Please make Red work with CineForm!
- Thread starter obin
- Start date
I think thats more of a political question rather than a feature request, since They are working on their own Codec, the Red Codec.
toke lahti
Well-known member
Wouldn't it be wise politics for not to invent a same wheel in every company over and over again without compability with each other?
Forrest Schultz
Active member
hell yeah! 
rogar-BigGrin(DBG)
rogar-BigGrin(DBG)colormeter
Member
or maybe it's a way to reduce costs. licensing is expensive, guys! why pay some other company for something you can create yourself, especially with the high degree of customization required for your application? sounds like a way to keep the costs down, honestly, more than another futile attempt at creating a proprietary recording format intended to alienate you from the rest of the world. keep up the faith.
i think colormeter hit the nail on the head.. specially for codecs owned by other camera companies, such as Sony and Panasonic.
kampfpudel
Active member
I would like to see RED make a deal with www.letitwave.com/ or BitJazz.
I think it is quite expensive to devlope a codec?
The math behind it is quite advanced. Perhaps it is less expensive to pay a fee for a already devolped codec and save time, resources and personnel for making of the hardware?
On the other side...
RED seems to have the business policy to do everything inhouse.
It gives them total control over compatibility, quality and design.
A company that have same policy is Apple (OS and hardware).
It is a good policy, but it is expensive and sometimes a bit slow.
Speaking of it, the more I think about RED and Mr Jannard the more I come to think about Apple and Steve Jobs...
I think it is quite expensive to devlope a codec?
The math behind it is quite advanced. Perhaps it is less expensive to pay a fee for a already devolped codec and save time, resources and personnel for making of the hardware?
On the other side...
RED seems to have the business policy to do everything inhouse.
It gives them total control over compatibility, quality and design.
A company that have same policy is Apple (OS and hardware).
It is a good policy, but it is expensive and sometimes a bit slow.
Speaking of it, the more I think about RED and Mr Jannard the more I come to think about Apple and Steve Jobs...
note that currently cineform 10 bit 1920x1080 & 2k files only work/encode with premiere & after effects using prospect HD.
the cineform "free" reader is only 8bit and will not encode ... those using the other cineform products are 8 bit 1440x1080 ... IMO the cineform wavelet codec maybe excellent BUT premiere is not on my list of NLE's ...
i don't see how one could call apple slow .. seeing how the computer industry pretty much copies what apples does = in other words apple tends to be the leader in innovations ... note that FCP already works with p2 .. it already works with the new sony XDcam HD files ( note sony NLE vegas doesn't) .. the only place i saw it slow was in it's CPU's and now that been replaced using intel's ..
IMO until we see/read more on the RED codec how can we suggest it uses somebody elses codec .. i think what maybe missing here is that many do NOT know the high standards that Jim has for RED = good is not good enough -good does not pass RED standards ...
the cineform "free" reader is only 8bit and will not encode ... those using the other cineform products are 8 bit 1440x1080 ... IMO the cineform wavelet codec maybe excellent BUT premiere is not on my list of NLE's ...
i don't see how one could call apple slow .. seeing how the computer industry pretty much copies what apples does = in other words apple tends to be the leader in innovations ... note that FCP already works with p2 .. it already works with the new sony XDcam HD files ( note sony NLE vegas doesn't) .. the only place i saw it slow was in it's CPU's and now that been replaced using intel's ..
IMO until we see/read more on the RED codec how can we suggest it uses somebody elses codec .. i think what maybe missing here is that many do NOT know the high standards that Jim has for RED = good is not good enough -good does not pass RED standards ...
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kampfpudel
Active member
It was not my intention to call Apple slow. My comparison between Apple and RED was just that they both tend to be very innovative and both Jobs and Jannard are the very definition of the entrepreneur.
But it is a fact that it is a slower path to develope everything inhouse...or if you wish, a more expensive one. You have to compensate with more resources.
