Pmw F5 & F55

[fisherman1]

Orly?

Matt, do you see any zoom rocker on the left side of the camera module (like the F3) ? Ths picture you had attached is a shoulder mount / ENG styled camera configuration. I hoped Sony upgrade F3 to F5 will a zoom rocker on the camera module, too (which is better if you use the camera handheld or on tripod)

 

[Steve R]

It's quite straightforward to become a beta tester, just become best friends with an award winning DP who has shot extensively on Sony cameras. Fortunately, I know a guy ...

We're going to start testing today and we'll shoot something over the next week or so. We won't be able to release any footage in the interim unfortunately. The cam still has early firmware so we'll be limited in terms of features and frame rates but I'll try and keep people posted.

We're not planning to do a million tests, just work out how to expose it properly and have a look at the raw workflow. Then we'll go out and use it in anger. Looking forward to it.

Martin-> I know you can't post footage - but does anything forbid you from giving us your detailed impressions of the footage you shoot?

 

[Scanners286]

Not really, although I would stress that this is alpha/prototype stuff so we'll be very much bearing that in mind. Don't expect a full camera review, I'm sure they'll come in due course and there are people much better equipped than me to do that. Also, we are doing this for Sony so don't expect complete impartiality ...

 

[bruceallen]

Not really, although I would stress that this is alpha/prototype stuff so we'll be very much bearing that in mind. Don't expect a full camera review, I'm sure they'll come in due course and there are people much better equipped than me to do that. Also, we are doing this for Sony so don't expect complete impartiality ...

Awesome! Well, just tell us about your pleasant surprises, then

My main question would be what exactly their 2K RAW is. It's supposedly derived from the full sensor and already sounds like it's a LOT better than just a 2K center crop.

The most logical way I can think of is something akin to the way the C300 works to make its 1080p from the original 4K sensor.

For every 4 pixels in a Bayer sensor, you have one R and one B and two G pixels.

...so to make "2K RAW" from a 4K RAW sensor, you average the two G pixels and write the R and B pixels.

That would give you 2K, 4:4:4 RAW... sharp and awesome and a heck of a lot sharper than a 2K crop out of a Bayer sensor (with OLPF issues and only one R or G or B piece of info per pixel).

I'm sure Sony wouldn't mind you telling us how awesome the 2K RAW is, if it is indeed awesome.

If not, just keep quiet

Thank you!

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

 

[Grug]

Terrific Martin, if you're able to put together some feedback on the speed/ease of working with each of the different codecs: 50Mbps 4:2:2, XAVC, SRMaster, and raw - that'd be a huge help.

Have fun!

 

[starcentral]

I'm very interested to see how smoothly the SRMaster codec (at 4:2:2 and 4:4:4) can be incorporated into our editing workflow. The drag-and-drop simplicity (and SPEED) of recording to ProRes and DNxHD is what's made external recorders (and the Alexa) so popular to my mind. If Sony can work with the NLE manufacturers to get a similarly easy workflow in place, then it'll be a spectacular option.

If not, my PIX240 will still have a place in an F5/F55 system.

I attended a Canadian Society of Cinematographers meeting when the F65 was being previewed. There I met one of Sony's head engineers who worked on the F65 along with several other CineAlta cameras. You'll be pleased to know the extent of support for Sony's open source SRMaster codec.

Below is a photo I snapped of the presentation and a small write up can be found on my blog

 

[Kolor-Pikker]

Awesome! Well, just tell us about your pleasant surprises, then

My main question would be what exactly their 2K RAW is. It's supposedly derived from the full sensor and already sounds like it's a LOT better than just a 2K center crop.

The most logical way I can think of is something akin to the way the C300 works to make its 1080p from the original 4K sensor.

For every 4 pixels in a Bayer sensor, you have one R and one B and two G pixels.

...so to make "2K RAW" from a 4K RAW sensor, you average the two G pixels and write the R and B pixels.

That would give you 2K, 4:4:4 RAW... sharp and awesome and a heck of a lot sharper than a 2K crop out of a Bayer sensor (with OLPF issues and only one R or G or B piece of info per pixel).

