EVA1: Panasonic AU-EVA1! Announcement and latest updates

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Mitch Gross said:
Hard to know where to begin to parse all of this, so I'll just take the simple route.

- People really like the VariCam look. DPs and Colorists tell us all the time and cite it as a primary reason they use the camera. So we're gonna believe them.
- The engineering team at Panasonic have specifically formulated the EVA1 to match the look of the VariCam. In fact LUTs used on one will also apply to the other.
- Therefore the EVA1 will have the look that many people have stated they really like.
- End.

You may choose to believe what I write or not, but there are some established baselines. Rain is wet. Nazis are bad (to most of us). Chocolate is delicious. The VariCam makes an attractive image.
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OK. You chose to focus on the single sentence in my whole post where I mentioned the Varicam. The post was about easy to use and easy to get great results cameras. Not about the Varicam. ;-)

But ok. If you want to make it about the Varicam, my point was choosing the Varicam as reference will have different meanings to different people and it's also subjective. That's it. This is all I meant and it's a fact. I was not putting the Varicam down. The camera doesn't need defending because of what I said. :)

If you say the EVA1 will look like the Varicam somebody who likes the Alexa look for example won't be excited. Somebody who likes the EVA1 features but is more fan of the Red look won't be excited. After all that this is also subjective. Look like the Varicam how? For sure it won't be exact. Or it would be a Varicam for $7K. It doesn't even use the same sensor. So what part will be like the Varicam? So far it's clear the Varicam image is superior to the EVA1. So looks like Varicam by how much? This was my point. I was not putting the Varicam down. Just saying that this reference is more useful for marketing than as a real way to gauge anything.

Sure the Varicam makes good images. I agree. Sure DPs will like it. It has a lot to like about it. But just because of that doesn't mean a DP will choose it all the time. Or choose to own it. Varicam is mostly a rental item. The LT is more affordable but still. As a DP I don't mind using it at all. If the job calls for its features I would use it. But I chose not to own one. So it doesn't mean the person who says he likes it wants to buy one. It's very different when you're choosing a camera but not paying the bills. The EVA1 is an owner operator camera. Different considerations play a role. A DP can use a Varicam today, an Alexa tomorrow and a F65 day after tomorrow. He is not tied to a single camera. This changes things when you are choosing only one camera to be YOUR camera. So I'm not sure DPs saying they like the Varicam say anything about the EVA1.

But back to point the Varicam reference will mean different things to different people.

Since you like car analogies. The Camaro is an attractive car to most people. But Chevy saying they are releasing a car which looks like the Camaro might not excite Mustang fans. Even if they think the Camaro is cool. Then when the car comes out even Camaro hardcore fans might be disappointed because the car has Camaro wheels, the same engine and even uses the same tail lights. But to them doesn't really look like a Camaro. Not as much as they thought it would when Chevy said it was going to look like a Camaro.

So saying the EVA1 will look like a Varicam might even be setting yourself up. Because we know it won't be exact and then people will complain it doesn't look like a Varicam. Because there is no hard science telling people what to expect or how much Varicam it will be. This is why I think the Varicam reference is useless and I totally ignore it as any indication of the EVA1's qualities.
 
filmguy123 said:
I like Mitch's post, and I also like Sttratos post.

I will just point out in the most neutral way possible that matching LUTs only refer to Varicam color and curves, not the wholistic Varicam "look". My impression based on footage seen so far is that the Varicam LT looks distinct from the EVA-1.
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Yes absolutely. Which is why I think the Varicam reference is not any useful. Anybody should know it will not be a Varicam for $7K.
 
What I understand from Mitch's posts is that the EVA1 would be a good match for the Varicam..as a B-Cam for example.
Of course it's not a Varicam, who said it was?
 
Sttratos said:
First just one thing out of the way:



You dish it out but can also take it. Respect. Way too many thin skinned people around these parts.



The thing is when you speak now it's like Panasonic is speaking. So what you say carries a different weight, in both directions. When you say the EVA1 looks great, the EVA1 is easy to get a good result from , the EVA1 can be used right out of the box and deliver gorgeous images etc it doesn't really carry any weight. Sorry. You are selling it. What else are you going to say? Everybody is thankful for you being here and giving specs and other facts. But as far as your opinion about the image, you should not be surprised or take it personally (not saying you do) if people don't take it as gospel. Especially if the images so far don't really point that way. If it looks great or is easy to get great images from is not for Panasonic or you to say. It's for the public. Not even the people who buy it. But the general camera crowd. The crowd will ultimately decide if all that is true. If it is then a consensus will be formed that it looks great and is easy to get great results from. This is how it works in the end.

Every camera has a default setting. The question is does it look great just that way? This is a question you or Panasonic can't answer. Like I said it's not even a question most owners can answer in an honest way. It's a question the general camera crowd will answer once the camera is out. Most buyers are in a honey moon period when they buy a new camera and will only admit to the camera's faults when they move on to their next camera. If you have been around in this business long enough you have seen it happening over and over. But images don't lie. Owners can say all they want the camera looks great in their opinion. But if clip after clip online from the camera looks like video, cheap, bad skins etc this is the camera. Not what the manufacturer or the fans say.

I bought a FS7 and from the beginning I was criticizing it. I got down voted a lot on the Sony forum for it. Few other FS7 owners would come out and say it. Most had only praise. But I never felt like treating my camera like a darling just because I owned one. I pointed all the faults as I saw. Because how good was it to play blind and look to the other side pretending the camera was all roses when all the FS7 clips online told another story? I never saw a single FS7 clip that made me think the camera looked fantastic or even great. I never shot anything on the FS7 which I thought looked fantastic or even great. It always left something to be desired. It needed a lot of massaging just to start looking good. That is not an easy to use camera. It doesn't matter how many menu options there were. They could never help me and I honestly never seen them helping anybody. So I was never happy with it. Too much work for nothing. This all went away when I sold the FS7 and moved on to my next camera. I was finally happy.