"IMO until we see/read more on the RED codec how can we suggest it uses somebody elses codec"
I thought the very purpose of the forum was to ventilate idees/speculations/suggestions/hopes for the RED project?
My English is not always up to standard, sometimes when I translate from Swedish to English it gets a bit confused. I do apologize for that.
Regards
Hans
But it is a fact that it is a slower path to develope everything inhouse...or if you wish, a more expensive one. You have to compensate with more resources.
"IMO until we see/read more on the RED codec how can we suggest it uses somebody elses codec"
I thought the very purpose of the forum was to ventilate idees/speculations/suggestions/hopes for the RED project?
My English is not always up to standard, sometimes when I translate from Swedish to English it gets a bit confused. I do apologize for that.
Regards
Hans
It's about workflow. Show me realtime editing in premiere pro with the redcodec and I will be happy, as of now, my cineform with HD-SDI in and out is the lowest cost realtime system on the market with 10bit 2k realtime editing. I have $8k into the system and am cutting a feature film on it now.
It works.
it saves me money.
That ='s more money in my pocket for me
unless you want to spend your entire monthly income on making payments on a high end edit system, I see NO point in anything better then realtime 2k 10bit editing for now.
It works.
it saves me money.
That ='s more money in my pocket for me
unless you want to spend your entire monthly income on making payments on a high end edit system, I see NO point in anything better then realtime 2k 10bit editing for now.
toke lahti
Well-known member
I do call them slow regarding support for outside US.Hans Nystroem said:
How many years we in Europe have been waiting for chroma blur filter for European DV (4:2:0) in FCP?
When do we get support for HVX to shoot in 720p and variable frame rates with FCP?
In past apple was the leader in new it-tech.
In what they are now in the lead:
fullHD screen in laptop? No
Brd/hd-dvd-rom? No
eSata? No
Card reader for p2? Not any more...
And yes, Obin is right; it's all about workflow.
Making codecs and plugins and other add-on softwares for various NLE's to have great usability will be a big task...
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im.thatoneguy
Well-known member
I will openly call Apple incredibly slow. It's not their fault per say, it's just the result of being in a closed house system (which they chose to be, so I guess it is their fault.)
If a new processor comes out. I can in less than a day, have one delivered to my door and upgrade my PC. If I want to get a new processor in my mac... well that just doesn't happen, I have to wait for them to decide when I'm ready to upgrade and offer me a new system. This works well if the current option is built to do everything you need to do when you need it. example: Apple Intel based workstation anybody?
Cineform is the same way. If you want 4k or Avid support, you have to wait until they decide you're ready. Something tells me RED doesn't want to sit around waiting for Cineform to implement all the features they want.
If a new processor comes out. I can in less than a day, have one delivered to my door and upgrade my PC. If I want to get a new processor in my mac... well that just doesn't happen, I have to wait for them to decide when I'm ready to upgrade and offer me a new system. This works well if the current option is built to do everything you need to do when you need it. example: Apple Intel based workstation anybody?
Cineform is the same way. If you want 4k or Avid support, you have to wait until they decide you're ready. Something tells me RED doesn't want to sit around waiting for Cineform to implement all the features they want.
im.thatoneguy said:
I think that is pretty much the basis for the entire camera.
Based on the philosophy of RED, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw a "Cineform" recorder, a DVCPRO HD recorder, even maybe an HDV recorder (Nah, probably not). Seriously, thiird party RED recorders for any format. I mean, AVID should lobby a manufacturer to develop a DNxHD RED recorder!
It's open architecture, so all these third parties will have the oportunity to join the revolution and develop RED accessories. They'd be stupid not to considering it'll be the most successful camera in history of electronic cameras.
Who knows, an XDCAM recorder. Now we're talking politics getting in the way.
Henry
It's open architecture, so all these third parties will have the oportunity to join the revolution and develop RED accessories. They'd be stupid not to considering it'll be the most successful camera in history of electronic cameras.
Who knows, an XDCAM recorder. Now we're talking politics getting in the way.
Henry