a no-go because of occasional very bright scenes when I need to stop down the aperture.

Hence I'm inclined to think the 85 cine lens may be a good, but unexpected fit.
Click to expand...

For that kind of shot I use my G7 with a Nikon-mount 50-150mm Sigma and Speedbooster - happy with the result, and that combination does provide seamless aperture control.
 
Thanks for the folks who mentioned the G7 at Personal View which can record unlimited. I'll consider it.


GrahamH said:
For that kind of shot I use my G7 with a Nikon-mount 50-150mm Sigma and Speedbooster - happy with the result, and that combination does provide seamless aperture control.
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Yes - I read about that for Nikon mount. I guess the aperture control on the speedbooster controls the aperture right on the lens. Pretty cool. Since I still like Canon for photography I wont get a Nikon mount lens... but that is a nice advantage.
 
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