Odyssey Firmware Patch Release v2015.8 (1098)

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Dan Keaton

Well-known member
Odyssey Firmware Patch Release v2015.8 (1098)

This firmware patch release addresses specific issues related to 4K/UHD Apple ProRes recording in the previous firmware update (v2015.8).

Convergent Design recommends all customers immediately update their Odyssey7Q/Odyssey7Q+ to this latest firmware.

The Odyssey7 is not affected by this update.

IMPROVED

Image quality in 4K/UHD Apple ProRes from direct video sources

FIXED

Audio sync in FS7/FS700 4K RAW to Apple ProRes

Here is a link to our Firmware Download Page:

https://convergent-design.com/support/firmware-downloads.html



Respectfully,


Dan Keaton
Convergent Design
 
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Great! That was a fast response to the audio sync problem!
Thanks so much Dan, Mitch and CD !
 
What is it about the Improving Image Quality? What does direct Video source mean?
I had to rent a FS7 yesterday as my customer said FS700 4k->UHD ProRes was not sharp enough (after sending him samples) in the direct comparison with a FS7. He checked at a 55" UHD Screen and knows what hes talking about.
 
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Dear Skylike,

Mr. Barry Green was using one of our Odyssey7Q+'s with a prototype camera and noticed that the image quality was not up to par when recording from a 4K Direct Video Source (not from a Raw Source like an FS700 / FS7 or C500) to 4K Apple ProRes 422 or Ultra-HD Apple ProRes 422.

This started a process where we attempted to duplicate the problem in our lab, which we did.

Then our engineers found that in certain cases, the bit-rate that we used for recording certain images was too low.

So, we corrected this as fast as possible and released it to the public today after our testing was complete.


More detail:

When recording in Apple ProRes, Apple provides "Target Bit Rates" which must be met, + or - 10%.
These Target bit-rates vary due to the resolution, the frame rate, and which Apple ProRes 422 mode (HQ, Regular 422 or LT).

Technically, the task of meeting these target bit rates is called Rate Control, where we have to meet the target for each and every frame of video.


There was a problem in our Rate Control which caused certain frames to be recorded in a lower bit-rate than required.

This caused these frames of video to be lower in quality.

We have added this to our testing procedures where we automatically check our Apple ProRes 422 files to detect any low bit-rate frames.

We do recommend upgrading to this release as soon as possible.

Respectfully,


Dan Keaton
Convergent Design
 
Just completed a shoot using my FS700+O7Q with the original 2015.8. Video and audio are out of sync by 7 frames. I was going crazy understanding why this was so, until I saw the patch release. A quick check of sync after the patch update to my O7Q shows the video and audio to still be out of sync by 1 frame. Not much, but, noticeable to a discerning eye. A quick call to C-D customer support confirms that this is the best that can be done with the info coming from the FS700 SDI port.

I notice that on my PIX 240i, the user is given the option to set an audio delay to the recorded signal. A 40 mSec is what I've found works for me. Perhaps the remaining sync issue with the O7Q can be addressed by this method, giving the user a selectable sync delay.
 
Isn't that audio sync delay only for separate audio input as opposed to embedded audio in the video (or in this case RAW data) SDI or HDMI signal?
 
I've had no audio sync issues with 4k ProRes LT recordings from the FS700 RAW output, and I have conducted many hours of interviews/vox-pox. The audio is embedded with the SDI out from the FS700. I still have yet to update the 7Q+ with the new patch.
 
Mitch Gross said:
Isn't that audio sync delay only for separate audio input as opposed to embedded audio in the video (or in this case RAW data) SDI or HDMI signal?
Click to expand...

yeah, that's right, Mitch. So, in this case, I assume, the audio would need to be disembedded(demuxed), delayed, then re-embedded?
 
Awesome work guys, thanks for the patch. Is there anyway we could be notified via email when these patches and updates are released? Just had a shoot today and could have used this fix on set...
 
I hadn't got around to updating the latest patch firmware update (1098), until Monday 2 day's ago. I made the silly mistake of doing this just before a shoot yesterday, without testing first.

When I was setting up for the shoot yesterday morning, unfortunately if I selected the FS700 '4K RAW-4K PRORES' or '4K RAW-UHD PRORES', I got this interference on the screen (and subsequently on the recordings too):

20150916_144140.jpg

If I chose any other mode (such as '4K RAW-HD PRORES', or '2K HIGHSPEED-HD PRORES') then all was well, no issues. So it meant I was forced to shoot in HD, which was not a big deal, as I didn't have any interviews yesterday, which is mainly where I've been shooting 4K for post cropping possibilities.

