GH2 preamp (beachtek) vs dual (tascam)

N

neko30

Well-known member
hi all,

i've been researching this topic and haven't really found a clear answer...

was wondering if audio directly into camera is improved with hack, why bother with separate recorder?
why not just use decent preamp, like beachtek, go directly into camera and not have to deal with dual system/synching/etc...

i guess i'm trying to figure out if slightly better audio off of dual system is worth the hassle.
 
Audio in to the camera is NOT improved with the hack, but the stock camera has very good audio to start with.

The key is to use a passive audio adapter ( i.e. BeachTek with NO pre-amp circuitry: DXA-2s or DXA-2t ) and feed the camera a strong audio signal from a good field mixer ( Sound Devices MixPre ) or a good digital recorder ( Tascam DR-100 MKII or Olympus LS-100 ). The field mixer or digital recorder will give you the ability to monitor the audio with headphones, and to have a 2nd higher quality audio recording as a back-up.

Audio Recorded Directly in to my GH-2 using a Sennheiser Hand-held UHF Mic
 
to TheDingo. I'm wondering how you record directly to the GH2 with the Sennheiser Handheld UHF Mic?

Because I tried using an Azden wireless mic system...but the mic input would not fit into the GH2 mic slot.
 
"was wondering if audio directly into camera is improved with hack, why bother with separate recorder?"

Because now you and the audio guy are tethered together making it harder to keep him out of frame, causing his cord to get in the way of your camera operation, making it impossible for him to tweak his settings while you're rolling, etc... etc... etc....
 
Will Turner said:
Can you not up the sample rate of the in camera audio with the hack, like on the GH1?
Click to expand...

Audio needs to be as clean as it can be, trying to have the onboard audio from the camera as your only sound source is not a great idea. Regardless of having the bad preamp that the cam does even with any amount of codec adjustment you may make to it, it's really a hardware issue. Also, think about how many times the sound of your movements, camera adjustments, breathing etc are captured on your camera? A lot. This is why you'd want to have a seperate mic imput into the cam in the first place. It makes it so that you can get not only cleaner audio by having the mic removed from the body (however far that may be, many people have rigs where the mic is mounted for eng style work and the shot gun is mounted right next to or on the camera which works but not all the time. You could also use a wireless lav plugged into the cam through the BeachTek) and the noise floor reduced by having a cleaner signal than the cam has the hardware to produce.To the OP, I'd go tascam all the way, at the very least it will give you a second audio source in case something goes wrong with the cam. It might serve you to invest a bit and grab both as well as a mixer/preamp so you can record to both the cam and the Tascam for safety. Just my 2 cents.
 
Will Turner said:
Can you not up the sample rate of the in camera audio with the hack, like on the GH1?
Click to expand...

Yes you can, but the camera will not playback any video clips that are not recorded at the default 192 KB/sec setting.

From my own tests, I see NO audio improvement when raising the GH2 audio bit-rate.

As I stated earlier on, the standard GH2 audio is quite good, but if you want better audio then you should be using a good digital recorder as a higher quality back-up to the GH2 audio.

A good field mixer ( i.e. Sound Devices MixPre ) can feed audio to both a digital recorder and to the GH2 simultaneously.
 
While there are several good reasons, the primary reason for using an external recorder is to be able to monitor the audio.

Syncing dual-system sound in post is a pain (though mitigated somewhat by software), however, when you are using an external mic to record audio on the GH2, there are several potential points of failure:
  • Mic input on GH2
  • 2.5mm adapter
  • XLR adapter (preamp, recorder, etc.) output
  • Mic output

The audio signal can fail at any one (or more) of these points and if you can't monitor the actual audio being recorded, there's no good way to tell if the audio you're recording on the camera is clean.

For example:
I use a Sony UWP-V1 wireless lav and the receiver has a headphone port in addition to the standard audio out port (that is plugged into the camera). This is great because I can monitor the audio being received. However, there is still an issue because the audio signal continues on to another device (the camera). If a cable/port is malfunctioning somewhere between the receiver and the camera, there will be no way for me to know this until I review the footage.

