Odyssey 7q stopped working with certain batteries

boosh

boosh

Well-known member
I was on set today and something really strange happened with the Odyssey 7q whilst using it with my FS700. I am using a Nebtek adapter on the Odyssey so i can use Sony NPF batteries. The Odyssey started turning off from time to time and then eventually stopped taking two of my large fully charged Official Sony Batteries. It still worked with one other identical official Sony battery I had and also with a smaller official Sony battery. All batteries are in perfect working order and two of them are less than six months old. All batteries still work flawlessly with my FS700. I just wondered if anyone else had encountered this problem? Its the first time I have shot with the Odyssey since putting on the latest firmware. Could it be that? I initially thought it was a power problem but why not take two specific batteries all of a sudden but work with others? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Paul
 
Are you sure those batteries are really Sony and not counterfeit? Yes, that's a thing.

Also, They may say they charge fully but how do they actually perform on another device? Do they last as long as others? The Odyssey has a high initial draw, especially when recording 4K. It is possible that they do not have full capacity any longer.

You can contact CD Support for additional assistance.
 
Is that the voltage boosting (to 12V) adapter, or just a simple plate that provides a voltage out cable?
 
Mitch Gross said:
Are you sure those batteries are really Sony and not counterfeit? Yes, that's a thing.

Also, They may say they charge fully but how do they actually perform on another device? Do they last as long as others? The Odyssey has a high initial draw, especially when recording 4K. It is possible that they do not have full capacity any longer.

You can contact CD Support for additional assistance.
Click to expand...

Hi Mitch, all batteries are official Sony batteries purchased form an official Sony provider. All batteries were also fully charged. Checked again today and I get the same thing. I'm also only recording in 4k2HD. The batteries last all day long in my FS700 (7 hours before needing changing). It seems as though since I've done the latest firmware it cant accept the voltage from the larger batteries, only the smaller one. This is a problem. Is there a version of the firmware before th latest one I can re-install to check if it is the firmware or something else?

Thanks,

Paul
 
I got the same. All with NEBTEK + Sony Orginal and Replacements. Record trigger not responding. All with RAW4K60p.
My thoughts? I think that becouse all of those batteries are brand new. I have to discharge and recharge few times to free full potential of those bricks. Have to form them out.
Im in progress right now. So we will see.
 
dashek said:
I got the same. All with NEBTEK + Sony Orginal and Replacements. Record trigger not responding. All with RAW4K60p.
My thoughts? I think that becouse all of those batteries are brand new. I have to discharge and recharge few times to free full potential of those bricks. Have to form them out.
Im in progress right now. So we will see.
Click to expand...

Hi Dashek, my problem isn't the trigger. The problem is that the Odyssey wont even turn on with the larger batteries. Is this what you are getting also?

Cheers,

Paul
 
All Li-Ion batteries have a built in safety circuit breaker. It is set to a threshold that the battery designer selected, and it trips when the current consumption exceeds that threshold.
It sounds to me that is what you are experiencing as it "has a high initial draw" per Mitch. Without test equipment is impossible to know for sure. If you have a way to borrow a Swit S-8972 battery to see if it works than you get your answer. It is designed for high current draw as it has a DC jack to power camera + accessories.
Also, there is a chance that the Nebtek adapter just does not provide good enough contacts connection, resulting in loss of some voltage in wiring. Again, hard to know for sure without testing.
 
I think you probably need to contact Nebtek.

The Nebtek cage with its dual battery back (there are several options) is not a straight-wired affair. There's circuitry in there and the two battery mounts are wired together. I know that Nebtek makes a version of a 7.2v battery mount that then uses a circuit to up the voltage to 12v. I don't know if they are doing that here and then if the two mounts are wired in series or parallel. Frankly, I have no idea how they have wired it. It is possible that there is a circuit regulator and the fact is that your large batteries are TOO STRONG for it, causing it to shut down as a safety measure. Leaky capacitors and other issues can mean that these devices change over time.

But this is all speculation. I really have no idea what's up with your kit. But since it is working fine with other batteries then I'm thinking it is likely not the Odyssey but instead the Nebtek mount.

