ok ..my first music video soon to come,but..

S

sammysammy

Well-known member
im having very hard time convencing the singer that the music video would look much better if we speed up the song by 25-30% and shoot that way, than after slow down to sync with original speed..he is not understanding the idea, and saying to me that he can not do it that way (and the song is already fast)..any tips ,i know its all on me, but its my first video and his too , so im not sure what to do..thanks
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071129162853AABnSqx
 
the technique works well with film where you can adjust the framerates of the camera in small increments, but how do you want to do it with video? Slow down the video in post? Film with 50/60fps?
If the song is already fast he may loose sync if the playback is too fast. You better do a test before as this would also convince your act.
 
Maybe try both ways then you can prove your point to him and say "Yeeeah much easier to do it this way...." and then they can't argue!
 
Nice technique but highly unnecessary

Nice technique but highly unnecessary

I have shot 4 complete music videos, two of which have played on MTV, MTV2, MTV-Europe & BET. My formula is simple.

Shoot the story at 60fps and Shoot the sync performances at 24PN. (if you have an HVX200)

If shooting on the DVX100 or similar cam. Shoot the performances 24p and the story 30fps.

You can always control the speed on the story parts to make cool effects. And if you have an inexperienced artist, then just shoot it in real time.

Here is an example. This music video is on international television rotation right now.

http://blip.tv/file/3223623

www.mikelfair.com
 
sammysammy said:
(and the song is already fast)..any tips ,i know its all on me, but its my first video and his too , so im not sure what to do..thanks
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071129162853AABnSqx
Click to expand...

FYI - I shot this video http://www.vimeo.com/8655720 at both 30 (music at 125% speed) and 24 with the intention of slowing 30 to 24. It was a real ***** for the band to play that fast.

I found it didn't work well on a fast song. I think I only used one quick shot slowed down.

It's used in almost every hip hop vid, but I dunno if works that well with faster performance stuff. Of course, your results will vary.
 
If you're happy with the tests you've done, then try and convince the artist that this part of the shoot is going to be a lot of fun. I've shot a few performances speeded up and even on fast songs. It will be difficult to keep in sync and at times he will probably loose it completely, but try and keep it light hearted. My guess is, that as this is his first experience of shooting a video, he's afraid of looking an idiot. You just need to convince him to get over this fear and trust you to do your job. Unless your dealing with a serious prima donna, it should be fun.
 
guys i thank you so much for all the feedback..ok, so this is going to be tough, for a while ive been reading up that most music videos are shot faster and slowed in post..now i see 2 great clips with mik303 and ihart that makes me think that its not a set rule in the performance part.. but some of you said to give it a test run, and i did a test run by my self, and its alot harder than i thought it would be , and i know what im doing..he will have very hard time syncing i think..i might just do 24p or 60p 1/60 withoutslow motion in the performance as some have said..
 
by barry green
The problem with giving exact answers is that the frame rates aren't exact, so even if someone comes in with the magic formula it'll still have to be tested to be sure.

But, with that said, the basic formula is that you first want to determine your footage playback speed, and once you know that, it tells you how to modify the song. So (in theory) if you're wanting to shoot 48fps slow motion for a 24fps timeline, you'd be getting 2:1 slow motion, so you'd have to speed up the song so that it plays for exactly half as much time as normal.

So again, in theory, you'd take a four-minute song and speed it up so that it plays for exactly two minutes. Then you'd set the HVX into 24pN mode, set your frame rate to 48, and play the sped-up song and have your actor/singer lip-sync to the super-fast version of the song. Then when you play your footage back it'll be in 2:1 slow motion, and you'd marry that version of the footage to your original song, and they should now be in perfect sync.

But they won't be. Because there's theory, and there's this troubling thing called "reality," and the reality here is that the frame rates are not what they say they are. 24fps is not, for example, 24fps; it's 23.976. And 48fps is not 48, nor is it 47.952 (as you might think, if it's twice as fast as 23.976)! It isn't. It's actually 48.17. And 12fps isn't 11.988, it's 12.26. Except if you're on the PAL HVX, where it actually is 12.500, half of 25.000.

So you need to adapt the formula to comply to the actual frame rates. Fortunately the HVX does part of that work for you, by doing the 24pN (or 25pN) conversion in-camera, so we only have to concern ourselves with how much to speed up the song by.

I haven't tested these, but I'd guess they're accurate; if anyone tests them and finds them inaccurate please let us know.

For an NTSC/US HVX, using a 24p timebase, for the following frame rates, adjust the song speed to:

12 fps: make song last 1.956x longer by stretching it to 51.1% speed
18 fps: make song last 1.333x longer by stretching it to 75.0% speed
20 fps: make song last 1.226x longer by stretching it to 81.6% speed
22 fps: make song last 1.067x longer by stretching it to 93.7% speed
26 fps: make song last 0.907x as long as normal; play it at 110.25% speed
30 fps: make song last 0.800x as long as normal; play it at 125% speed
32 fps: make song last 0.747x as long as normal; play it at 133.87% speed
36 fps: make song last 0.672x as long as normal; play it at 148.81% speed
48 fps: make song last 0.498x as long as normal; play it at 200.80% speed
60 fps: make song last 0.400x as long as normal; play it at 250.00% speed

For an NTSC/US HVX, using a 30p timebase, for the following frame rates, adjust the song speed to:

12 fps: make song last 2.445x longer by stretching it to 40.91% speed
18 fps: make song last 1.667x longer by stretching it to 60.00% speed
20 fps: make song last 1.533x longer by stretching it to 65.23% speed
22 fps: make song last 1.333x longer by stretching it to 75.01% speed
24 fps: make song last 1.250x as long as normal; play it at 80.00% speed
26 fps: make song last 1.134x as long as normal; play it at 88.22% speed
32 fps: make song last 0.933x as long as normal; play it at 107.14% speed
36 fps: make song last 0.840x as long as normal; play it at 119.05% speed
48 fps: make song last 0.622x as long as normal; play it at 160.73% speed
60 fps: make song last 0.500x as long as normal; play it at 200.00% speed

For the Euro/PAL camera it's different; the timebase of PAL footage is 25.000 fps, so that makes it easier. But the other frame rates may vary, so it needs some calculation too.

For the PAL/EU/AUS/NZ cam, set the recording mode to 720/25pN, then set your frame rate to whichever your chosen fps is. Then adjust the speed of the song according to this table:

12 fps: make song last 2.000x as long as normal; play it at 50.00% speed
18 fps: make song last 1.400x as long as normal; play it at 71.44% speed
20 fps: make song last 1.266x as long as normal; play it at 78.96% speed
23 fps: make song last 1.080x as long as normal; play it at 92.60% speed
27 fps: make song last 0.920x as long as normal; play it at 108.68% speed
30 fps: make song last 0.840x as long as normal; play it at 119.04% speed
32 fps: make song last 0.778x as long as normal; play it at 128.56% speed
37 fps: make song last 0.680x as long as normal; play it at 147.04% speed
48 fps: make song last 0.520x as long as normal; play it at 192.32% speed
50 fps: make song last 0.500x as long as normal; play it at 200.00% speed
 
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