The bottom line

If you want to ensure that your audio is clean, then you need to be able to monitor the audio on the device that is doing the recording. As the GH2 does not have a headphone jack, you need to have another recording device in the signal chain that you can monitor (e.g. Tascam DR100). IMHO, simply a preamp/mixer run directly into the camera is not adequate because monitoring on the mixer won't give you any idea of the audio actually being recorded.

Having control over levels with a mixer/recorder is a nice bonus, but having to rig up a recorder just to monitor sound is not ideal for mobility. That's why the headphone jack on the Nikon D800 and Canon 5DMK3 are nice and I sure hope the GH3 gets one as well (as well as more precise control over audio levels).
 
hey jive...thanks for the clear/concise answer.

seems like the tascam is worth it, even if it's just for monitoring.
 
Jive said:
While there are several good reasons, the primary reason for using an external recorder is to be able to monitor the audio.

Syncing dual-system sound in post is a pain (though mitigated somewhat by software), however, when you are using an external mic to record audio on the GH2, there are several potential points of failure:
  • Mic input on GH2
  • 2.5mm adapter
  • XLR adapter (preamp, recorder, etc.) output
  • Mic output

The audio signal can fail at any one (or more) of these points and if you can't monitor the actual audio being recorded, there's no good way to tell if the audio you're recording on the camera is clean.

For example:
I use a Sony UWP-V1 wireless lav and the receiver has a headphone port in addition to the standard audio out port (that is plugged into the camera). This is great because I can monitor the audio being received. However, there is still an issue because the audio signal continues on to another device (the camera). If a cable/port is malfunctioning somewhere between the receiver and the camera, there will be no way for me to know this until I review the footage.

The bottom line

If you want to ensure that your audio is clean, then you need to be able to monitor the audio on the device that is doing the recording. As the GH2 does not have a headphone jack, you need to have another recording device in the signal chain that you can monitor (e.g. Tascam DR100). IMHO, simply a preamp/mixer run directly into the camera is not adequate because monitoring on the mixer won't give you any idea of the audio actually being recorded.

Having control over levels with a mixer/recorder is a nice bonus, but having to rig up a recorder just to monitor sound is not ideal for mobility. That's why the headphone jack on the Nikon D800 and Canon 5DMK3 are nice and I sure hope the GH3 gets one as well (as well as more precise control over audio levels).
Click to expand...

If you can use use the headphone jack on the UWP Receiver can't you also check the on-screen levels of the GH2 to check if it is indeed reaching the camera?
Between those two it seems like a no-brainer to me, at least on the faster less important jobs.
 
Boncrek - Sadly, static or hum introduced by a bad cable sometimes looks like a good audio signal on an on-screen monitor. I speak from bitter experience on this. My little consumer camcorder (smaller body than the GH2) has a headphone jack. Panasonic really needs to come through with a headphone jack on the GH3.

Cheers,

Bill
 
brunerww said:
Boncrek - Sadly, static or hum introduced by a bad cable sometimes looks like a good audio signal on an on-screen monitor. I speak from bitter experience on this. My little consumer camcorder (smaller body than the GH2) has a headphone jack. Panasonic really needs to come through with a headphone jack on the GH3.

Cheers,

Bill
Click to expand...

So you got static when using the UWP with the GH2? Man that sucks...
I was hoping that could be a work around to the problem of no headphone jack...
 
brunerww said:
Boncrek - Sadly, static or hum introduced by a bad cable sometimes looks like a good audio signal on an on-screen monitor. I speak from bitter experience on this. My little consumer camcorder (smaller body than the GH2) has a headphone jack. Panasonic really needs to come through with a headphone jack on the GH3.

Cheers,

Bill
Click to expand...

Exactly.

Audio meters tell you that something is getting to the camera, but not the state or quality of the audio.

One of the reasons I went for the Sony wireless mic system is because the receiver had a headphone jack for monitoring. However, my stance on having something to monitor audio being recorded comes from first-hand experience. A finicky 2.5mm adapter showed levels coming through to the camera, but there was so much static that the audio was unusable. Thankfully this happened during prep and I noticed some jumpiness of the meters on the GH2 so I was able to swap out the adapter before shooting.
 
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