But it did make me panic when I first saw the interference. At first I thought it may be the BNC cable (I have the official short thin CD BNC cable), but as it worked in all other modes I wasn't sure (I did try unplugging and re-inserting to no avail). I tried re-booting, switching the camera off and on, changing modes (and frame rates) and reverting back etc etc. But the issues was still there with the 4KPRORES modes no matter what I did. But like I said it was totally fine in the PRORES HD and high speed PRORES HD modes.

I've just re-installed the previous firmware (1074) and all is fine again - fine in ALL modes including the aforementioned 4K PRORES modes. So I will leave it with this firmware until the next firmware update. Unless anyone thinks I just had a bad install and should try again?

I know I ought to log this as an official fault to CD, but thought it was worth sharing here for feedback.
 
Hi Mitch,

Can you share the timeframe for enabling 12 bit 4444 1080 recording? Also, any plans for 4K Prores 4444? I love the FS7Q camera recorder combo but extra color info is paramount for staying competitive in the marketplace.
 
DanKov said:
Hi Mitch,

Can you share the timeframe for enabling 12 bit 4444 1080 recording? Also, any plans for 4K Prores 4444? I love the FS7Q camera recorder combo but extra color info is paramount for staying competitive in the marketplace.
Click to expand...
I've been asking this question for months. The only answer I get is that it's 'In the plan". I would dearly like this update, myself.
 
I can't share timelines as we have been seriously burnt by it in the past. For instance, our "September" firmware update still has not been released as we discovered a file corruption possibility and had to dismember the code to sort it out. Testing revealed it could happen in an extremely rare case, but we don't want it to ever happen and so it was back to the lab. The testing process is mind-numbingly arduous and slow, because we have to make sure that the problems won't occur. With every feature we add it means new combinations of settings and functions that we must test repeatedly over multiple test bed gear with a slew of cameras. It's really the only way to be sure.

I did tease recently that we were adding a couple of functions to this release that we had not announced, but I was careful not to state which ones. I'm glad I kept quiet because we discovered an issue with one of them and had to hold it back for later.

Compressed 12-bit 444 is more than just "in the plans." It's in real development and will arrive sooner than you may think we will deliver it. But I know it can't get here soon enough for many of you.

Understand that a 4K 4:4:4 mode really requires more information than is contained in a 4K RAW data file. Yes, there is a marginal difference that can be gleaned over a 4K 4:2:2 output, but for the most part it's just padding out with zeros. You really need at least 6K RAW data to begin to flesh out the additional color information for 4K 4:4:4. If someone made a 3-chip 4K camera then in theory we could get a 4K 4:4:4 signal out of it, but a Bayer-pattern single sensor is by design an effective 4:2:2 device.

Now getting 12-bit HD 4:4:4 from 10-bit 4K RAW? That's good math with real results.
 
Mitch Gross said:
Understand that a 4K 4:4:4 mode really requires more information than is contained in a 4K RAW data file. Yes, there is a marginal difference that can be gleaned over a 4K 4:2:2 output, but for the most part it's just padding out with zeros. You really need at least 6K RAW data to begin to flesh out the additional color information for 4K 4:4:4. If someone made a 3-chip 4K camera then in theory we could get a 4K 4:4:4 signal out of it, but a Bayer-pattern single sensor is by design an effective 4:2:2 device.

Now getting 12-bit HD 4:4:4 from 10-bit 4K RAW? That's good math with real results.
Click to expand...

I sense a slight change of emphasis compared to what you recently wrote about the same issue over at CML... ;-)

Seriously, though: Some times it's about delivering the desired file format even if the technical benefits are limited as seen strictly from a Bayer-pattern to Compressed Codec view-point. F.ex. the client might have a RGB workflow, so you want the conversion process to RGB Video to happen as soon as possible.

As for the XQ version of ProRes you can wait as far as I'm concerned. My clients are reporting compatibility issues with ProRes444XQ on other platforms than Mac, so it's only ProRes444 for now in my world.
 
Parrot said:
I sense a slight change of emphasis compared to what you recently wrote about the same issue over at CML... ;-)

Seriously, though: Some times it's about delivering the desired file format even if the technical benefits are limited as seen strictly from a Bayer-pattern to Compressed Codec view-point. F.ex. the client might have a RGB workflow, so you want the conversion process to RGB Video to happen as soon as possible.

As for the XQ version of ProRes you can wait as far as I'm concerned. My clients are reporting compatibility issues with ProRes444XQ on other platforms than Mac, so it's only ProRes444 for now in my world.
Click to expand...
Now you have me wondering what I wrote on CML... It was probably in the dead of night and for the life of me I can't recall.

Anyway, at least for the moment we don't have plans to capture compressed 444 in 4K. Never say never, but that's what we're planning at the moment. Yes for HD & 2K, but not above that resolution.
 
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