Own a XHA1s. Buy 35mm adapter or switch to DSLR?

[edivila]

Hi everyone!

I know this horse might be beaten to death already, but the threads I've read about this never quite settle this argument.

Here's my situation. I already own a XHA1s and i'm looking for a thinner DOF than what my camera can achieve. I was looking at 35mm adapters and the letus35 extreme bundle seems tempting (it currently goes for something like $850).

Now, my friend tells me that for that money it'd be stupid of me not to get a DLSR camera instead, and that DLSR cameras are all the rage and they are the solution to the world's energy crisis (that last one i made up).

I've been searching forums and seen a vast range of opinions, but most of these threads are by now 2 years old, and it might be the case that technology-wise these opinions are no longer valid.

People who are for XHA1s have nothing but praise for this camera (when combined with an adapter) and say that it has less aliasing, longer recording time, more controls, more stable image, etc...

The pro-DLSR bunch say DLSR's give you beautiful image quality with less hassle, and that it doesn't take that much money to match up all the perks that the XHA1s has.

So, i'd like to know what is the situation NOW, if someone could throw some light on this argument.

What I want to do is shoot short films. I wouldn't be doing documentaries, but I think I'll be doing a lot of guerrilla style filming (which means not much time for fancy setups). I don't care at all about being able to take stills.

That's it. Any comments will be highly appreciated

 

[capt chuck]

The first thing I would look at is the total cost difference, not just the difference between the camera and the adapter. For example, if you go the DSLR route, you may need to get an external audio recorder or an XLR adapter to work with the camera. Likewise do you have, or does the adapter come with the needed rails, or do you need to purchase those. I'm sure there are a lot more items to consider such as rigs etc., but the point is determine the total cost of both first.

 

[maranfilms]

First of all, dont even consider a vibratring adapter, their no where near the same league as a spinner. Theres a used sgblade on the forum right now for a good price. I like the look of a dof adapter certain shoots, and I shoot both dslr and camcorder. Look for either a redrock m2 or m3, handy35, sg blade. I think their so cheap now you can find a good setup for around 300-500.

 

[jthabel]

You have a good camera in the XH-A1. Don't make the mistake of switching over to DSLR. I'm not saying that DSLR is bad. It can create some great images. But it's more trouble than it's worth if you're doing run-and-gun filmmaking. Take a few looks at the Frankenstein-esque rigs you have to turn DSLRs into just to get them to do the basic things that a camcorder can do, all for a little extra DOF. Not worth it. Also, recording audio outside of the camera and having to sync it up later is a major pain. Camcorders are designed for video. Video is thrown onto DSLR as more of an afterthought and "added plus.". In a few years, DSLR might be there. Right now, it isn't.

 

[KyleProhaska]

Well I've owned both and shot a feature on the 35mm adapter setup so I can tell you that a DSLR is tempting. Part of me just likes the look adapters give, but the 5D gets insanely close to what the old setup gave me image wise. I think the greatest difference was a bump in resolution, and I used the Letus Extreme which gave me a nice wash of grain I loved. However, the setup was very bulky and hard to shoot with at times. However #2, it's weight on a more formal set made it sturdy and solid so movements with it via a tripod were super smooth and easy to handle without massive bumps or jolts or whatever. The DSLR's can give you an image that's nearly identical (the 5D at least) without the weight, but obviously you're missing the pro-camera capabilities initially. Adding those won't cost you an arm/leg in my opinion, so it's going to come down to price.

I'm still tempted after selling my XHA1 to buy an XF100 or XF300 and shoot with an adapter again on my next feature since I loved it so much, but it's more then likely I'll invest in more EF glass, Canon Batteries, CF Cards, etc. and rent a C300 for the shoot. All I would need is the body at that point and I'll have the rest for it to slip right into my workflow. I also already own external monitors, rails, FF, mattebox, etc.

Tough call still, because although I sold the AF100 I had, I miss it all the time...having the DOF with the pro-camera features was difficult to give up and I still miss it. If only the C300's price wasn't too high for me to justify buying. I would be all over it

Hope you come to a decision! Ultimately it'll come down to what you want to spend, what kind of image you prefer, and usability/ergonomics more then anything else IMO.

