PanaLog for F35?!

Did you ever end up asking you buddy about being able to share panalog with a couple dvxusers?
 
James0b57 said:
Ok, i am about to head over to Panavision, if you can’t.
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I doubt they would just hand something like that over to anyone. Panavision is known for not sharing lol.

Here: https://gofile.io/?c=9xiwIj I doubt the DVXuser who shared them will give me a hard time. You guys have been very supportive and helpful with me over the years, least I can do is this.

I do need to point out that this Panalog gamma was remade by the DVXuser who shared it with me, its not the official panalog files straight from Panavision (again, they dont share) but its accurate down to the last pin point on the graph and its rated for the dynamic range of the genesis which is only 600% in CVP so like I said earlier, it doesnt use the F23/35's full potential of Dynamic Range but because of that, the shadows and noise levels are nicer ( i think anyway ).

Its def responding well to the GDP box that I have and for what I'm trying to conduct in terms of a workflow works great for me.

Let me know what you guys can do with it.
 
Very cool! Thank you!

I am excited also by the possibility of building my own custom profiles too. I’ll share those in the future!
 
As I was telling "rbirnbaum" in an email this afternoon.. I crafted a SLog to PanaLog correction LUT using that LUTcalc app from the mac app store and then created a LUT using my Panavision GDP box and im getting far better results than the replica panalog i was using. Goes without saying that testing is key to finding that perfect look/workflow with your gear and lord knows i spend my time perfecting something. I have a few more surprises in store near the end of the month regarding the F23 but want to save any details until it happens as not to jinx myself but im sure i will have your guys' interest? :)

Also, it should be noted by my research that converting SLog to PanaLog is probably a better way to go given SLog is infact more sensitive hense you are not loosing or "faking" any information in dark or bright scales.. you shoot with more, correct to panalog and then grade.. just a thought.
 
I think panalog for the F23 must be different from panalog for the F35. Because the images look different. The F23 doesn't have the F35 look. It looks more like a much improved F900 than it does like a F35. Also the F23 has less dynamic range than the F35. All that tells me there must be different versions of panalog for the F23 and F35. The one you have Mike is for the F23 right? Will be interesting to see what it does for the F35. For F35 owners best would probably be get your hands on a F35 panalog.
 
Sttratos said:
I think panalog for the F23 must be different from panalog for the F35. Because the images look different. The F23 doesn't have the F35 look. It looks more like a much improved F900 than it does like a F35. Also the F23 has less dynamic range than the F35. All that tells me there must be different versions of panalog for the F23 and F35. The one you have Mike is for the F23 right? Will be interesting to see what it does for the F35. For F35 owners best would probably be get your hands on a F35 panalog.
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While I agree the looks of the 23 and 35 differ a bit, mostly in color bit depth and field of view, I can't say that its dynamic range is less... the 23 can easily do 14 safely if setup right, maybe half a stop to a stop more then that if you really know what you are doing. Where Panalog would look different is between a genesis and f35 as the genesis doesnt have the dynamic range the 35 or 23 do.. it was at best an 11 stop camera.
 
Mike Krumlauf said:
While I agree the looks of the 23 and 35 differ a bit, mostly in color bit depth and field of view, I can't say that its dynamic range is less... the 23 can easily do 14 safely if setup right, maybe half a stop to a stop more then that if you really know what you are doing. Where Panalog would look different is between a genesis and f35 as the genesis doesnt have the dynamic range the 35 or 23 do.. it was at best an 11 stop camera.
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Actually it's pretty well known and established the F23 has less dynamic range than the F35. I even saw the DP of one of the F23 movies, not sure if Public Enemies or maybe a TV show saying the camera was good for about 10 stops. Don't remember where exactly but the info is out there as well. Just google it. I'm pretty sure it has been discussed here too. Genesis was also 10 stops. I think they might have improved it to 11 stops later on. F35 has sure more than both. The general look is very different though. The smaller sensor, less DR, less bit depth and different color makes the F23 closer to the standard Sony look. As said by many it's a broadcast camera in cinema body. The image looks much more video than the F35. F35 is unique really. My dream camera would be a 4K F35. I think I would take it to the grave with me.
 
Sttratos said:
Actually it's pretty well known and established the F23 has less dynamic range than the F35. I even saw the DP of one of the F23 movies, not sure if Public Enemies or maybe a TV show saying the camera was good for about 10 stops. Don't remember where exactly but the info is out there as well. Just google it. I'm pretty sure it has been discussed here too. Genesis was also 10 stops. I think they might have improved it to 11 stops later on. F35 has sure more than both. The general look is very different though. The smaller sensor, less DR, less bit depth and different color makes the F23 closer to the standard Sony look. As said by many it's a broadcast camera in cinema body. The image looks much more video than the F35. F35 is unique really. My dream camera would be a 4K F35. I think I would take it to the grave with me.
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Not to go back and forth with you but i assure you the F23 is more than a "glorified F900" and it for sure has between 13-15 stops in slog and other custom gammas like cineon. Sony themself marketed it at "13". Yes the field of view and color bit depth is better on a 35, but you need to give a little more credit to the 23 as its basicly a 16mm version of the F35..