I'm sure Sony wouldn't mind you telling us how awesome the 2K RAW is, if it is indeed awesome.

If not, just keep quiet

Thank you!

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

Hmm, doesn't the F55 already oversample it's resolution like the F65? I didn't really catch that part. All the literature says that "it uses the same color filter as the F65", is it not actually the same or similar sensor?
Or is it only 4k? If so, it's a little less mindblowing than I originally thought.

 

[starcentral]

CVP Group had originally written that its the *same sensor as the F65 but I don't think that's correct.

 

[John Andersson]

I do hope it's a sane sensor in the F55 But how could it be the same when it is a global shutter sensor?

After yesterday I realize these are great new tools. I can't justify the cost for the productions I do to get one myself but I'll take a used one in two years thanks!

 

[maranfilms]

To bad about the XLR inputs. No matter how great a camera becomes there's always something missing I really dig the modularity but the basics should be incorporate in the body. Not another Canon XLR-add-on again...

I hear ya, but if your shooting the f55, your having dual system audio. though it would be awesome to have an amazing audio system built in with good preamps. But hey, at least they built the visual part right. I'm so impressed with Sony lately. I always hated sony cams, then from the ex1, till now. thats changed.

 

[Matt Gottshalk]

Matt, do you see any zoom rocker on the left side of the camera module (like the F3) ? Ths picture you had attached is a shoulder mount / ENG styled camera configuration. I hoped Sony upgrade F3 to F5 will a zoom rocker on the camera module, too (which is better if you use the camera handheld or on tripod)

No.

It's a CINEMA camera.

Cinema cameras don't have zoom rockers, auto iris, or auto focus.

However if you WANT that ability, Abel Cine and Fujinon have a solution as I pictured above.

 

[John Andersson]

Now that I know how the XLR module looks it actually is a very good solution. There's audio if you want it.

 

[maranfilms]

The C300 can already do 60fps in 720p, so you're good to go.

To think that Canon is charging that kind of money for a cam that only does 720 60p, is laughable.

 

[tomer]

the audio section ,that's one of the worst solutions someone came to . no front mic input , no proper place for xlr connectors , no dual monitoring , that's 2 form 10 i can give Sony for their audio section , 80% of work with that camera will be audio directly to camera
not to mention they could manage audio slot for receiver which can sit between the battery and the main body
stupid design , not everything what bad with alexa or epic need to be implemented in a new cameara

 

[John Andersson]

For audio one-man-band I think F3 is a better choice. If that's your game.

 

[FrameFarmMedia]

For audio one-man-band I think F3 is a better choice. If that's your game.

Why? Aren't the XLR's located in the same place with same capability? (genuine question. I'm trying to understand what is so bad about F5 XLR input)

 

[starcentral]

One thing I've always felt in these forums along with a few others is the the majority of people are/were using the F3 for broadcast and run 'n gun type work, followed by commercial production, and leastly (word I made up?) film production.

There will be those who bickered about having a front EVF and those who just don't care. There are those who want audio on-board and those who won't care. (mind you the new F's will do audio with little add-on module)

In the end it looks like the new F's are very modular so you'll be able configure it anyway you like whether that is for broadcast or high-end production and I think that was Sony's goal, and I hate to give anyone any credit since I am cynical you really ought to hand it to Sony for going this route.

These new F's will likely be out of my budget range right now for the work I am doing and I will probably end up sticking with the F3 and a RED camera to cover off all my bases. But hopefully one day (soon) my situation will change.

Until then...

 

[John Andersson]

I don't think that's a bad place but I find no audio pots on the left side like on the F3.

 

[tomer]

they are located where they are will be a pain the a.. xx for the shooter , the return monitoring is on the other side , cable chaos. stupid ' no other word i can find for 25000 usd product

 

[bear.is.driving.]

Frame taken from the Richard Lewis video- Check that XLR bit on the side! (sorry for the quality).

Isn't it supposed to have a module in the back for that? Man oh man I hope it stays on the side there.