 

[starcentral]

10 years ago I started with the PS Technik mini35 (series 300) using a PAL version of the XL1 to get 24p long before 24p was available on consumer cams. Later when the DVX100 from panasonic came out I feel it really helped fuel 35mm adapters. I waited for the XL2 however, because what I ALWAYS liked about using Canon cams with a 35mm adapter setup was the obvious fact of not having to shoot through two sets of glass, and the great overall rig ergonimics.

2011 was my last year shooting with 35mm adapters (was using Brevis flip at that time) and I ended up switching to the Sony F3, and even considered the FS100. I also owned the Canon 7D (for photography) but really wanted the extra benefits of a video cam. (histogram, spot meter, XLR ins, zebras, list goes on...) At the time of my evaluation, the AF100 wasn't even a consideration for me. I've seen its images, it is amazing for sure no doubt, but I wanted to stick with 35mm lenses with option to use cine lenses I and wanted to shoot as close to the Super 35mm format as possible.

What really turned me off adapters near the end were a few things;

- Depending on the adapter you might not be able to shoot at high shutter speeds. This isn't absolutely "critical" but for fight scenes or other effects (movie 300) you might want high shutter speeds and some adapters will prevent you from being able to reach high speeds.

- Light loss is less of a problem these due to improved 35mm adapters and cameras with higher native ISO's. Back in the day I was shooting with an equivalent ISO of 60 which was ridiculous for indoor shooting even with serious lighting. A DSLR is going to give you pretty clean images at 400,800 heck even 1600 is not bad (or higher even!) so imagine using a 60w light bulb bounced off a piece of foam core for your dramatic key light?

The Canon XLH1 is said to have a native ISO of 320 but once you add an adapter you will probably be working around 160-200 ISO which will need a good amount of ample lighting for decent shots. Ask around about light loss for different adapters, as I don't know these days where they are at.

- Size and alignment: you overall rig is definitely going to be bigger with a 35mm adapter and weigh more. More batteries too! More fiddling. There are also things like alignment that can be tricky depending on what model you go for. If you plan to take your camera on and off the adapter alot, research an adapter that makes that easy.


In the end I think you need to ask yourself if you REALLY want switch over to complete 35mm and give up the ability to shoot 1/3 with your XLH1. 35mm is a totally different world that takes getting use to. For example, you need to master manually focusing ALL THE TIME - depending on what kind of shooting you do, this may not tickle your fancy.

If I were you, I would maybe try an adapter for now to see how different shooting 35mm is, then later, decide if you want to keep your XLH1 and buy a cheap DSLR so you have BOTH, or just sell the XLH1 and move over to 35mm. Maybe by then you can afford something like the AF100 or FS100 used.. just a thought.

 

[edivila]

Hi, and thanks to everyone who took the time to leave a response!

First of all, dont even consider a vibratring adapter, their no where near the same league as a spinner. Theres a used sgblade on the forum right now for a good price. I like the look of a dof adapter certain shoots, and I shoot both dslr and camcorder. Look for either a redrock m2 or m3, handy35, sg blade. I think their so cheap now you can find a good setup for around 300-500.

So this would mean that the letus35 is out of the question? What kind of performance difference are we talking about?

 

[starcentral]

I don't agree with spinning vs. vibrating debate and telling someone one is better than another. That's pretty biased depending on each person's individual needs and preferences.

I've owned and used both - and both have pros and cons. Some spinning ground glass you will see at f5.6 or higher and that is pretty useless whereas even if you do see ground glass on a vibrating adapter it is not as obvious as circular motion of a spinner.... with a vibrating adapter it will just look like "grain". Spinning has advantages too however and many recent improvements don't get me wrong....

Do your own research and see if you can get an adapter that will let you shoot as high as f11. f5.6 and under are more common for shooting however, I'm just saying it is sometimes nice not to have so much DOF depending on the project.