So nobody can say now how the EVA1 will be. Saying it is like a Varicam is not saying much. First for that to be any compliment one has to actually like the Varicam. Second it's so subjective that it's a worthless statement.

Besides all that the point was not really about the EVA1 but about cameras in general. To me it was. I know this is an EVA1 thread. But I was talking about cameras in general. That cameras should be easy to get great results from. In a perfect world you would never need to touch menus apart from the obvious stuff like WB, frame rate etc. If you want to style the image it's different. But you should not have to mess with menus just to get a great image out of it. This is with any camera. I was not questioning the EVA1. Because nobody can say anything yet. Not Panasonic, not you not anybody yet. Only once the camera is out will the camera crowd speak the verdict. Then we will all know.

Anybody who doesn't want an easy to use camera must not use cameras. :)
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So it's not for Panasonic or Mitch to say, nor for owners of this camera, though once the camera is out the camera crowd will speak the verdict?....I have to say I don't understand this....nor you criticizing your own FS7 as previously you disqualified owners from commenting on their cameras, or does that only pertain to positive comments....
Lastly I would add, that I could care less what the "camera crowd" says about any camera...if a director and DP choose a system (usually a few different cameras) to shoot a project, that's all that's relevant...period...though I've already dismissed the EVA for myself as a choice, due to the EF mount, I continue to follow this thread as my preference is for Panasonic cameras....and I have to say that I don't see Mitch as a salesman of the camera, but a valuable resource for members...of course he's going to be positive about the EVA, but I can just as easily accept that he actually believes in the camera.
 
One would presume looks like a Varicam means you can use the EVA alongside the Varicam on a gimbal or in a tight space or shooting 2nd unit in a different location and you can cut the 2 cameras together. Lastly, logically it would seem like the worst marketing mistake, to claim the EVA looks like a Varicam, only for people to buy it, and it does not, lol...I think neither Mitch nor Panasonic would be that careless with this new product.
 
Danilo Del Tufo said:
I also think that Mitch does not tell lies about it. Noel Evans has posted two pictures from EVA1's footage and they look very promising.
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Doug_EX said:
What I understand from Mitch's posts is that the EVA1 would be a good match for the Varicam..as a B-Cam for example.
Of course it's not a Varicam, who said it was?
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fboonzaier said:
One would presume looks like a Varicam means you can use the EVA alongside the Varicam on a gimbal or in a tight space or shooting 2nd unit in a different location and you can cut the 2 cameras together. Lastly, logically it would seem like the worst marketing mistake, to claim the EVA looks like a Varicam, only for people to buy it, and it does not, lol...I think neither Mitch nor Panasonic would be that careless with this new product.
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Maybe you can see why I think the Varicam reference is an empty one. Every person will understand this in their own way. Some may understand that means the camera will look good. Others may understand it will be a good match for the Varicam. Whatever that means. Very close or close enough which is a big gap already. Then we know there will be some expecting it to be exact like the Varicam. You know there will those who want and think that.

Not a good reference IMO. That's all.
 
fboonzaier said:
So it's not for Panasonic or Mitch to say, nor for owners of this camera, though once the camera is out the camera crowd will speak the verdict?....I have to say I don't understand this....nor you criticizing your own FS7 as previously you disqualified owners from commenting on their cameras, or does that only pertain to positive comments....
Lastly I would add, that I could care less what the "camera crowd" says about any camera...if a director and DP choose a system (usually a few different cameras) to shoot a project, that's all that's relevant...period...though I've already dismissed the EVA for myself as a choice, due to the EF mount, I continue to follow this thread as my preference is for Panasonic cameras....and I have to say that I don't see Mitch as a salesman of the camera, but a valuable resource for members...of course he's going to be positive about the EVA, but I can just as easily accept that he actually believes in the camera.
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I try to explain. It doesn't matter if you have a Canon, a Sony, a Panasonic etc. Most will agree the Alexa looks great. Even some Red users. That it may be the best looking camera. Most try to imitate it and develop LUTs etc to try to match it. Even the other manufactures try to emulate it. This is a consensus. It's not only Alexa owners saying that. The camera crowd has spoken.

About criticizing the FS7 the problem is not to criticize. The problem is to only praise and down vote who is realistic and criticizes it. It's clear the camera has problems. Why not admit it? Just because you own one? I didn't disqualify owners from commenting on their cameras. I just said that normally owners have to be taken with a grain of salt because most tend to only praise and not criticize. So opinions are normally too over positive to be considered accurate.

Nobody is saying Mitch is not valuable here. I said myself that he is valuable here. It's great to have him here to inform people. Personal opinion is a different thing. And he is definitely selling the camera. He is a rep for the company. Nothing wrong with that. It just shifts the weight his personal opinion has.
 
icarusfilm said:
I still think Mitch should push the release back by a few months maybe end of April 2018?
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Mitch has no ability to do so. This is a worldwide release. Mitch is product manager for the USA. So I guess he could delay the introduction in the US, but that would be insane as it is going to ship worldwide in just a few weeks.
 
It was a joke about the level of impatience of the audience.



Barry_Green said:
Mitch has no ability to do so. This is a worldwide release. Mitch is product manager for the USA. So I guess he could delay the introduction in the US, but that would be insane as it is going to ship worldwide in just a few weeks.
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NorBro said:
This camera has a lot of pressure on it, ha...much more than the C200.
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Does it? I haven't been tracking outside of DVXuser at all so that may be spot on.

Legitimately wonder - is the larger internet and community outside here discussing the camera nearly as much as us, or are we in a bit of an echo chamber?
 
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