BTW, the Odyssey functions as a battery meter. It will note what voltage is coming into the unit in the SYSTEM STATUS button almost all the way over to the left on the Upper Tool Bar. Your batteries are 7.2v, which in practice likely means they're about 7.8 when fresh and drop down to 6.7v before we warn that they're getting very low. We shut off below 6.5v. Using the Nebtek, if one battery reads in this range then you know there is no voltage upping going on. If it reads closer to 12v then the voltage is being treated. If you put on two batteries and the voltage doubles or comes close to that, then the batteries are wired in series. If you add a second battery and the voltage does not change or only rises slightly then they are in parallel.
 
Mitch Gross said:
I think you probably need to contact Nebtek.

The Nebtek cage with its dual battery back (there are several options) is not a straight-wired affair. There's circuitry in there and the two battery mounts are wired together. I know that Nebtek makes a version of a 7.2v battery mount that then uses a circuit to up the voltage to 12v. I don't know if they are doing that here and then if the two mounts are wired in series or parallel. Frankly, I have no idea how they have wired it. It is possible that there is a circuit regulator and the fact is that your large batteries are TOO STRONG for it, causing it to shut down as a safety measure. Leaky capacitors and other issues can mean that these devices change over time.

But this is all speculation. I really have no idea what's up with your kit. But since it is working fine with other batteries then I'm thinking it is likely not the Odyssey but instead the Nebtek mount.

BTW, the Odyssey functions as a battery meter. It will note what voltage is coming into the unit in the SYSTEM STATUS button almost all the way over to the left on the Upper Tool Bar. Your batteries are 7.2v, which in practice likely means they're about 7.8 when fresh and drop down to 6.7v before we warn that they're getting very low. We shut off below 6.5v. Using the Nebtek, if one battery reads in this range then you know there is no voltage upping going on. If it reads closer to 12v then the voltage is being treated. If you put on two batteries and the voltage doubles or comes close to that, then the batteries are wired in series. If you add a second battery and the voltage does not change or only rises slightly then they are in parallel.
Click to expand...

Thanks Mitch. I'm certain it is the Nebtek.. I have contacted them but can you recommend another way of powering the Odyssey 7q with Sony NPF batteries? I need to order something today as i have shoots on and cant have one small battery only to work with my Odyssey.

Many thanks for all your help and quick replies!
 
Convergent Design makes a battery plate for using L-series batteries (that's what you are calling "NPF"). Our plate holds a single battery, which is all that is needed to power the Odyssey. If you want to run two batteries, then Hawk-Woods makes a plate that will run off two L-series bricks. It puts them in series, turning the two 7.2v cells into a 14.4v power source. The plate also features a P-Tap socket for powering additional accessories.
 
Mitch Gross said:
Convergent Design makes a battery plate for using L-series batteries (that's what you are calling "NPF"). Our plate holds a single battery, which is all that is needed to power the Odyssey. If you want to run two batteries, then Hawk-Woods makes a plate that will run off two L-series bricks. It puts them in series, turning the two 7.2v cells into a 14.4v power source. The plate also features a P-Tap socket for powering additional accessories.
Click to expand...

Hi Mitch, I contacted Nebtek and explained the situation. They asked for a photo of the bracket which they said was actually a convergent design one which they supplied to you guys. They told me to contact the retailer I purchased it from to get you guys to send me a new one? If this is the case do you offer this service? I purchased the bracket along with my Odyssey in May 2014. Thanks, Paul
 
Alright, this is getting confusing. This is why trying to diagnose a problem such as this is not properly done on an internet forum.

Please contact CD Support so that we can address this properly.
 
Mitch Gross said:
Alright, this is getting confusing. This is why trying to diagnose a problem such as this is not properly done on an internet forum.

Please contact CD Support so that we can address this properly.
Click to expand...

Hi Mitch, already contacted the retailer I purchased this from and they have already contacted you guys to work out a solution and hopefully a replacement for the battery plate. Thanks again for your help.
 