Also just my two cents, and its hard for me to say this given i am a fan of Michael Mann and my hometown of Chicago, but Public Enemies is one of the worst looking digital films ever made and I promise you its not because of the camera...

F23 is every bit as worthy of the F35 in its own right... no need to crap on it my dude..
 
Also need to just say to argue 2/3" that one of my all time favorite digital films ZODIAC was shot on the viper in 4:4:4 2/3"
 

Nothing elaborate but wanted to share this with you. This was my workflow on this single shot.

Camera set in S-Log @ -6db 180deg shutter 24fps
convert s log to panalog and made a custom curve using the Panavision GDP Box
Capture through the panavision box so the image "processes" as its being captured.. then all i have to do is cut and export.. simple :)

The Panavision box is amazing as hell!
 
Sttratos said:
Actually it's pretty well known and established the F23 has less dynamic range than the F35. I even saw the DP of one of the F23 movies, not sure if Public Enemies or maybe a TV show saying the camera was good for about 10 stops. Don't remember where exactly but the info is out there as well. Just google it. I'm pretty sure it has been discussed here too. Genesis was also 10 stops. I think they might have improved it to 11 stops later on. F35 has sure more than both. The general look is very different though. The smaller sensor, less DR, less bit depth and different color makes the F23 closer to the standard Sony look. As said by many it's a broadcast camera in cinema body. The image looks much more video than the F35. F35 is unique really. My dream camera would be a 4K F35. I think I would take it to the grave with me.
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Maybe it's possible. Do a dual CCD sensor array like the Alexa LF (mini)

Anyone up to the task? Maybe we should let Sony know.
 
Mike,

Difficult to tell any special processing going on with the above video. Maybe a straight SLog vs Processed GDP Box would really help tell the difference.
 
To me Public Enemies looks inconsistent. It's like they were testing the camera. Like, hold on... deep in this effin menu there is a skin softening effect... let me try this in this shot. I am sure Michael's gonna love it. It just feels like the F23 was not used effectively. If it had stayed longer vs the F35... I think we would have seen much better pictures.
 
rbirnbaum said:
To me Public Enemies looks inconsistent. It's like they were testing the camera. Like, hold on... deep in this effin menu there is a skin softening effect... let me try this in this shot. I am sure Michael's gonna love it. It just feels like the F23 was not used effectively. If it had stayed longer vs the F35... I think we would have seen much better pictures.
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Agreed. Michael Manns best digital film ive always said was collateral from a cinematography standpoint
 
Mike Krumlauf said:

Nothing elaborate but wanted to share this with you. This was my workflow on this single shot.

Camera set in S-Log @ -6db 180deg shutter 24fps
convert s log to panalog and made a custom curve using the Panavision GDP Box
Capture through the panavision box so the image "processes" as its being captured.. then all i have to do is cut and export.. simple :)

The Panavision box is amazing as hell!
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I wanted to ask about the -6db being used. Could this "attenuation" that the camera allows be used in lieu of an ND filter? I am curious about that and would love to hear what others experienced, that is -db (I think the 2 settings are -6 and -12) vs ND filters in front of lens. I need to ultimately do my own tests but would like to hear others' opinions.
 
RayZan said:
I wanted to ask about the -6db being used. Could this "attenuation" that the camera allows be used in lieu of an ND filter? I am curious about that and would love to hear what others experienced, that is -db (I think the 2 settings are -6 and -12) vs ND filters in front of lens. I need to ultimately do my own tests but would like to hear others' opinions.
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It is the gain setting and is Sony's way of saying ISO. You can use it instead of a ND filter but you will loose dynamic range. Any clipped highlights would also remain clipped as it is basically just a multiplier on the digital signal.
 
dhessel said:
It is the gain setting and is Sony's way of saying ISO. You can use it instead of a ND filter but you will loose dynamic range. Any clipped highlights would also remain clipped as it is basically just a multiplier on the digital signal.
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The image is much cleaner in terms of noise at -6 compared to 0. IDK about the F35 but on the 23 the amount of DR lost is not significant enough to warrant not to use it for a cleaner image. If you have enough light coming in, i'd say -6 with ND is the best bet to control DOF. That how i've been shooting day exteriors and I save 0 - 6db for interior or night stuff.
 
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