I would be happy to see if we can get to the bottom of this for you. Please contact me at info @ Nebtek dot com
I could walk you through the process of troubleshooting this for you. We do not use voltage converters in the Odyssey version of our battery adapters.
The voltage from the battery should pass through.
Please send me a picture of the back of your unit so we can clearly identify the exact model you are using.
Please include all of your contact information and let us know if you purchased this from NEBTEK directly or from one of our vendors.

Gaylen Nebeker | CEO

DIT
4K/3D/HD Video Assist
HD Wireless RF Tech.

NEBTEK, Inc.

3007 S. West Temple Suite K | Salt Lake City, UT 84115
gnebeker@nebtek.com | www.nebtek.com

tel 801-467-1920 | fax 801-467-0307
Follow us: http://www.facebook/nebtek

 
Hey everyone,

I posted in another thread, but then saw this, and so maybe I could be helped too. (http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthrea...-Dillema&p=1986516075&posted=1#post1986516075)

Recently, I switched over to v-lock batteries to power my 7Q as using NPF was a headache and unreliable. Paraphrasing from other thread; When I got the 7Q last spring, I had gotten the plate from westside AV, and was using swit 8970 batteries. The first few days of shooting were good, but not long after, I would have the 7Q yell at me with yellow in power, and then not be able to record for a varied amount of time. Sometimes it was a few seconds, sometimes only swapping out the battery and putting in a new one, and then alternating. So, voltage issue. I've tried with different batteries with similar results. Official Sonys. The swits. and some no-name ones (mostly use them to power LEDs). Similar results on each.

I tried to trouble shoot with olof, as well as locally, but we weren't able to really find out the problem. At the time, I just dealt with it, and in the fall, picked up the a7s and wasn't really pushing 4k services. But I am now, and its a monster the way I have it now.

I'm not interested in mounting the batteries on the back of the 7Q. To me, that just throws the balance off even more. Using the plate from westside AV, as well as their grip relocate... it was the perfect placement. I would live to achieve something similar, and am open to other plates or ideas to mount like this. I am not certain it's the batteries, the plate, or even the 7Q. At this point, i'm perfectly fine just trying out a new solution that will get it light(er) again, and not have me using the giant power solution on the back. Even though 1 battery seems to last about 2 days of regular shooting.

This was the setup I was happy with, not counting the issues with voltage:

IMG_0229.jpg


Looking for any suggestions. Thanks!
 
A solution to the low voltage of L series batteries is to use BPU series like used in XDcam and the new FS7. The batteries available from Sony Swit and others are 14.8v batteries, I would suggest the 60 WH or bigger batteries for shooting 4K in the Odyssey.

The advantage over these batteries is the plates, batteries and chargers are cheaper and they are lighter than bricks. If you have an FS7 this is a natural way to go, but you may want to think about it even for the FS700.

The problem is that the Odyssey doing 4K or 4K RAW to ProRes and HFR uses a lot more power, as much as 20W, it used to use 12 W when recording HD. CD even reduces the brightness of the Odyssey screen if you have less than, 9V I think, when recording 4K RAW. Higher voltage means more watts available, that is why Bricks work so much better. The 7.4 V batts worked fine before the Odyssey started using more power.

I have these plates and batteries in stock. Anyone can contact me directly if you wish to discuss this solution. The BPU plates can be installed on my L series plates, so contact me if you would like to upgrade.
 
Olof is correct. The main issue we are finding here is a drop in voltage level. There may be plenty of amperage left in the battery, but the chemistry is only letting so much out at a time, hence the lower voltage. We have a cutoff below 6.5v, so when you start off with a 7.2v battery and then draw a lot of power it can get questionable quickly. The BPU batteries are 14.4v batteries, so it takes longer for the voltage to drop, even if the overall delivered power is the same. You're just more efficiently using the battery. Convergent Design also seems a U-series battery plate.
 
I've had the Hawkwoods DV-7QS dual battery plate for a year now and can highly recommend it, never had a problem with it. No drop in screen brightness nor any other issues.
 
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